CHIEF ONLY RAY TRACING

[mrscott]

Thanks Jon. My GTX 980 is just fine. I almost bought the TitanX but there reviews were not that stellar for the price difference. Perhaps CA takes advantage of the Titan where my 980 is lacking. I have Lumion 6.0 pro but have not had much time to explore it. Used it on a commercial project last year for one scene. At least it paid for itself but not much demand on the Residential world. Do you use Lumion? 

 

Quick off topic question. I adjusted an upper and lower cabinet in a plan and would like to update ALL other cabinets in the plan to this new config. I seem to recall using the Object Dropper to do this but it is not working. What am I missing? Thanks.

[mrscott]

1 hour ago, jcaffee said:

What Dennis said.  Upper-end Quadro cards, but then you lose performance in other areas.

Jon, do you have  particular Quadro card in mind? I'm thinking an older model (cheaper than a new one). Would it be better than the Nvidia GTX 980 w/ 4G of ram? Just curious your thoughts.

[Ryan-M]

To clarify, Chief does not take advantage of workstation (Quadro) graphics cards.  It is likely that you will see significantly worse performance in Chief going from a GTX 980 to an older (or even a modern) Quadro card.  Also note that your graphics card has absolutely no impact on ray tracing in Chief.  Upgrades to your graphics card will only effect render views.

[mrscott]

Ryan,

 

Thanks! That is exactly the information I was looking for. My the only issue I have with my current workstation setup is...I always work with both a 3D View and Plan open. Using my 3D Connexion mouse to fly around. After awhile the 3D view gets jerky. The only way to correct is to close the 3D view and reopen.

[mrscott]

2 hours ago, jonboy112352 said:

The one thing in standard turning off but then why in the RT are others off?

 

I am not up on that ...I would have a better chance of doing brain surgery than understanding CPU and so on.... maybe this may help

Thanks Scott

Not sure I understand you question. Call me on Skype if you want to discuss. MrScott _

[Christina_Girerd]

I was just catching up on all the helpful info in here - good stuff!  I remembered a few things I've done regarding raytrace light issues.

 

When "diagnosing" a raytrace that gets those funny light spots all over the place in the past, I have sometimes found that a specific light symbols will cause that problem and it is not the raytrace settings.  So if I see those spots, I always do a quick check by turning off most lights and running quick raytraces to see if I can pinpoint what light or fixture causes the problem.  While it may be raytrace settings, it is usually quicker to deal with a single light causing a problem, so I always check that first.

 

Also remember you can do quick tests by changing the light color of the fixture(s) - open the light spec dbx and go to the "Light Data" tab and change the color of the light from white to pink or something really obvious.  I sometimes use this to test the spread of a particular light(s) in a busy scene with a lot of lights, such as a kitchen.  You usually just need to run a couple passes to see which light goes where. 

[TheKitchenAbode]

Here's my take on the scene provided by Jon. The scene as provided takes an extremely long time to Ray Trace. On my system the scene as provided took 4.2 minutes (250 sec) to make only one pass on a 1200 X 769 sized output. The primary reason for this is that the scene is lit entirely using point lights. I replaced the point lights with spot lights and now the same sized scene runs in only 36 seconds per pass. That's an 85% reduction in Ray Trace time.

 

50 Passes, 30 min, 1200 X 769

 

 

Graham

[TheKitchenAbode]

Here's a shot from another vantage point. All spot lights. All clean within 25 passes.

 

25 passes, 13 min, 1200 X 769

 

Graham

[jcaffee]

So that's where that bread box went. 

[LarsCD]

On ‎2‎/‎16‎/‎2017 at 6:02 AM, TheKitchenAbode said:

Just ran these yesterday. Ran 60 passes in about 30 minutes, 1200 X 582. Most of the time was spent cleaning up the glass in the pendants, still some slight graininess in the one over the table. What I have found with the glass is that the graininess is attributed to the degree of light variance behind the glass, not the light within the glass. In the second pic the background to the pendant is fairly consistent and the glass is fairly clean. In the 3rd pic the background is lit by a recessed ceiling light as such the glass is still grainy. These were run with caustics On.

 

Graham

Would you mind telling me the light fixture you are using for your under cabinet lighting and the specific of the light data settings? Thank you

 

Vevalee

[TheKitchenAbode]

11 minutes ago, LarsCD said:

Would you mind telling me the light fixture you are using for your under cabinet lighting and the specific of the light data settings? Thank you

 

Vevalee

 

They are spotlights. Cut-off angle 180 degrees, Tilt Angle -55 degrees, Drop Rate 4.0. The intensity is most often 4% - 10%. They are placed just under the cabinet bottom surface towards the very front of the cabinet. A modified under-cabinet puck light should do the trick. Just make sure that the rotational handle points towards the backsplash, the tilt angle is in that direction. I also add a slight yellow colour to the light for a slightly warmer look. Give it a try to see if it works for you.

 

Graham

[Rich_Winsor]

On ‎2‎/‎20‎/‎2017 at 1:35 PM, Christina_Girerd said:

....Also remember you can do quick tests by changing the light color of the fixture(s) - open the light spec dbx and go to the "Light Data" tab and change the color of the light from white to pink or something really obvious.  I sometimes use this to test the spread of a particular light(s) in a busy scene with a lot of lights, such as a kitchen.  You usually just need to run a couple passes to see which light goes where. 

