Chief Architect Software Licensing Changes Beginning January 10, 2023


ChiefArchitect
 Share

Recommended Posts

8 minutes ago, rgardner said:

That very point adds to my point regarding lack of revenue to chief by users who do not help with future development and thus should not reap benefits from it if they are not willing to keep SSA valid for $50 a month...

 

To be fair, users who aren't paying SSA are not reaping the benefits of future development.

 

I have no problem with someone who wants to simply chug along with an older version that they own. But I also see Chief's need to stay profitable, and support that too. 

 

They call stuff like this a "shake-up" for a reason.

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Renerabbitt said:

This decision will benefit me from the development of long awaited feature requests through dependable budgeting for Chief.
This decision will benefit me by thinning my low-budget, undercutting, competition on contract work.


Historical data shows me I am 500% faster than I was in X8...I have reaped benefits through increased margin for years...I don't love financial change, but a bit of pragmatism and a quick glance at your books should sit ones head back on straight.

Also...a good CPA should get you lined up and straightened out :)

 

I agree with Rene. I have used another cad system, Builders Cad, that quit updating their product and basically went out of business. I don't want that to happen again! That forced me to move to and learn another system, Chief Architect. Chief has done a good job of updating its product with new features. Hence I have always been more than happy to pay their SSA fee just to get the new features and libraries. I understand the SSA fees may not be enough to keep the product updates coming. I'm happy to see that Chief is keeping their existing users under their same program of the SSA. If I were a new user I would still buy Chief over any other software.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, Smn842 said:

 

Where have I missed the statement about this?

 

I asked CA directly and was told they couldn't make any statement about SSA pricing levels in future.

 

I've paid for SSA ever since I upgraded from HD Pro to Chief Premier X9 but as a home user not making any profit (or savings) from using Chief my only concern with the new licensing is if SSA pricing rapidly moving towards the subscription cost.

 

No, they're not going to guarantee any future pricing. As far as I've seen, they aren't even guaranteeing that legacy licenses will work forever. Someone said that information would be found in the Software License Agreement (a binding contract) but even though I read it and memorized it, that was eight years ago and I forgot some of the details. :P

 

Does anyone have access to a legacy SLA, or know where to find it on our systems? I looked on mine and couldn't find it...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, lbuttery said:

The point is that a business should be designed to include the cost of the tools required to perform that business.

 

there is many a low-level business that can't afford $200/month

 

Lew

 

EXACTLY. CAD design software from a company that intends to provide a professional tool for professional users cannot accommodate' low-level businesses and it's the low-level businesses that provide Chief with no revenue. Chief has accommodated low-level businesses for far too long and thier business cannot tolerate that user any longer.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, Chrisb222 said:

 

I'll mention the hop-in / hop-out rental option again. Makes sense for folks like that.

This is an amazing option for smaller businesses. If I have a single house to design I can factor in the cost of the rental into the design fees. And if a business can't afford that, again, the business is simply not viable.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 minutes ago, Smn842 said:

 

Where have I missed the statement about this?

 

I asked CA directly and was told they couldn't make any statement about SSA pricing levels in future.

 

I've paid for SSA ever since I upgraded from HD Pro to Chief Premier X9 but as a home user not making any profit (or savings) from using Chief my only concern with the new licensing is if SSA pricing rapidly moving towards the subscription cost.

They have stated this three times in this thread as well as the email sent out.  The SSA price is not going up on Jan 10th...

 

Can you say that in your business three years from now you won't have a need to raise your prices for services offered?  They had to raise SSA last year from $525 to $595 to help defray parts of the costs.  They have stated this year it is not going up.  That is all we can ask for.  Again, their intention as stated several times by them is not to punish their regular clients who use ssa and pay their part to further development.  The issue is too many users who use old versions of the software and expect to not pay for ssa which gives upgrades and that the old version will work forever...  That doesn't work in software.  Never has.  Otherwise you could complain that Windows 3.1 no longer works and how dare windows charge for an upgrade??

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, M-Reed said:

This new pricing structure will, of course, hammer the last coffin nail for the small time users who might do but a few projects due to the current financial situation in the United States and the world.

This might actually be intended as small time users add very little value, in general, to the company

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, lbuttery said:

These are pirated versions

 

No, they are legitimate versions

 

some are pirated - but many are legitimate

 

Lew

No they are not legitimate licenses if chief does not authorize the sale.  It is a breach of the user contract and thus becomes an illegitimate copy same as a pirated copy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 minutes ago, lbuttery said:

The point is that a business should be designed to include the cost of the tools required to perform that business.

