Cabinet spreader bars & edge tape?


dskogg
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Hey cabinet experts...i am trying to replicate how a cabinet is actually built and replicate in ca.

Chief does not show any structure at top or between drawers and doors...typically a 4" spreader bar is stapled between.

 

Also edge tape is used on face of box and spreader bars to match doors and drawers.

 

How would i achieve both of these things and have it adjust on cabinet resize?

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Hm. Can't say I've ever bothered trying but I'd figure the spreader boards could be done as a custom shelf, since they follow the width of the cabinet.

 

Just tossed together something quick with slabs, replaced the the top separation with a Shelf, specified its thickness, 0" spaced from previous (top).

image.thumb.png.614c36645e5f4692dd7f0c94caf8a35d.png

Seems to work okay.

 

I got nothing for ya on the edging though.

 

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20 minutes ago, TeaTime said:

Hm. Can't say I've ever bothered trying but I'd figure the spreader boards could be done as a custom shelf, since they follow the width of the cabinet.

 

Just tossed together something quick with slabs, replaced the the top separation with a Shelf, specified its thickness, 0" spaced from previous (top).

image.thumb.png.614c36645e5f4692dd7f0c94caf8a35d.png

Seems to work okay.

 

I got nothing for ya on the edging though.

 

how do you replace separation with a shelf?

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1 minute ago, dskogg said:

how do you replace separation with a shelf?

Change it to an Opening, then click the Shelves: Specify button.

 

I just tossed down 2 slabs, 4" wide, spaced 24" front to back and saved it as a Fixture.

image.png.c962e81542807c99c2dc2d1e66c90ea0.png

 

Then on the Shelf Specification, set Manual, number: 1, browse to library and pull that new fixture.

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1 minute ago, TeaTime said:

Change it to an Opening, then click the Shelves: Specify button.

 

I just tossed down 2 slabs, 4" wide, spaced 24" front to back and saved it as a Fixture.

image.png.c962e81542807c99c2dc2d1e66c90ea0.png

 

Then on the Shelf Specification, set Manual, number: 1, browse to library and pull that new fixture.

Thanks, so does the drawer cover the spreader bar when closed?

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OH sure, find the fatal flaw to my brilliant plan, will ya!!

No, no it won't.

image.png.9e6c81147279b5e9b3ab1294b28d42b7.png

If the Separation could be replaced with a fixture object then it would, but being an Opening it's a face item itself so other face items can't overlap it. Or they probably CAN but likely takes some special something.

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This could all be done but it would be pretty gross!

  • The spreader symbol would need to include a face material to represent edge banding.
  • Box construction: Framed
  • Separation: Max. 1/16"
  • Doors and drawers would need to be symbols with 3d offsets. And, if travelling this road, then the drawers should be modeled with a separate component to represent the front member of the drawer box. This type of cabinet construction usually has the drawer faces added to a drawer box.Cabinet Spreader.calibz

image.png

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These are stretchers being discussed here.  Everybody in the biz calls them that.  Base cabinets are built this way, one front and one rear.  But not a sink base, which has a stretcher across its top front, and none on top.

 

It is done as material savings and countertops conceal it all.  I don't understand the point of having Chief do these for us.

 

We use eCabinets software to get our cabinets, sourcing the carcases from the CNC cutter, the fronts from one of the door and drawerbox houses, and hardware from the usual sources.  So cabinets get built on site, typically by the end of the first day.  Then the hanging and installing begins.

 

I did a job for a guy that hadn't done site assembly before, and attached here is just one sequence of about a half dozen, to show him how to assemble.  What makes it tricky is the captured backs of the cabinets.  It seems counterintuitive to fit the back to the top and deck as the first step.  Once you have done one, the other fifteen go fast.

Screenshot 2023-10-20 180439.png

Screenshot 2023-10-20 180457.png

Screenshot 2023-10-20 180514.png

Screenshot 2023-10-20 180526.png

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Its back to representing objects like they are actually built in real life, like trusses and energy heels, took chief quite a while to make this right.

