X15 Roof Trusses

[Chrisb222]

59 minutes ago, Alaskan_Son said:

Auto populates with 12" for me.  My guess is that it has something to do with the template you're using and how it may have been modified in the past. I believe that setting just remembers the last value you typed in there.

 

As I said, that was using the OOB Residential Template. I have never modified it. And I can't get a new plan to "remember" a different setting from a previous plan. Within a session, yes, changing back and forth from trusses to rafters and back to trusses, it remembers whatever you typed in. But anytime I check "trusses" on a new plan it defaults to 30"

 

At any rate, 12" also seems like an odd default value.

 

18 minutes ago, Alaskan_Son said:

Most notably, the VSD would change with any changes to the pitch of any given roof plane.  In particular, this would become a big problem wherever roof pitches were being controlled independently using Wall Directives. 

 

I was thinking about how Chief would handle that earlier when I was away from my computer. It seems the program will apply the Heel Height setting to the lowest pitched plane, then auto adjust the other heels to keep the same eave height (when checked). Interesting, because I don't see that the software provides the heel height of the steeper pitched plane...

 

 

[Kbird1]

53 minutes ago, SNestor said:

Yes...it's a computer program that knows the VSD when you set the top chord parameter in your defaults. I think the software should default to this as the heel height...and allow us to change it as needed. But - alas, I may be in the minority. 

 

Nope... I am with you on this..........

 

1 hour ago, Alaskan_Son said:

 

Auto populates with 12" for me.  My guess is that it has something to do with the template you're using and how it may have been modified in the past. I believe that setting just remembers the last value you typed in there.

 

It's 30" for me too , and is the Same in Chief's Default X15 Template..... so perhaps you are right about it remembering the Last setting Used in your Template?

 

26 minutes ago, Alaskan_Son said:

What I think Steve EVERYONE would need to solve his problem is an Automatic Heel Height checkbox. 

 

Yes Please

 

M.

 

 

[DRAWZILLA]

The new truss tools are so much better than before. All you have to do is set the heel height now and auto build, what extra is that, a couple seconds to set the heel height. overall you save a lot more than that to do a truss roof. I don't mind it at all, just part of the setup.

[Kbird1]

58 minutes ago, DRAWZILLA said:

All you have to do is set the heel height now

 

I don't think even that should be necessary, and as Steve Showed it is gong to be an Issue for many , the VSD should now be the minimum Heel Height now, so that Chief isn't Auto-building incorrectly ( which will confuse many - i.e. "why is there a little slope on my ceiling?" ) and thinking about it earlier it would be nice to also have a Minimum Heel Height setting (a Default) that Users can set per their Local Code Height (Insulation min.depth) required by local Truss Builders.

 

M.

[GeneDavis]

 

And the VSD of course changes when the top chord size is changed.  I do a lot of big overhangs, and the trusses often are built with 2x6 or 2x8 top chords at the tails, sometimes with the top chords segmented, only the tail plus the first run to a web that size, the rest 2x4.

[Chrisb222]

1 hour ago, Kbird1 said:

the VSD should now be the minimum Heel Height now, so that Chief isn't Auto-building incorrectly ( which will confuse many - i.e. "why is there a little slope on my ceiling?" ) 

 

I agree the minimum should default to the VSD, I can't imagine a proper truss having a lesser heel height. But I don't think the program would default to zero?? causing a sloped ceiling. Just thinking out loud ...

 

Interesting that the template defaults to 30"!! 

 

Edit: and thanks for confirming it does for you too.

[Chrisb222]

2 hours ago, DRAWZILLA said:

The new truss tools are so much better than before. All you have to do is set the heel height now and auto build, what extra is that, a couple seconds to set the heel height. overall you save a lot more than that to do a truss roof. I don't mind it at all, just part of the setup.

 

True, but the heel is often going to match the VSD so that would be the natural default IMO making it automatic in many cases.

[Kbird1]

10 minutes ago, Chrisb222 said:

But I don't think the program would default to zero?? causing a sloped ceiling. Just thinking out loud ...

 

I was thinking that for most people, they will do exactly like Steve did and input the old default of 0",  the 1st time they see the Default is 30" ( Idaho min. Height?) thinking it was a error or bug in X15.

 

M.

[SHCanada2]

1 hour ago, Chrisb222 said:

 

I agree the minimum should default to the VSD, I can't imagine a proper truss having a lesser heel height.

a gable end truss would have zero heel as it would need room for the outlookers. but it also cant have tails so what CA draws is incorrect. but in theory if I set the overhang to 0 (or close to), one could get the lowest possible height of a building by having a zero heel height

 

[Alaskan_Son]

1 hour ago, Chrisb222 said:

Interesting that the template defaults to 30"!! 

 

Like I said, it just remembers that last value you typed in there...well at least the last value that was used.  To get a different value by default:

1. Open your Template Plan
2. Open your roof settings
3. Set the Framing Method to Trusses
4. Change the Heel Height to the desired value
5. Click Okay.  This alone should change the default value; however if you would like to leave Rafters as the default...
6. Open your roof setting back up and set the Framing Method to Rafters
7. Save the changes to your Template Plan.

Next time you start a New Plan, you should be able to open up your roof settings, check trusses, and the heel height should be your desired value.

[Chrisb222]

1 hour ago, Kbird1 said:

( Idaho min. Height?) 

