Chief Architect Software Licensing Changes Beginning January 10, 2023

[lbuttery]

they are not legitimate licenses if chief does not authorize the sale

 

Yet, CA was authorizing the transfer of the license 

if it was a legitimate license

 

I know people who bought a version from Ebay and paid the transfer fee

as authorized by CA

 

Lew

[lbuttery]

Then argument would lend to using a non professional program 

 

precisely the point being made

 

CA will lose many low level users that could become high volume users over time

 

Lew

 

[lbuttery]

Another big drawback is HDPro only does a 18"x24" Layout page!  Big houses at 1/4 don't fit   

 

do them at 1/8 scale and then enlarge at the print shop for 36 x 48

 

Lew

[Northriver]

I do not think Chief is going to gain too much by going to a subscription based software. The people with SSA will continue to pay the yearly fee so no gain there. They already have a rental version and the subscription version will just replace the rental version at the same price. Where is the increase in revenue coming from? Are they hoping for new users? I think this could force new and the existing customers who do not have current SSA to stop and start their subscriptions on an as need basis in this current housing environment. With all of the different options available out there they will have to market really hard to drive customers to Chief Architect to increase revenue.

[tpeck23]

I get it. The thing is this to me. I can keep paying my SSA until something bad happens and I can't. At that point I will have whatever version that is to rebuild my business.  If you are small time you can rent the program for 200.00 that month. add that to your cost for that particular project and Todd's your uncle. I hope Chief can continue and really amp up the features that I crave. I was so excited to come from Datacad to this that I couldn't even stand it. I would not have picked up an additional revenue stream for modeling if I were still stuck in that mostly 2d world.  There is a huge amount of arrogance from those on here making money though that aren't really listening to what some of the other users have to say. What I might be trying to say is that I believe everyone can make this work if they think their situations through.

[mthd97]

I can remember way back when I personally raised the idea of Chief Architect going on a system similar to what Archicad have used for many years “a yearly fee that includes upgrades.” To help it further develop.

 

lo and behold we were all surprised when it was implemented along with many of the things on our wish lists.

 

It definitely appears that it’s time for them to move further forward with this new yearly subscription fee for reasons that we are not all aware of. If this helps Chief Architect’s further development ? Then I can’t disagree with that.

 

Graphisoft have not ruled out the possibility of adopting a yearly subscription fee for Archicad either.

 

Chief Architect was used by me because I had many builder clients who wanted timber framing plans and take offs including estimating. You couldn’t beat the way Chief Architect has been able to build timber framing so quickly from way back. Anyway it’s definitely very builder friendly software.

 

Architects tend to use Vectorworks Architect, Archicad and Revit more than Chief Architect in other parts of the world.

 

If you are an Architect in North America doing many residential houses it would be crazy if didn’t have an up to date copy of Chief Architect in your CAD tools set. It’s definitely not a toy and never was.

 

[birneyd]

On 12/6/2022 at 1:36 PM, DavidJames said:

 

The only way the billed-per-hours-used model would work is if Chief received some major polishing and improvements. 

When I was using Chief solely for new-builds and renovation plans, I constantly encountered myself having to spend hours upon hours trying to figure out why the software was doing "x" when I wanted it to do "y". As the projects became more complicated, the frequency of issues I encountered also increased. It was incredibly frustrating. 

I can only imagine how much that frustration would get amplified if one was now having to spend money on those hours where there's almost zero productivity. 


 

Yes, annoying, but I think still better than going through the hassle of restarting the program and coughing up $200 for a month of use when you just want to make a minor change to a plan.  A rental model would be workable, but only at a sensible price.  5 copies of MS Office for $100 per year is reasonable.  Adobe's photo plan at $10 per month is actually quite cheap.  Even the full boat Creative Cloud at $50 per month isn't too bad a deal when you look at the expanse of software involved.  By comparison $200 per month for a single program is highway robbery.  I get the (small) vertical market issue, but there should be a way around for folks who use the program on a limited basis.  One approach would be to charge separately for support as I suspect that is a big piece of CA's cost structure.  Support plans at different levels from basically none to as many calls as you need (essentially the current model) could be priced very differently with nominal pricing on the software itself.  With that kind of model, the current SSA pricing should easily support development.  Support is another animal and the high intensity users really ought to pay their way.  With the currently proposed plan, most of the casual users will eventually go away and CA will lose considerable revenue that incrementally costs them very little to support.

 

[birneyd]

On 12/6/2022 at 2:09 PM, Chrisb222 said:

 

The current rental program now allows you to start and stop - and restart - whenever you want. A post by CA earlier in this thread mentioned that will still be an option going forward into the new pricing plans.

