bluesparrowllc

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Hello,

 

As skazz 44 mentioned on the Q&A forum (Plan View vs Annotation Sets vs Layers), the differences between Plan Views, Annotation Sets, and Layer Sets is not at all clear.  I've watched the training videos but I am not at all sure how they work together or, indeed, when I should be using them and for what.  It's frustrating because I think these features would really help me.

 

Thanks!

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In a nutshell:

 

Saved Plan Views just keep track of everything you need for a particular plan view that you might want to use for either a particular task (such as working on your electrical or roofs) or as a view that you would like to make part of your construction docs (such as a view you might want to send to your layout).  They are similar to saved camera views.  By saving plan views, you can more quickly change between tasks or views without having to change a lot of different settings.

 

Default Sets (formerly know as annotation sets) are just a convenient way of quickly changing all of your active defaults that are related to your annotations (such as dimensions and notes).  Since all saved views basically remember all of their active defaults now, Default Sets are not nearly as important as they used to be.  In my opinion, it is much easier and more powerful to use a saved view then it is to just switch your active defaults.

 

Layer Sets are just a convenient way to quickly change what is currently being displayed and control how it looks (such as line styles and text styles).

 

Have you watched all of these videos yet?

 

https://www.chiefarchitect.com/videos/watch/2421/saved-plan-views.html

https://www.chiefarchitect.com/videos/watch/2433/developing-saved-plan-views.html?playlist=84

https://www.chiefarchitect.com/videos/watch/10199/productivity-tips-saved-plan-views.html

https://www.chiefarchitect.com/videos/playlists/100/saved-plan-views-layers-annotations.html

 

If you have, then what parts are you still finding confusing?  Please be specific so that we know what we should work on.

 

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You don’t really need “Saved Plan Views”. 
 

Focus on “Default Sets” in conjunction with a unique layer set for each Default Set that you send to Layout. 
 

From the Layout you can even control and assign different Reference Sets for each View sent.  
 

I personally find Saved Plan Views add clutter to the whole process. 
 

By the way, they’re not called AnnonSets anymore. They’re called Default Sets. This was a welcomed simplification introduced in X12. 
 

Once you get comfortable with Default Sets you can take a stab at Saved Plan Views if you’re the OCD type... lol 

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We've always had layer sets. (I believe.) Then Annotation (now called Default) Sets were introduced, which was a game changer. You could set all of the defaults for layers PLUS annotation types (dimensions, text, callouts, etc.) for a specific plan type -- all at one drop-down. Think of Plan Views simply as Annotation Sets on steroids. You get the layers AND annotations you had before, PLUS a saved floor and zoomed view, PLUS associated reference layers -- all through one drop down menu. AND as a bonus, you get to display multiple plan views side by side, if you wish. Why wouldn't you want that convenience?

 

However, you can still use Layer Sets, Default Sets, and Plan Views independently. It's just that you can control more at one time with Plan Views. As you use these, the distinctions will become clear.

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I was just suggesting to OP that he focuses on understanding Layer Sets and Default Sets first. 

Then once he masters that he can move on to Saved Plan Views. 
I personally only use them when I really need to reference multiple plans but that’s not often.  Saved Plan Views are not required and do impose a level of organization that adds to the workflow. 
 

It’s my opinion guys, put the pitch forks away. 

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4 hours ago, Michael_Gia said:

I was just suggesting to OP that he focuses on understanding Layer Sets and Default Sets first. 

Then once he masters that he can move on to Saved Plan Views. 

 

@bluesparrowllc...

Plan Views are Annotation/Default Sets...so, why learn two versions of the same thing?

 

Things you can do with Plan Views you cannot do otherwise:

- Custom Reference Layer Set (this alone makes Plan Views worth the effort)

- Designate a floor for the view

- Pony Wall display control...(nothing like this in simple anno set)

- Open multiple plan views at the same time...maybe looking at the foundation and the first floor for load bearing or joist issues...or plumbing conflicts.

- Designated zoom factor

- Color on or off

 

And...you have complete control of all annotations...layers, color, etc...just like a simple annotation set. Just learn plan views...you'll be happy you did.

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40 minutes ago, SNestor said:

 

@bluesparrowllc...

Plan Views are Annotation/Default Sets...so, why learn two versions of the same thing?

 

Things you can do with Plan Views you cannot do otherwise:

- Custom Reference Layer Set (this alone makes Plan Views worth the effort)

- Designate a floor for the view

- Pony Wall display control...(nothing like this in simple anno set)

- Open multiple plan views at the same time...maybe looking at the foundation and the first floor for load bearing or joist issues...or plumbing conflicts.