 

Hmm, good point. It do gets cold there 

[TeaTime]

4 hours ago, Alaskan_Son said:

What I think Steve would need to solve his probelm is an Automatic Heel Height checkbox. 

At first skimming this thread I was thinking "this is a wild thing to complain about! "why do I have to enter a heel height?"?? The fact that we CAN now is amazing!" but I totally agree it would be good to have the option to automatically sync to the VSD. Would sure save a lotta time.

 

Though, still, manually transposing a value is so much better than having to do the math myself.

[Chrisb222]

15 minutes ago, SHCanada2 said:

a gable end truss would have zero heel as it would need room for the outlookers. but it also cant have tails so what CA draws is incorrect. 

 

Here the gable end truss has the exact same envelope as the commons. The only difference is they include sidewall framing.

[Chrisb222]

8 minutes ago, Alaskan_Son said:

Like I said, it just remembers that last value you typed in there...

 

Like I said, I was using the factory OOB Residential Template with no changes.

 

8 minutes ago, Alaskan_Son said:

To get a different value by default:

1. Open your Template Plan
2. Open your roof settings
3. Set the Framing Method to Trusses
4. Change the Heel Height to the desired value
5. Click Okay.  This alone should change the default value; however if you would like to leave Rafters as the default...
6. Open your roof setting back up and set the Framing Method to Rafters
7. Save the changes to your Template Plan.

Next time you start a New Plan, you should be able to open up your roof settings, check trusses, and the heel height should be your desired value.

 

Yes, I went over that briefly several posts ago. But thanks for spelling out the steps.

 

9 hours ago, Chrisb222 said:

it can easily be programmed into your template. This is a test template saved as such, opened and go directly to the Build Roof DBX:

 

[Alaskan_Son]

32 minutes ago, Chrisb222 said:

Yes, I went over that briefly several posts ago. But thanks for spelling out the steps.

 

Do you mean this:

 

5 hours ago, Chrisb222 said:

And I can't get a new plan to "remember" a different setting from a previous plan. Within a session, yes, changing back and forth from trusses to rafters and back to trusses, it remembers whatever you typed in. But anytime I check "trusses" on a new plan it defaults to 30"

 

...because I've spelled out how you can get a NEW plan to use a new default. 

[SHCanada2]

4 hours ago, Chrisb222 said:

The only difference is they include sidewall framing.

what might that be?

 

we frame like this, at least that is what i have seen

[GeneDavis]

Sidewall framing probably means attached "ladders" which some truss plants will build.  My work is an a zone with 100 psf GSL and it gets done if gable o'hangs are a foot or less.

 

You all with those minimum heel heights must be building where ceiling insulation isn't important.  We've got to go R50 now, and that takes some overhead.

[SHCanada2]

44 minutes ago, GeneDavis said:

You all with those minimum heel heights must be building where ceiling insulation isn't important

detached garages do not require insulation as they are unheated (95% of the time)

[Chrisb222]

10 hours ago, SHCanada2 said:

what might that be?

 

Here the gable end truss will have vertical stud framing @24" OC just like in your pic. Unless it's a structural gable, then it will have the same structural webbing as the commons, with added studs puzzled into the webs.

 

The overhang is stick-built after the gable truss is sheeted.

[CAmichael240114]

Quote

Next time you start a New Plan, you should be able to open up your roof settings, check trusses, and the heel height should be your desired value.

This is only true if the VSD and the roof pitch remains the same.

Greater truss spans may require the top and bottom chord to have a greater depth.

Steeper roof pitches increases the depth of the top chord.

Therefore the heal height would be different in each case as the VSD increases or decreases.

Standard trusses are not specified as having a heel height.

[Alaskan_Son]

10 minutes ago, CAmichael240114 said:

This is only true if the VSD and the roof pitch remains the same.

Greater truss spans may require the top and bottom chord to have a greater depth.

Steeper roof pitches increases the depth of the top chord.

Therefore the heal height would be different in each case as the VSD increases or decreases.

Standard trusses are not specified as having a heel height.

 

My statements had nothing to do with getting the correct value.  I was just spelling out how to get a default value other than the 30" value some of the guys said they seemed to be stuck with. 

[CAmichael240114]

Michael, no offence  meant, just trying to say that when a standard truss is set with standard settings and placed in the plan it should not have an energy heal or raised heal. 

[BBoumaConst]

We always do energy heel trusses so I love this new feature. It makes it a lot easier to get close to the actual truss drawings. R-50 attic insulation is the code here so it's pretty hard to achieve that without a higher heel height. 12" is our standard. Here's a typical truss design for us. 

[Kbird1]

On 5/10/2023 at 2:22 PM, CAmichael240114 said:

 just trying to say that when a standard truss is set with standard settings and placed in the plan it should not have an energy heal or raised heal. 

 

This is one of the Reasons I thought the Heel Hgt. should default to the VSD , as there are many places where a Heel Hgt. is not needed , ie warmer Climes world wide.

 

M.

[Dougak]

I designed trusses for 15 years, and heel height is 1 number they always ask, we used 11.25 so framers could block with 2x12.  I hated chief going from a truss designer to chief... I will have to say I Love the new truss program. Yes 30" is crazy, That is what you would need for a parallel cord truss. Here in Alaska we need the ventilation and insulation so minimum is 11 1/4, t2x6 top, 2x6 bottom... I am far from mastering the roof buy thumbs up to chief.