 

there is many a low-level business that can't afford $200/month

 

Lew

 

Then argument would lend to using a non professional program such as HD pro, or other drafting program as they are not the demographic that Premier or Interiors is aimed towards.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 minutes ago, Chrisb222 said:

 

No, they're not going to guarantee any future pricing. As far as I've seen, they aren't even guaranteeing that legacy licenses will work forever. Someone said that information would be found in the Software License Agreement (a binding contract) but even though I read it and memorized it, that was eight years ago and I forgot some of the details. :P

 

Does anyone have access to a legacy SLA, or know where to find it on our systems? I looked on mine and couldn't find it...

Yesterday's email to all users states:

"Perpetual (lifetime) software licenses will no longer be sold after this date. This change will not affect your existing software or active Support and Software Assurance (SSA). If your SSA expires, your software will continue to function; however, the SSA will no longer be renewable. To learn more, please see our software licensing FAQ."

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, rgardner said:

Yesterday's email to all users states:

"Perpetual (lifetime) software licenses will no longer be sold after this date. This change will not affect your existing software or active Support and Software Assurance (SSA). If your SSA expires, your software will continue to function; however, the SSA will no longer be renewable. To learn more, please see our software licensing FAQ."

 

Yes, I've read that several times looking for a guarantee that legacy licenses will not stop working. It's implied but not specifically stated.

 

And I found the SLA, using Help search for "license." It also does not mention how long the legacy license lasts. Does that mean forever? Or when Chief decides to deactivate it?

 

End User License Agreement

 

Chief Architect, Inc.

End User Software License Agreement for Chief Architect® Software

 

NOTICE TO USER:

 

PLEASE READ CAREFULLY: THIS IS A CONTRACT. BY INSTALLING, COPYING OR USING THIS SOFTWARE, YOU AGREE TO BE BOUND BY ALL THE TERMS AND CONDITIONS OF THIS LICENSE AGREEMENT, ON YOUR OWN BEHALF AND ON THE BEHALF OF THE ENTITY BY WHOM YOU ARE EMPLOYED OR REPRESENT. IF YOU DO NOT AGREE WITH THE TERMS OF THIS AGREEMENT, DO NOT INSTALL, USE OR COPY THE SOFTWARE. INSTEAD, RETURN THE SOFTWARE WITHIN THE SPECIFIED GUARANTEE PERIOD TO THE PLACE OF PURCHASE FOR A REFUND OF YOUR PURCHASE PRICE.

 

This Chief Architect, Inc. End User License Agreement ("License Agreement", or "EULA") is a legal agreement between you (an individual or entity) and Chief Architect, Inc., and sets forth the terms and conditions under which you are licensed to use the Software. "Software" means (A) all of the contents of the CD-ROM(s), DVD(s), USB drive(s), electronic download, online media, or any other media which is accompanied by this License Agreement, including, but not limited to (i) Chief Architect or third party software, (ii) printed, "online" or electronic explanatory materials ("Documentation"), (iii) Content Libraries, digital images, sample plans, textures, images, symbols, photographs, videos or other artistic works ("Graphical Files"), (B) hardware or software security key, if any, and (C) modified versions, updates, upgrades, downloadable content, additions and copies of the software, if any, licensed to you by Chief Architect, Inc. (collectively, "Updates").

1. GRANT OF LICENSE TO USE SOFTWARE: Chief Architect, Inc. grants you a non-exclusive, non-transferable (except as provided below) license ("License") to use the Software in object code only (and specifically not in source code) subject to the following terms and conditions:

(a)Software: Unless otherwise agreed to in writing, Chief Architect, Inc. grants you the right to use one copy of the Software on only one computer at one location at any one time. This software is licensed for use by you and only you. You may not share your license of this software with any other person, and you agree not to allow any other person to use your license of this software. In order to use this software, each person must purchase their own valid license;

(b)Storage/Network Use: You may store or install the Software on a network server or other storage device only to install and run the Software on an internal network. You must, however, purchase and dedicate a separate license of the Software for each computer and each user of the Software installed or accessed from a network server or other storage device. A single license for the Software may not be shared or used concurrently on different computers;

(c)Backup: You may make a backup copy of the Software for archival purposes. If printed Documentation accompanies the Software, it may not be copied. If the Software is accompanied by Documentation in electronic form, you may print out one (1) copy for your use which, in turn, may not be copied. A copy of the Software must include all copyright notices and this License Agreement;

(d)If you purchase a license of the Software and receive one copy of the Software installer electronically and a second copy on media or by any other means, you own only one license of the Software. The installer on media may be used for archival purposes but may not be transferred to or used by another person. Purchasing backup media does not grant you any right to any enhancement or update to your Software license;

(e)The Student Edition of the Software must be used only by a student for qualified educational purposes only and only while actively studying at a qualified educational institution. The Student Edition of the Software shall not be used for commercial purposes, or any purposes other than academic school projects;

(f)Academic Licenses are licensed for use by educational institutions for educational purposes only. If the Software is licensed as an Academic License and you are not a qualified educational institution using the Software for qualified educational purposes, then your license(s) of the Software are invalid.