- Designated zoom factor

- Color on or off

 

And...you have complete control of all annotations...layers, color, etc...just like a simple annotation set. Just learn plan views...you'll be happy you did.

Well summarized Steve.  I agree plan views are the way to go.  Take the time to learn them and get over the annotation/default sets stigma.  Only caveat I would say is if you are successful already and have a good system in place where you rock the annotation sets from before and your system is well defined then maybe you don't need to learn saved plan views as it might not save you time.  But in that same token newer users who do not know what you do regarding using Annotation sets shouldn't master those first, work directly with the new tools that Chief has put out. 

 

But for most and especially newer users take the time to get PVs down and you will be happy you do.  My two cents only and free of charge... Happy Wednesday everyone.  Hope you have a successful week! :)

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One of our goals is to make the program as flexible as possible because different people like to work in different ways.  

 

I believe working with saved plan views is the most efficient way to work with Chief.  They are really no more complicated than working with saved camera views.  They are entirely optional though and if you don't find them helpful, then don't use them.  Personally, I wish that we would have introduced saved plan views years ago, before we introduced annotation sets, because then we wouldn't have any of this confusion about them.

 

BTW, I was not the person that moved this thread from the suggestions forum to the Q&A.  Since I am not a moderator, I can't move threads.  

 

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I think it's best to understand what Active Defaults are first and foremost.  Once you get that, think about it like this... 

  • Default Sets are an optional way to save a pre-configured group of Active Defaults.  Change your Default Set and all your Active Defaults change to that saved configuration. 
  • A Saved Plan View on the other hand will remember the state of your Active Defaults regardless of whether those Active Defaults are saved as a Default Set or not.  But the Saved Plan View also remembers a whole lot more.

Here's a snapshot of your Active Defaults (items that can be saved as a Default Set)...

1.thumb.jpg.f59a19bcbca521ae151051433aa9611c.jpg

 

...and that list expanded to show what is saved with the Saved Plan View...

2.thumb.jpg.c5b3a7659b02718bf3fb48c1f4ebaef1.jpg

 

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I have been using Chief for a long time and since the Plan views and notes have been added I have decreased my time to draw plan significantly.
Also, the library plays a huge part in the time saving. If you utilize your library and organize it right its very powerful to use. I don't have to build many templates anymore because of it. To many templates can get confusing trying to keep everything linked with the layout file so I have it setup a little differently than some. All my notes I also save to the library. 

For example:
I send schedules thru cad details to send them to layout but I don't save the schedules in the template. I just save a cad detail as framing notes, elevation notes, windows, doors...and I leave it blank so I can just generate the schedule in a pre-named cad detail. This way everything is fresh and clean each time and I don't have to worry about placing, linking or sizing. When I'm drawing a floor plan and I'm putting windows in, this way is better for me because I can see the window size label and not just the callout label.


All my general notes of course is set to go straight from the library into the layout and that is set as my layout template along with some other things.

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If you don’t understand layer sets and default sets don’t go near Saved Plan Views, is an alternate statement to what I was saying.  
 

I came to Chief from Softplan. The main attraction was how flexible Chief was and that it offered more than one way to achieve what I was trying to accomplish. 
 

Saved Plan Views are great, but they require more setup and a very firm grip on how default sets and layer sets affect your plan and layout, something which OP clearly doesn’t have yet. 
Baby steps. 

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By the downvotes and messages I’ve received it seems that Saved Plan Views are a religious topic on this forum. 
I won’t comment anymore. How dare I have an opinion. And your collective answer to OP’s original posts should be, “Plan Views or the highway, suck it up, learn them and only work that way”

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I disagree with Michael on this (and apparently so do some other people although I am not one of the people that down-voted him).

 

I actually think it is easier to learn and use saved plan views than it is to learn and use default sets.  It doesn't have to be that complicated and you don't need to spend a lot of time setting them up.  Just think of them as working the same as saved camera views.  If you have a view you want to work in or send to layout, just save it and then you can reopen it anytime you want.  You can pretty much ignore default sets until a later date when and if you want learn to be even more efficient.

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Here are the plan views a really complete set of con docs might have, and each one can have a saved plan view.

 

Plot or site plan:  bounds, setbacks, building location, driveway

 

Grading plan:  cut, fill, retaining walls, boulder and rock walls, all the stuff you do to modify existing terrain.

 

Landscape plan:  the plantings and hardscape, including pools.