Somehow, I don't think that means that if you use the program for a day a month that one month's rent will now last for 30 months.  Having to choke up $200 every time you want to visit a plan is not workable.  

[deaconjj]

On 11/29/2022 at 6:31 PM, ChiefArchitect said:

Rene, we don't have a way to store backup payment information.  If there is a payment failure, we will send an email to you with a link to retry the payment or update payment details to a different card,

 

Joe, the SSA price will not change on Jan. 10.  New subscription pricing details can be found on the license change FAQ page. https://www.chiefarchitect.com/licensing/

 

Kind regards,

 

Chief Architect Sales

 

What changes can we expect to SSA prices can we expect over the years to come???! I feel like I just got suckered into a timeshare maintenance plan that keeps going up. So incredibly disappointed in you, chief architect.

[deaconjj]

What pisses me off is that I am a small architecture firm that has been using chief architect for nearly 20 years. I call that a relationship. And now chief is twisting our arms. What happens when my firm grows, and I need more than the two current licenses I have? I have to pay five times more per year for each additional license? Are you freaking kidding me? That’s not a relationship. I’ve led many customers to you, and I am simply betrayed. I beg you to fix this.

[deaconjj]

Clearly, the right thing to do would be to allow anyone with a current SSA license, to perpetually be able to buy other SSA licenses. Shame on you for not recognizing this.

[buzzsaw204]

On 11/30/2022 at 3:57 PM, KristjanM said:

..... So, a possible scenario. You create a project in Version 16 (you own Version 14) and decide that you no longer need the  SSA updates. You can no longer use Version 16 and can't open any projects created with it. This is exactly what happens with Softplan. I would like to hear Chief's explanation about what version of the software one is actually going to own.

 

this is a great point!!  if you we're to switch to a the Sub License (X15, X16...etc.) and down the road, you find that you cant afford the Sub Lic anymore and need to cancel, revert to using your Leg Lics X14....now, at that time, you are not able to open you files any more, in X14??

[HumbleChief]

6 hours ago, buzzsaw204 said:

 

this is a great point!!  if you we're to switch to a the Sub License (X15, X16...etc.) and down the road, you find that you cant afford the Sub Lic anymore and need to cancel, revert to using your Leg Lics X14....now, at that time, you are not able to open you files any more, in X14??

Why would one 'switch to a Sub License'?

[M-Reed]

What's interesting here is how some users are critical of other's complaints and tend to ostracize them for those complaints. Turn it around, the same users are loud and long when the issue has a negative effect in their direction. 

 

Between the egos and the pricing change.... 

[Renerabbitt]

2 minutes ago, M-Reed said:

What's interesting here is how some users are critical of other's complaints and tend to ostracize them for those complaints. Turn it around, the same users are loud and long when the issue has a negative effect in their direction. 

 

Between the egos and the pricing change.... 

I think ethan ashby said it best for me...without any roadmap, this news just feels like a betrayal. I'm hoping this leads to better things, and I am a big brand advocate but he's right, we shouldve been given some more context.
The optimist in me even feels like big news is around the corner but wont be shared until after Jan 10, which is not how I do business personally..be open and transparent. All conjecture of course
 

[Rashid_Garuba]

The only thing guaranteed is change (potential pain).. and people dislike change..

 

I have been a Datacad user for YEARS but stopped upgrading a few years ago since they had reached maturity and were adding very little.. They now have a maintenance model which I will have to pay up to catch up but I likely won't as they are implementing 3D Autocad style. I understand they need the money but the idea that they stop improving (REAL improvements) while I pay every year bugs me .. probably because of what I got used to "buying" software.

 

Ownership or rental is a weird subject as far as Digital things go.  You rent a car/house right..? but they degrade and heed maintenance which Software doesn't (unless OS forced).  Music.. Mariah Carey makes a mint off that Christmas song literally forever.. mostly from advertising.

 

Where this will take Chief is very hard to predict.  I have feeling they make a windfall before January 10th partly from those that were on the fence with SSA (only $595) and those that may want a new license in the next couple of years may front-run the new subscription model.  If I am making $200k/year what is $2k for THE most important tool I use right..?  All this is great until there is a big economic slowdown.

 

The rent as needed idea IS likely the best but it must be nearly impossible to implement..

[Rashid_Garuba]

9 minutes ago, Renerabbitt said:

I think ethan ashby said it best for me...without any roadmap, this news just feels like a betrayal. I'm hoping this leads to better things, and I am a big brand advocate but he's right, we shouldve been given some more context.
The optimist in me even feels like big news is around the corner but wont be shared until after Jan 10, which is not how I do business personally..be open and transparent. All conjecture of course
 

 

Very good point but Chief has no idea what the revenue stream in the future will now look like so probably can't predict what resources can be added to improve Chief.