2. OTHER RIGHTS AND RESTRICTIONS:

(a)Reverse Engineering: You may not modify, translate, reverse engineer, decompile, disassemble, or modify the Software in any way or use any other method to convert the Software or any component of the Software into human-readable code, create derivative works based upon the Software, Documentation, or Graphical Files or allow anyone else to do so;

(b)Renting: You may not rent out, lease, sub-license, lend, duplicate or distribute the Software, Documentation, or Graphical Files without the prior written consent of Chief Architect, Inc., which, if given, is subject to the transferee's consent to all the terms and conditions of this License Agreement;

(c)Copying: You may not copy or reproduce the Software, Documentation, or Graphical Files (except for personal back-up purposes);

(d)Upgrades: If the Software is being licensed to you as an upgrade, renewal, or update to software previously licensed to you, you must cease using the software previously licensed to you, including any and all copies installed on your computers, once you have successfully installed and commenced use of the upgrade, renewal, or update software. You may not transfer, give away, sell, or loan the software version previously licensed to you to any other person or entity. Any unauthorized attempt to transfer or sell the software previously licensed to you will result in automatic termination of your current software license. You may, however, maintain a copy of the software previously licensed to you for your own archival purposes only;

The Student Edition has a limited timeout period.

(f)Proprietary Notices: You may not remove any proprietary notices or labels from the Software, Documentation, or Graphical Files;

(g)Protection: You may not utilize any computer hardware or software designed to defeat any hardware or software copy-protection device, should the Software be equipped with such protection. You may not disable any copy-protection or security control features of the Software;

(h)Licensing and Authentication: This Software uses security technology and automatic error reporting to authenticate your software installation, system requirements, and protect your license from unauthorized use. You agree to allow the Software to send this security and system information to the Chief Architect security servers for authentication and reporting. You may not disable any such security, licensing, or control features of the Software;

(i)Public Access: You may not copy the Software, Graphical Files, or any component of the Software onto any public network. You may not, in any manner, make it accessible to others, including via internet website, telecommunication transmittal, electronic bulletin board, cloud service, or any other form of electronic distribution system;

(j)Distribution: This Software and all components of the Software are licensed for your use only. You may not share or distribute the Software to any other party or entity. You may share only images, textures, and symbols used by your design with other valid licensed users of the software; however, you may not share or distribute these files or exported versions of these files to any other party or entity for use as library content with other software programs. Use of Chief Architect Graphical Files as library content within other software programs is a violation of this License Agreement.

3. TRANSFERRING YOUR SOFTWARE: This software is licensed to you, and only you. You may not sell, give, donate, rent, transfer, or share this license with any other person or entity. In some cases, certain licenses may be permanently transferred to another individual, but only under the terms and conditions of the then current Chief Architect License Transfer Request Form, and only if the requested license transfer is approved by Chief Architect, Inc. If approved, such permanent transfer will include a fee paid to Chief Architect. To apply for a permanent license transfer, your license must be eligible for transfer. You must agree to the terms and conditions of the License Transfer Request Form and fill out, sign, and return this form to Chief Architect, Inc. for approval. A license transfer fee must also be paid in full prior to any transfer of the software license. This form is available through the Chief Architect, Inc. Customer Service Department. Contact Chief Architect Inc.’s Customer Service prior to any transfer of the software license to determine license transfer eligibility, transfer fees, and to receive the License Transfer Request Form. Chief Architect reserves the right to modify or discontinue its policy of license transfers at any time and for any reason.

4. TITLE: Title, ownership, rights, and intellectual property rights in and to the Software, Documentation, Graphical Files, and any other accompanying materials shall remain with Chief Architect, Inc. or the respective third party. Title, ownership, rights, and intellectual property rights in and to each of the Sample Drawings and any accompanying materials shall remain with each Licensor from whom Chief Architect, Inc. licensed each Sample Drawing and any accompanying materials. Unauthorized copying of the Software, Documentation, Graphical Files, or Sample Drawings, or failure to comply with the foregoing restrictions, will result in the automatic termination of this License Agreement. Unauthorized duplication of the Software, Documentation, Graphical Files, or Sample Drawings constitutes copyright infringement and in the United States is punishable in a federal criminal action by a fine of up to $250,000 and imprisonment of up to five (5) years. In addition, federal civil penalties allow the recovery of actual damages based on the number of unauthorized copies produced or statutory damages of up to $100,000 for willful copyright infringement.