 

Foundation plan.

 

Floor 1 plan.  Floor 2 plan.  More if needed.

 

Floor 0 plan.  This is the buildout in or on floor 0.

 

Roof plan.

 

Ceiling plans for any floor needing them.

 

Floor framing for each structural floor.

 

Roof framing plan or plans if one has them scattered.

 

"Zoom" plans, which I call any plan that needs a closer look to get all the built stuff defined, and kitchens and baths are included here, but staircases, home office, media rooms, studios, anything with a little cabinetry or complexity is included.

 

Electrical plans for floors 0 on up.

 

Plumbing plans.  One of my guys always wants the DWV figured out and diagrammed.

 

Your con docs might have more needs than these, but whatever they are, it is worth the full day or however many hours you'll take to build your template plan (or plans) to have these.

 

As for "working" SPV, I think a no-dimensions version of the floor 0, 1, 2, etc. is right for that.

 

If you are needing to render to show furnished and accessorized interior and exterior spaces, take copies of those un-annotated plan views and make a set for floor 0 on up, for your rendering needs. 

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Just wandered over to this thread and am a bit confused about the confusion re: Layer Sets and Plan Views etc. If a new user then a learning curve is not something to be surprised by, frustrated yes, and initially confused but not surprised.

 

I then watched a couple of the videos referred to above and again if one is completely new to Chief then hang on because the program is complex but the videos IMO are excellent. Maybe because I am familiar with most of the terms as a long time user and if that's true then the basics of Chief's operational paradigm have to be part of any learning process and to the OP you have to start there if you are new to Chief. Hang in there and it will get easier and perhaps a more specific question will alleviate some confusion?

 

And what's with the Up Votes and Down Votes? They cause nothing but harm and absolutely no good - at all. What exactly is there purpose? What good do they do?

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6 hours ago, Dermot said:

I disagree with Michael on this (and apparently so do some other people although I am not one of the people that down-voted him).

 

I actually think it is easier to learn and use saved plan views than it is to learn and use default sets.  It doesn't have to be that complicated and you don't need to spend a lot of time setting them up.  Just think of them as working the same as saved camera views.  If you have a view you want to work in or send to layout, just save it and then you can reopen it anytime you want.  You can pretty much ignore default sets until a later date when and if you want learn to be even more efficient.

 

I did not down vote Micheal either but I do agree with you. When the plan views came out I decided to start from scratch with my templates. With all the preset plan views I think it makes it very user friendly to the new guy because everything is all set up for us right out of the box to start using. Of course I could be over speaking a little because I have been using the program for a long time but with me starting from ground zero it was easy.
I would suggest to new users to sign up for the on line classes. That really helped me to work through getting the new templates setup quicker and understanding how the plan views work.

Thank You Dermot!

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6 hours ago, Michael_Gia said:

By the downvotes and messages I’ve received it seems that Saved Plan Views are a religious topic on this forum. 
I won’t comment anymore. How dare I have an opinion. And your collective answer to OP’s original posts should be, “Plan Views or the highway, suck it up, learn them and only work that way”

 

I agree, I don't like down votes!
Down votes without an explanation of why they are down voting doesn't help. Please don't get discouraged because everyone's input is important to someone and I don't want to miss out on your opinion. Don't let the few mess it up for others.

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1 hour ago, HumbleChief said:

Just wandered over to this thread and am a bit confused about the confusion re: Layer Sets and Plan Views etc. If a new user then a learning curve is not something to be surprised by, frustrated yes, and initially confused but not surprised.

 

I then watched a couple of the videos referred to above and again if one is completely new to Chief then hang on because the program is complex but the videos IMO are excellent. Maybe because I am familiar with most of the terms as a long time user and if that's true then the basics of Chief's operational paradigm have to be part of any learning process and to the OP you have to start there if you are new to Chief. Hang in there and it will get easier and perhaps a more specific question will alleviate some confusion?

 

And what's with the Up Votes and Down Votes? They cause nothing but harm and absolutely no good - at all. What exactly is there purpose? What good do they do?

 

I agree but I just gave you an up vote anyway! LOL

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...and Michael's out of here because people just disagreed with his point of view, and down voted him because they can't simply tell him straight up they don't like his point of view?

 

Seems passive aggressive at best, chicken cr*p at worst.

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1 hour ago, builtright3 said:

Down votes without an explanation of why they are down voting doesn't help.

Right? What's the purpose? Michael doesn't like Plan Views so tell him why you do or argue a cogent point about them but a down vote? Not getting it.

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