 

Adding to my previous post.. The new pricepoint means Chief now directly competes with Vectorworks, Revit, and Archicad.. I think that is rough considering Chief's rough edges. I think increasing SSA to say.. $950 would have been a better idea but I am sure they thought of that before settling on this.

[Doug_N]

I think some of you are missing an important aspect of marketing the program to new users. 

 

One of the hard selling points of the current sales models is the initial buy in at about 3k.  The new model lowers that hurdle to 2k.  This should open the door for more first-time users by lowering the bar.  Right now, you can rent CA for $200 per month.  That is the same as the new model.   The company needs to change its revenue model to keep up with development and improvements as the program becomes more fully featured and configurable.  Making changes often means rewriting existing code to make everything compatible, and as a former code writer, I know that sometimes you have painted your program into a corner and to make an improvement it means a serious trashing of existing code, and long hours of doing a major rewrite.  

 

There can be a number of reasons for that.  For example, something that is baked into the code now is going to be a variable, so every place that the variable is used error trapping has to be written to ensure that the program doesn't make ridiculous decisions.  Debugging new code is a mind-numbing process.  Most of that is done long before a program is ready for BETA testing.

 

We all wanted CA to expand and be more capable.  Well now we are getting that, and we have to pay for those new features.

As for comparing CA to Word or MS Office pricing, how many users does MS Office have V.S, CA users?  The fewer the users, the higher the cost burden.  

[HumbleChief]

18 minutes ago, Doug_N said:

One of the hard selling points of the current sales models is the initial buy in at about 3k.  The new model lowers that hurdle to 2k.

Good point but I guess technically the new buy in cost is only $200 for the first month.

[HumbleChief]

I'm wondering what the new subscription upgrade cycle will look like? Will it be a once a year thing? Like now, X15 X16 X17 etc. Or might it be an incremental upgrade plan through the year like Tesla that can push through improvements and features when available? Perhaps in the future?

[PlanX_Designs]

to me, the SSA annual fee is just a discount for upgrade to the next Version.

 

my usage and actual need for SSA is 1 time in the last 2years.....making it a $1200 per issue, per case call, just to report on a bug for their software.

 

just curious, whats your usage of the SSA?   are you submitting/requesting support 1 issue per week(52 technical issues / $600 per yr = $11.53 per case?)

[SHCanada2]

The SSA would be 2 components support and upgrades. Where I've seen this split before it was 4% for support, 16% for R&D, on a 20% subscription.

 

But I like the pay for support model, I rarely use it, mostly to report bugs or lack of documentation

[MarkMc]

SSA stands for Support AND Software Assurance. Software assurance = updates and version upgrade.

 

I'm not a fan of subscriptions.

I've always stayed on SSA no matter what and intend to even though I'm practicing retirement and cutting back. Amounts to 1 days billing per year. I am happy that continues to work the same as before. I think it's a great deal (maybe even generous-see 2020 below)

 

I suppose if you don't bother to stay up to date it's not so good for you and calls for a decision.

 

New licenses, well not so good needing a subscription. OTOH when I needed to carry a second license the cost would not have been a big deal, just part of overhead. The profit made off less than 2 weeks of the employee would cover the cost. If I felt I had to raise rates to cover the $2k well $2k divided by what 200, 150 billable days. At 150 days that an increase in billing of $13.33/day or $1.65/hr. Then too I see a real advantage to monthly there and it was a PIA selling the secondary when done.

 

Selling licenses-that doesn't really bother me either. It was deductible in the first place. In every business I ever had I always considered any tool paid for once it was. I have somewhere between $5k and $10k of defunct no saleable software over the years.

 

KDs and IDs make up half my client base. I don't see what if Interiors will still be available or how that works. OTOH for the kitchen folks the primary competitor is 2020 which is subscription, $100 less per year no monthly nobody was grandfathered (upgrades always were an issue anyway) . Don't know what alternative there is for IDs. Possible I'd lose a client. Then again though I've already let a few go.

[joey_martin]

22 minutes ago, PlanX_Designs said:

the SSA annual fee is just a discount for upgrade to the next Version.

That is what it is. Support is the first word in the title, but it's a small part of what the program is...in fact, it's a tiny part. Everyone gets support if they have purchased they license from a legitimate source, but SSA members get Priority Support. But we also get libraries that others are paying for individually, upgrades, and discounts. Over the years I have seen many users skip the SSA because "they don't use support", which is 100% irrelevant to the program.

[EdEmery12]

Question:

 

If I buy a new/renew SSA subscription today will that keep me from having to buy a subscription plan?

Would that qualify for updates going forward?  

I have paid thousands of dollars buying chief over the years really seems like a raw deal to make us pay $199.00 a month now.

 

Thanks,

Ed Emery