5. THIRD PARTY CONTENT: All trademarks and logos belong to their respective owners. All Graphical Files and Content, including symbols, images, textures, backdrops, text, and videos are the copyright subject matter of Chief Architect, Inc. or third parties. The Graphical Files and Content included with the Software are provided for use with the Software only. You shall not use the Graphical Files or Content included with the Software for any other purpose outside of the Software plan files. You shall not sell or distribute the Graphical Files or Content for any purpose whatsoever. You shall not use the Graphical Files or Content with other software. Chief Architect, Inc. and third party content, symbols, text, or textures shall not be copied, redistributed, or sold separately from the Software. Chief Architect, Inc. and third party product content is provided for representational purposes only. Chief Architect, Inc. and third parties assume no responsibility for any discrepancies between actual product appearance and that represented in the Software, or between actual pricing, characteristics, and specifications, and that mentioned anywhere in the Software or Documentation.

6. MONEY-BACK GUARANTEE PERIOD: The Software has a money-back guarantee for satisfaction. During the money-back guarantee period (the "Guarantee Period") following your first purchase of a license of the Software, you may request to return the Software, Documentation, Security Device (if any), and packaging, along with the original purchase receipt, for a refund of the purchase price, less any applicable shipping fees, taxes, duties, discounts, and rebates paid. Software rental products, backup media, Support & Software Assurance (SSA), 3D Library catalog packs, and mobile apps are excluded from the money-back guarantee period. This money-back guarantee does not apply to license transfers. You agree to contact Chief Architect, Inc. in order to obtain and perform proper return material authorization ("RMA") steps prior to returning the Software. You also agree to uninstall and deactivate the Software and all of its related files and content from your computer prior to returning the product.

If, after returning the Software, Documentation, Security Device (if any), and packaging for a refund, you repurchase any version of the Software again, you are, by the act of repurchasing the Software, acknowledging satisfaction with the Software, and by doing so agree to purchase and keep the Software license permanently without the option to return it for a refund.

7. GRANT OF LICENSE TO USE SAMPLE DRAWINGS: Chief Architect, Inc. has licensed from third parties (the "Licensors") sample drawings that may be included in the Software. These Sample Drawings are provided to you by Chief Architect, Inc. solely for demonstrative and illustrative purposes to help you more quickly learn and better understand the functional capabilities of the Software, and are licensed to you solely for these limited purposes. You may not reproduce, distribute or use these Sample Drawings for any other purpose without the prior written consent of Chief Architect, Inc. and the Licensor(s) from whom these Sample Drawings were licensed by Chief Architect, Inc..

8. LIMITED SOFTWARE WARRANTY: Chief Architect, Inc. warrants that for a period of sixty (60) days from the date of your purchase of a license of the Software as evidenced by an original copy of your receipt, the media upon which the Software is furnished will be free from defects in materials and workmanship under normal use. EXCEPT FOR THE ABOVE EXPRESS LIMITED WARRANTIES, CHIEF ARCHITECT, INC. MAKES NO WARRANTIES AS TO THE SOFTWARE, EXPRESS, IMPLIED, STATUTORY, OR IN ANY COMMUNICATION WITH YOU. CHIEF ARCHITECT, INC. SPECIFICALLY DISCLAIMS ANY OTHER WARRANTY INCLUDING THE IMPLIED WARRANTY OF MERCHANTABILITY OR FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE WITH REGARD TO THE SOFTWARE, AND THE ACCOMPANYING WRITTEN MATERIALS. CHIEF ARCHITECT, INC. DOES NOT WARRANT THAT YOUR USE OF THE SOFTWARE WILL BE UNINTERRUPTED OR THAT THE OPERATION OF THE SOFTWARE WILL BE ERROR-FREE. If this Software license was purchased in the United States, the above exclusions may not apply to you as some states do not allow the exclusion of implied warranties. In addition to the above warranty rights, you may also have other rights, which vary from state to state.

9. CUSTOMER REMEDIES: The entire liability of Chief Architect, Inc. and your exclusive remedy under the warranty provided as to Software set forth above will be, at Chief Architect, Inc.'s sole discretion: (i) to replace the media; (ii) to attempt to correct or work around software media errors, if any; or (iii) if the above remedies are impracticable to refund the license fee you paid, if any, for the Software. The latter remedy is subject to pre-authorized return of the Software, Documentation, Security Device (if any) and packaging to Chief Architect, Inc. or to the Authorized Chief Architect, Inc. Dealer or Reseller from whom the Product was obtained together with an original copy of your receipt.

