SchnieppDesign Posted March 11, 2017 Share Posted March 11, 2017 This looks like a bug to me. Anyone else having this problem with scissor trusses? John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneDavis Posted March 11, 2017 Share Posted March 11, 2017 Try editing the truss envelope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SchnieppDesign Posted March 11, 2017 Author Share Posted March 11, 2017 The envelope looks good. Here's the plan Miller Deck.plan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SchnieppDesign Posted March 11, 2017 Author Share Posted March 11, 2017 Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan_Son Posted March 11, 2017 Share Posted March 11, 2017 Hey John, here's a quick video... 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chopsaw Posted March 11, 2017 Share Posted March 11, 2017 Thanks for the video Michael. Was asking tech support about this just the other day. I just fixed a truckload of trusses in no time with your help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RL-inc Posted March 12, 2017 Share Posted March 12, 2017 Great video Michael. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CJSpud Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 Michael: Very informative ... great technique for editing trusses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShaneK Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 I lock truss envelope after modifications. I'm using truss company viewing software right now on 34,000 ft house project and they didn't want anything to do with castle roof over great room. So Chief did it for me, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pintodesign Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 Thank you Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dshall Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 The rebuttal vid....... how do people make there vids so short? PART 1 PART 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan_Son Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 Hey Scott, thank you for the thoughtful rebuttal but it wasn't actually me who recommended the ceiling planes need to be built to the outside. That was Eric... On 3/11/2017 at 7:31 AM, solver said: Chief wants ceiling planes to be drawn like roof planes, starting over the outside of the wall. I actually build them to the inside face of the wall all the time too so you'll get no argument from me. What I pretty much never do however is check Trusses (no birdsmouth). Truthfully, if you get all the settings right you can get the trusses to build correctly using any one of the 4 methods but again, I pretty much always build ceilings to the inside face myself. The point of my video however was only to show how to manually modify those trusses to fix little auto framing glitches Chief throws at us from time to time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dshall Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 5 minutes ago, Alaskan_Son said: .........What I pretty much never do however is check Trusses (no birdsmouth). ......... I think it is important to either check or not check the truss(no birds mouth option), this is important in determining where the roof base line is located. I think I proved that in the vid. It does make a difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dshall Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 I added part 2 to post #13. Not a great vid, but there is some meat on the bone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dshall Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 9 minutes ago, Alaskan_Son said: .......... I actually build them to the inside face of the wall all the time too so you'll get no argument from me. ........... Yeah, you and I are in agreement, so why does CA say we should build on exterior face? Do they do things differently in God's Country? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe_Carrick Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 I'm not an expert on Scissor Trusses - but I'm pretty sure that "No Birdsmouth" should cause the Ceiling to be higher than the Top of the Plate - and "With Birdsmouth" should make it match the Top of Plate. The critical thing is to get all that set up (figured out and coordinated) before creating the Ceiling Planes & Trusses. I think Chief's recommendation of creating the Ceiling Plane at the outside of the wall is only appropriate for "No Birdsmouth". Otherwise the Ceiling Planes should be at the inside of the wall. IMO "No Birdsmouth" is the better way to build Trusses and there should be added plate support (ripped to match bottom chord slope). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan_Son Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 1 hour ago, dshall said: I added part 2 to post #13. Not a great vid, but there is some meat on the bone. With regard to reshaping the truss envelope. That is a perfectly good and valid solution for many cases, but if you look at the plan I was messing with, the truss envelope was already in the correct shape. The problem was with Chief not properly trimming some of the members. Also, I'm going to make another video here in a bit clarifying some things about Ceiling Plane location and Trusses (no birdsmouth) settings. I think there is a lot of misunderstanding in this area that could use some clarification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glennw Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 3 hours ago, dshall said: Yeah, you and I are in agreement, so why does CA say we should build on exterior face? Do they do things differently in God's Country? I believe that Chiefs recommends building ceiling planes to the outside of main layer (under normal circumstances) is because the framing will then build over the main layer and have something to sit on. Users should be aware that whether you draw the ceiling plane over the inside or outside of the main layer will make a difference to the height of the ceiling plane. A ceiling plane drawn to the outside of the main layer will be higher at any point than one drawn to the inside of the main layer. This height difference is the distance specified as the Automatic Birdsmouth Cut height reported when Trusses (No Birdsmouth) is unchecked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan_Son Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 I think the truth is that as long as you understand what the various settings are doing and set them appropriately that you can get the EXACT same results with the ceiling drawn to the inside or outside and with Trusses (no birdsmouth) checked or unchecked. Here's part 1... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan_Son Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 ...and part 2... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan_Son Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 6 hours ago, dshall said: Yeah, you and I are in agreement, so why does CA say we should build on exterior face? Do they do things differently in God's Country? I'm not sure what exactly their reasoning is. I do think it would be well worth your time to watch the 2 videos I posted above though. Once you really understand what all those settings are doing I think you'll agree that there is no right or wrong way and that we can achieve IDENTICAL results using any one of the 4 methods you mentioned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glennw Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 Quote Yeah, you and I are in agreement, so why does CA say we should build on exterior face? Do they do things differently in God's Country? I'm not sure what exactly their reasoning is Michael & Scott, The reason is not quite obvious when you are dealing with trusses. Trusses build from back of sub fascia to back of sub fascia. The reason becomes more obvious when building the same geometry without trusses. As I said in a previous post, the framing will only build to the edge of the ceiling plane. If you draw your ceiling plane to outside of the main wall layer, Chief will frame the ceiling over the wall. If you draw your ceiling plane to inside of the main wall layer, that's where the framing will build to - obviously incorrect. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glennw Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 Ceiling drawn from inside Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dshall Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 23 minutes ago, glennw said: Ceiling drawn from inside I agree, ceiling drawn inside is correct. Eric just proved it with pic. If drawn on outside, the slope of ceiling starts higher than top plate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dshall Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 I tried to do a vid to dispute Michael's claim that it is not important to predefine whether it is conventional frame or a truss system. I could not do a good vid, but I think it is important to predefine whether truss or conventional prior to building roof or ceiling plane. Michael and I should get together on a GTM to thrash this out. Great topic to discuss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Please sign in to comment
You will be able to leave a comment after signing in
Sign In Now