 

Its kind of weird that ca allows us to change the interior of the cabinet without changing the face frame.  I would suggest that any cabinet built in a factory or on a cnc machine would have edge banding on the face to match the doors.  The only cabinets not build this way would be face frame custom cabinets that are painted on site.

 

When I open drawers in chief it should show the spreader bar and the edge material like it is actually built.  

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Just a few quick notes:

  • Some ( maybe most) factory built Cabinets are Face Frame.  Chief quite accurately handles these
  • Frameless Cabinets are different and CA should provide for their differences as noted in the above posts.
  • Not all Face Frame Cabinets are "Painted on Site".  Most are in fact prefinished in the factory.

 

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Joe I have to agree to disagree on most cabinets factory built are face frame. 
can’t build a face frame on a cnc… it would have to be built with solid lumber I would think.

 

in any case there are a **** ton of cabinets that are frameless… faster, cheaper and easy to build.  I think most factory build carcasses use particle board with melamine faces, then edge band.

 

better cabinet companies use plywood to build boxes and then edge tape faces

 

ca is incorrectly showing more than 50% of the cabinets wrong.

 

So it’s not a small amount being shown incorrectly.

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2 hours ago, dskogg said:

Joe I have to agree to disagree on most cabinets factory built are face frame. 
can’t build a face frame on a cnc… it would have to be built with solid lumber I would think.

in any case there are a **** ton of cabinets that are frameless… faster, cheaper and easy to build.  I think most factory build

Hi David,

 

I know of dozens of manufacturers making hi quality face frame cabinets.  Many of them have a presence in Chief's library catalogs.

 

Personally have a distributorship for one Face Frame Cabinet Mfr and all parts (face frames, doors, drawer fronts, box sides, tops, bottoms, backs & shelves) are cut with cnc controls.  Their dimensional accuracy limits are 1/32".  I can put together an order online and get a quote in less than an hour.  Face Frames and Door/Drawers usually are solid lumber pieces but cutting, etc is done with cnc.

 

I do realize that a lot of manufactured cabinets are frameless and I also have access to one of them.  CA does need to provide correct representation of frameless cabinets.

 

 

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On 10/25/2023 at 5:24 PM, dskogg said:

how a cabinet is actually built and replicate in ca

In this case 'ca' could mean Canada, not Chief Architect! @dskogg and I know that a face frame cabinet is beyond extremely rare in Canada. In fact, of all the houses I've been a part of, I've never seen them so I'm not actually sure I believe any of you who say a face frame cabinet is even a real thing. You can make a picture of anything these days so that's not proof!:P

 

Seriously though, they are not the norm in western Canada!

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Did this for someone some years ago but couldn't find it. Here's one way, I already had most of the parts. Didfn't bother to add the custom drawerbox but should give you some ideas. The front side tape might be better done using side panels but this works too. Stretchers are put into the back so you have to adjust them to work with the front.

image.thumb.png.dc6b2179afd3b6cc30d96a07770c14d8.png

 

Personally I wouldn't bother with it. Was a KD for a few decades and never needed this level with anyone (some 2 dozen suppliers) I got cabinets from. If I did on a regular basis I would use a dedicated cabinet program.

I suppose the stretchers could be easy enough if we were allowed to use a custom symbol for separations. I'd rather see time spent elsewhere though- like splitting up front, sides and back in Style Palettes

Stretchers and edge banding.zip

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Chris is right!  In Chief, all of the cabinets really do have face frames.  The frameless cabinets just have a 3/4" face frame that you can see if you turn on "module lines".  Now if they would just make them 1/32" thick we would have edge banding instead.

 

I think I agree with Mark though.  Although you could model a cabinet exactly like you might build it, it's probably not worth all of the extra work.

 

framless cabinets.jpg

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