Repaired, corrected or replaced software media and documentation shall be covered by this limited warranty for the period remaining under the warranty that covered the original Software or, if longer, for thirty (30) days after the date Chief Architect, Inc. shipped the repaired or replaced software media or documentation to you. Only if you inform Chief Architect, Inc. of the problem with the software media or documentation during the applicable warranty period and provide evidence of the date you acquired the Software will Chief Architect, Inc. honor this warranty.

10. NO WARRANTY AS TO THE SAMPLE DRAWINGS, SAMPLE PLANS, LIBRARY CONTENT, OR VIDEOS: CHIEF ARCHITECT, INC. MAKES NO WARRANTY WHATSOEVER AS TO THE SAMPLE DRAWINGS, SAMPLE PLANS, LIBRARY CONTENT, OR TRAINING VIDEOS WHICH ARE PROVIDED TO YOU SOLELY FOR DEMONSTRATIVE AND ILLUSTRATIVE PURPOSES. CHIEF ARCHITECT, INC. MAKES NO WARRANTY THAT THE DIMENSIONS IN THE SAMPLE DRAWINGS, SAMPLE PLANS, LIBRARY CONTENT, OR VIDEOS ARE ACCURATE AND FREE OF DISCREPANCIES. CHIEF ARCHITECT, INC. MAKES NO WARRANTY THAT THE LIBRARY CONTENT, SAMPLE DRAWINGS, OR SAMPLE PLANS COMPLY WITH ANY BUILDING CODES. THE LIBRARY CONTENT, SAMPLE DRAWINGS, AND SAMPLE PLANS ARE PROVIDED TO YOU "AS IS," AND CHIEF ARCHITECT, INC. AND THE LICENSORS OF THE LIBRARY CONTENT, SAMPLE DRAWINGS, AND SAMPLE PLANS DISCLAIM ANY AND ALL WARRANTIES WITH RESPECT TO THE LIBRARY CONTENT, SAMPLE DRAWINGS, AND SAMPLE PLANS, WHETHER EXPRESS OR IMPLIED OR ARISING BY CUSTOM OR TRADE USAGE, AND, SPECIFICALLY, MAKE NO WARRANTY OF MERCHANTABILITY OR FITNESS FOR ANY PARTICULAR PURPOSE.

11. DISCLAIMER AND LIMITATION OF LIABILITY: COMPUTER-AIDED DESIGN SOFTWARE AND OTHER TECHNICAL SOFTWARE ARE TOOLS INTENDED TO BE USED BY TRAINED AND EXPERIENCED INDIVIDUALS ONLY. THEY ARE NOT SUBSTITUTES FOR YOUR TRAINED, EXPERIENCED AND PRACTICAL JUDGMENT. COMPUTER-AIDED DESIGN SOFTWARE AND OTHER TECHNICAL SOFTWARE ARE INTENDED TO ASSIST WITH ARCHITECTURAL, PREMISES OR PRODUCT DESIGN AND ARE NOT SUBSTITUTES FOR INDEPENDENT TESTING OF STRUCTURAL INTEGRITY, ENGINEERING, SOUNDNESS, SAFETY, AND UTILITY. DUE TO THE LARGE VARIETY OF POTENTIAL APPLICATIONS FOR THE SOFTWARE, THE SOFTWARE HAS NOT BEEN TESTED IN ALL SITUATIONS UNDER WHICH IT MAY BE USED. CHIEF ARCHITECT, INC. SHALL NOT BE LIABLE IN ANY MANNER WHATSOEVER FOR THE RESULTS OBTAINED THROUGH THE USE OF THE SOFTWARE. PERSONS USING THE SOFTWARE ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE SUPERVISION, MANAGEMENT AND CONTROL OF THE SOFTWARE AND THEIR EMPLOYEES OR CONTRACTORS WHO USE THE SOFTWARE. THIS RESPONSIBILITY INCLUDES, BUT IS NOT LIMITED TO, THE DETERMINATION OF APPROPRIATE USES FOR THE SOFTWARE AND THE SELECTION OF THE SOFTWARE AND OTHER PROGRAMS TO ACHIEVE INTENDED RESULTS. PERSONS USING THE SOFTWARE ARE ALSO RESPONSIBLE FOR ESTABLISHING THE ADEQUACY OF INDEPENDENT PROCEDURES FOR TESTING THE RELIABILITY AND ACCURACY OF ANY PROGRAM OUTPUT, INCLUDING ALL ITEMS DESIGNED OR MEASURED BY USING THE SOFTWARE.

UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES WILL CHIEF ARCHITECT, INC., ITS DEALERS, RESELLERS, DISTRIBUTORS, OR THE LICENSORS OF THE GRAPHICAL FILES, SAMPLE DRAWINGS, AND SAMPLE PLANS BE LIABLE FOR ANY DAMAGES, WHETHER ARISING FROM TORT OR CONTRACT, INCLUDING LOSS OF DATA, LOST PROFITS, COST OF COVER, OR OTHER SPECIAL, INCIDENTAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR INDIRECT DAMAGES ARISING OUT OF THE USE OR INABILITY TO USE THE SOFTWARE, DOCUMENTATION, GRAPHICAL FILES, OR THE SAMPLE DRAWINGS AND SAMPLE PLANS. CHIEF ARCHITECT, INC., ITS DEALERS, RESELLERS, DISTRIBUTORS, AND THE LICENSORS OF THE GRAPHICAL FILES, SAMPLE DRAWINGS, AND SAMPLE PLANS ASSUME NO LIABILITY OR RESPONSIBILITY FOR, AMONG OTHER THINGS, INADVERTENT DISCREPANCIES, CONSTRUCTION INTERPRETATIONS OR CONSTRUCTED RESULTS. THESE LIMITATIONS WILL APPLY EVEN IF CHIEF ARCHITECT, INC., ITS DEALERS, RESELLERS, DISTRIBUTORS, OR THE LICENSORS OF THE GRAPHICAL FILES, SAMPLE DRAWINGS, AND SAMPLE PLANS HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGE. YOU ACKNOWLEDGE THAT THE LICENSE FEE REFLECTS THIS ALLOCATION OF RISK. FURTHER, IN NO EVENT SHALL THE LIABILITY OF CHIEF ARCHITECT, INC., ITS DEALERS, RESELLERS, DISTRIBUTORS, AND THE LICENSORS OF THE GRAPHICAL FILES, SAMPLE DRAWINGS, AND SAMPLE PLANS UNDER ANY PROVISION OF THIS AGREEMENT EXCEED THE LICENSE FEE PAID TO CHIEF ARCHITECT, INC. FOR THE SOFTWARE, DOCUMENTATION, GRAPHICAL FILES, AND THE SAMPLE DRAWINGS AND SAMPLE PLANS. BECAUSE SOME STATES DO NOT ALLOW THE EXCLUSION OR LIMITATION OF LIABILITY FOR CONSEQUENTIAL OR INCIDENTAL DAMAGES, THE ABOVE LIMITATION MAY NOT APPLY TO YOU.

12. TERMINATION: This license shall terminate automatically if you fail to comply with the terms, conditions, and limitations described in this license. No notice shall be required from Chief Architect, Inc. to effectuate such termination. Upon termination, you must immediately uninstall and deactivate the Software. You must also return or destroy all copies of the Software and Documentation.

13. U.S. GOVERNMENT RESTRICTED RIGHTS: The Software and Documentation are provided with RESTRICTED RIGHTS for U.S. Government customers. Use, duplication or disclosure by the Government is subject to restrictions as set forth in subparagraph (c)(1 )(ii) of The Rights in Technical Data and Computer Software clause at DFARS 252.227-7013 or subparagraphs (c)(i) and (2) of the Commercial Computer Software-Restricted Rights at 48 CFR 52.227-19 as applicable. The manufacturer is Chief Architect, Inc., 6500 N. Mineral Dr., Coeur d'Alene, Idaho 83815.

14. GOVERNING LAW: This License Agreement shall be governed by the laws of the State of Idaho without regard to conflicts of law principles. This License Agreement shall not be governed by the United Nations Convention of Contracts for the International Sale of Goods, the application of which is hereby expressly excluded. If either you or Chief Architect, Inc. employs attorneys to enforce any right arising out of this Agreement, the prevailing party shall be entitled to recover reasonable attorney's fees and costs.

15. ENTIRE AGREEMENT: This agreement constitutes the complete and exclusive agreement between you and Chief Architect, Inc. with respect to the subject matter hereof and supersedes all prior oral or written understandings, communications or agreements not specifically incorporated herein. This agreement may not be modified except in a writing duly signed by an authorized representative of Chief Architect, Inc. and you. THE ACCEPTANCE OF ANY PURCHASE ORDER PLACED BY YOU IS EXPRESSLY MADE CONDITIONAL ON YOUR CONSENT TO THE TERMS SET FORTH HEREIN.

Chief Architect, Inc, 2022

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 hours ago, rgardner said:

Then argument would lend to using a non professional program such as HD pro, or other drafting program as they are not the demographic that Premier or Interiors is aimed towards.

 

That is what I am thinking. If someone cannot justify the cost because they are not using it enough for professional work, then why don't they use HDPro? And how do people stay proficient in such a capable but complicated software.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, Chrisb222 said:

I've read that several times looking for a guarantee that legacy licenses will not stop working. It's implied but not specifically stated.

Because they cannot predict that you will have a computer that will 100% be alive 50 years from now with an old OS that is capable of running that version of the software.  Otherwise someone would say in 10 years.  Hey my version x4 stopped working because of windows 2032 wont run it...  I want a version for free because you stated we will always be able to use this legacy license...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Chrisb222 said:

For me personally, should I opt out of SSA at some point I'll simply keep an older system running, to avoid OS obsolescence. I've done it before with other software.

 

Not a bad approach.  There's a reason thousands and thousands of companies are still using Windows XP.  Its exactly this situation.  They either can't get newer software that does what they need, or upgrading would be too cost prohibitive. 

  • Upvote 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have stayed quiet on this but in all honesty, I simply don't see the issue. I use Chief daily, make a very, very good living with it. Even if my SSA goes to $2k/yr at some point, I am in. I can't imagine leaving now and starting over after almost 20 years with this software. 

 

Now, what I do see is this. Chief Premier is, in my opinion, a professional grade architectural software, and should be priced as such. I think what this model will eliminate are the DIY'ers that ****** it up and do a project and move on. There is a Home Designer product line for those folks. If this change brings more professionals on board, I'm good with that. For at least the last decade I have felt that there could be a huge, untapped market for Chief with more design professionals. Residential architects and designers that are looking for a more residential friendly package will now see a package wrapped accordingly, rather than seeing John and Jane Doe soliciting for help cleaning up their mess because they got in over their heads. Is Revit ripe with DIY'ers that think this job is easy?

 

Just my thoughts. 

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

26 minutes ago, rgardner said:

Because they cannot predict that you will have a computer that will 100% be alive 50 years from now with an old OS that is capable of running that version of the software.  

 

Of course. When I said "stop working" I meant due to the license having been deactivated. The software requires periodic validation over the internet or it will "stop working." Have they guaranteed us they won't simply decommission legacy licenses at some future point, in order to completely close out the "ownership" model??

 

No one would expect a software program to continue working indefinitely on newer hardware/OS, that's absurd.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, Chrisb222 said:

 

Of course. When I said "stop working" I meant due to the license having been deactivated. The software requires periodic validation over the internet or it will "stop working." Have they guaranteed us they won't simply decommission legacy licenses at some future point, in order to completely close out the "ownership" model??

 

No one would expect a software program to continue working indefinitely on newer hardware/OS.

Yes they have said "

 

55 minutes ago, rgardner said:

This change will not affect your existing software or active Support and Software Assurance (SSA). If your SSA expires, your software will continue to function; however, the SSA will no longer be renewable.

"

It is stated there that it will continue to operate.  That is their "statement"

 

2 minutes ago, Chrisb222 said:

No one would expect a software program to continue working indefinitely on newer hardware/OS.

But many people now a days are very litigious and would try to take advantage of a blanket statement saying "we guarantee you will always have use of your legacy license".  Those type of users who would hold them to that are what they unfortunately have to protect against.

 

This is really all that I am going to say about this as I feel it has been beaten into the ground.

 

Summary of all.  If you are a professional user and use chief to make a living with your business you 100% know that SSA is worth it and you will continue to work forward with chief.  If you are a part time user or hobbyist and not paying ssa now then you can still use your old license as long as your OS will support it.  If not then they have given a pretty good alternative.  Pay $200 for a month to use the program for your occasional project and consider that a cost of the project and price it accordingly.  Premier and Interiors are professional products not a DIY product.  The professional users who pay ssa understand that chief needs to be able to continue to grow or it will die.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 minutes ago, joey_martin said:

Residential architects and designers that are looking for a more residential friendly package will now see a package wrapped accordingly, rather than seeing John and Jane Doe soliciting for help cleaning up their mess because they got in over their heads. Is Revit ripe with DIY'ers that think this job is easy?

I think that sums it up.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, M-Reed said:

Chief was originally focused on builders and home owners. this forum once catered to such and was like a big family for several years. ART became Chief Architect Inc. and hired a new CEO and the focus seemed to gradually switch over to Architects and other "professionals" over the builders and homeowners.

Just a wild hunch..
More professional tools are coming to further divide the home designer line and the premier line. I would guess that the home designer line will be sufficient for almost all of the hobbyists and occasional tradesmen. 

I lost a project to a hobbyist last year, no more.
You want me to compile your home designer project in premier, great, can do for you, win win.
Maybe what I have always wanted for this industry is coming true...collaboration. Absolutely zero reason why you shouldn't hire someone like @M-Reed or @ericepv or @rgardner of the world where the cost-benefit creates additional margin and your timelines are increased in a market short on reputable and accessible designers.

Does the 12-project-a-year intermediate drafter need 20% improvement that an intermediate technician might realize in speed from the premier line...No. Use the HD line, its priced accordingly

 

Want the best, pay for it, same as any other product

Will I need to repair models done by other technicians overselling their services..yes, but not as often.

Looking forward to seeing the user base get more serious. Let's advocate for change. The industry could use an overhaul and I am happy to be more distinguished from the casual user.

Funding for the premier line, from my understanding, opinion and perspective comes in part from the sales of the home designer line that moves a lot of units per year. This is a troubled model for business, a few steps away from robbing Peter to pay Paul. This means that Chief has always operated solely on historical data for development, knowing what they could roughly afford, as opposed to hard numbers for their consumer base.

Chief is going to need info and demographic sales numbers + more to develop cloud computing, AI, instancing and proxies, polycrunching, BIM and more if they intend to stay relevant, and if you have followed anything in the development industry..this is no small task. Thus far they have relied on infrastructure similar to an established SDK, or maybe related to open source forking etc. This software is becoming more specialized, so they will need more funding for development as we move through this decade into web3.0 and Metaworlds. 
This announcement is a small hiccup in the automation that is to come.
 

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I posted on Nov 30th "Cull the litter" I apologized then as I thought I was being too harsh - who knew. Chief has answered my concerns and for that my sincere thanks. I do wish they could keep a card on file for auto renewal but until then - my responsibility... I agree completely with Joey, Ryan and Rene et al  I always wonder and am usually frustrated by users as Joey so eloquently and accurately described. This is a professional system and I wish the marketing better differentiated it from HD. Chief is an excellent tool ergo I've used it for 28 years. How the "occasional" user can work it IDK I can't remember the last set of plans I drew that didn't have a WTF moment - usually self-inflicted occasionally a work around but as my father used to say " that's why they call it work" As I try to explain to the above mentioned user buying TurboTax does not make you an accountant. Home and / or remodeling design is a craft that takes time to learn and even more time to master. There is no substitute for experience. To the speed Rene mentions -  that is absolutely correct but for me and equally or more important is the quality of plans I can produce - Kaisen made easy!

I've tempered my thoughts from Nov 30. Maybe it was broke and this is a needed fix.

To Chief Architect and all the wonderful people who make it happen Thank You and Merry Christmas

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

This is very sad news. I was pointing the SSA advantages to my students when comparing with the other drawing softwares. The lower price was more affordable for young people that start in life. Now that the SSA is not a point anymore what would be the advantage for them to learn another software than the one they studied at school?

 

I think it is important to target young clients since they are still experimenting with new software. Once they made their mind and get used to another software, they won't be as willing to spend time in learn something else. It will be more difficult to convince them to change for Chief Architect. So if the price is not a point anymore, they will stay with what the already know.

 

I hope, no I beg Chief Architect to change their mind and keep the SSA for the new subscriptions. This would keep CA in an advantageous position compare to other drawing software.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 11/30/2022 at 4:23 PM, havard said:

 

Good thing I'm still within the 30 day money back period. Will be getting a refund tomorrow.

 

As a follow up, I do want to say that Chief is the easiest company I have dealt with on getting a refund. Hopefully all this rental nonsense works out for them and anyone that's a customer. And none of that changes the fact that it's still the best product at what it does.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, joey_martin said:

I think what this model will eliminate are the DIY'ers that ****** it up and do a project and move on. There is a Home Designer product line for those folks.

 

There should be some clarification of "DIY'er" here.

 

I am a DIY/home/hobby user and bought Chief Premier and years of SSA so I can experiment with ideas for a number of projects for my home and the previous ones before that.   None of this work deprives the companies that I eventually employ for kitchen, bathroom, extensions etc from revenue or gives them work to fix as they do their design work from scratch around the ideas I've considered which actually makes their life easier.

 

Over nearly 4 decades as I moved from home to home I've found it difficult to plan renovations over 5 to 6 year periods with various contractors and this had lead to rework of electrics, plumbing etc (in all but my first home where I did all the work myself).  Using Chief enables me to visualise lots of potential changes and show renderings to companies of what I hope to achieve whilst enabling to me make them aware of how projects down the line that could be impacted or depend on their work.

 

I used HD Pro for two years before its limitations became too significant and upgraded to Premier (some due to UK construction differences). As my day job is software I am in favour of subscription and am happy to pay SSA to support Chief.  I am not the target user of the software but that doesn't mean I shouldn't care about a significant investment in Chief, both time and money possibly coming to and end due to SSA increasing to rental levels.

 

Hopefully SSA increases more in line with general prices and I can remain a user as I don't fancy going back to Revit. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Please sign in to comment

You will be able to leave a comment after signing in



Sign In Now
 Share