This is excellent advice. If you adopt this approach you will 

save yourself a lot of grief and aggravation trying to figure

out how the various light sources perform. It deserves more

than a +1. 

[Rich_Winsor]

Here is a quick Ray Trace I pulled to give the client an idea

of how this electrical panel would look on his siding. The

enclosure is a Wall Cabinet. The meter is some Boolean

operations with P-solids, and the meter face is an image

from the internet converted to a material and applied to a

P-solid face plate. Everything modeled and rendered in

Chief of course.

[JasonParsons]

100% chief raytracing, 12 passes each, 2-7 minutes each depending on the image

[mrscott]

Jason,

 

Absolutely stunning for so few passes. Since this thread was start to help interested parties understand how best to maximize Chief's RT capabilities, we would all be better for it if you would be so kind and share your settings, textures, patterns, tricks, etc. used to produce these outstanding results. Also curious of your system specs. There seems to be a lot of interest in upgrading these days with GTX GPU and Intel CPU pricing falling.

 

Thanks again for sharing.

 

 

[SNestor]

Believe me...I really no idea how to explain to anyone how to ray trace.  With me it's just trial and error.  I don't know how to create or use bump or normal maps...and I only use Chief.  But...I think a ray trace like the attached would be good enough to help sell a job to a client.  

 

I wish I knew more...but, ray tracing is time consuming and I only do these for my own enjoyment and training...or, if a client really needs something to help them understand a final design.

 

Here is one of my latest...all Chief.  Basic settings.  For me...I think adjusting the sunlight makes the biggest impact.  But...keep in mind, I don't know what I'm doing.

 

[DRAWZILLA]

4 hours ago, mrscott said:

Jason,

 

Absolutely stunning for so few passes. Since this thread was start to help interested parties understand how best to maximize Chief's RT capabilities, we would all be better for it if you would be so kind and share your settings, textures, patterns, tricks, etc. used to produce these outstanding results. Also curious of your system specs. There seems to be a lot of interest in upgrading these days with GTX GPU and Intel CPU pricing falling.

 

Thanks again for sharing.

 

 

We call those quick one's "Crappy Ray-traces", I remember long ago to get that quality, you would have to let it go overnight. Scott Hall and I have been doing the Crappy one's for years. Of course He invented it along with many other methods

[Dennis_Gavin]

Looks great Steve,  The only thing I would do is adjust the shrubbery slightly so they are not all exact copies,

Also, either find a new grass material or maybe try increasing the size of the one you are using.

[yusuf-333]

10 hours ago, JasonParsons said:

100% chief raytracing, 12 passes each, 2-7 minutes each depending on the image

Very Nice Indeed! Thanks for sharing.

[mrscott]

10 hours ago, SNestor said:

Believe me...I really no idea how to explain to anyone how to ray trace.  With me it's just trial and error.  I don't know how to create or use bump or normal maps...and I only use Chief.  But...I think a ray trace like the attached would be good enough to help sell a job to a client.  

 

I wish I knew more...but, ray tracing is time consuming and I only do these for my own enjoyment and training...or, if a client really needs something to help them understand a final design.

 

Here is one of my latest...all Chief.  Basic settings.  For me...I think adjusting the sunlight makes the biggest impact.  But...keep in mind, I don't know what I'm doing.

 

Nestor,

 

You are much too humble! This a very nice  RT. Lose the car though as it takes away from your work on the house. I really like the pop the shadow boards give to the fascia. The trim on the siding is also a nice touch.

 

is the sun the only adjustment you made from the default Outdoor RT? 

[SNestor]

11 hours ago, mrscott said:

Nestor,

 

You are much too humble! This a very nice  RT. Lose the car though as it takes away from your work on the house. I really like the pop the shadow boards give to the fascia. The trim on the siding is also a nice touch.

 

is the sun the only adjustment you made from the default Outdoor RT? 

 

Scott - thanks for the compliments...but really, it's all trial and error.  That is why I don't do these too often...only when I have some time and feel like messing with Ray Tracing. 

 

Doing this Outdoor RT I have learned a few things...

 

- Seems to me the biggest factor in changing the brightness is the "Lighting" menu in the RT menu.  I have experimented...and to me somewhere between 3-4 is good.

- I have also experimented with the color of the sun light.  White is typical...but for this RT I have used a very soft "yellow".  A very light "blue" sunlight is good also.  Just depends on the backdrop and the colors on the house.  

- I also adjust the sunlight so that it shines on the house and creates the shadows I want.  I don't ever just use the standard "sun follows camera".  

- I've recently been experimenting with "focal blur".  If you put something in the foreground...and lower the F-Number...I used 1.4 in the attached RT...it will put some blur on things in the foreground...gives the RT a real "camera" feel.

 

I didn't use Photon Mapping...not sure what it is...but I think I tried it a few times and didn't like the way it looked.  

I don't know what "Ambient Occlusion" is...or how it really effects the RT.  For the attached RT I used 0.3 for the minimum and 1.0 for the maximum.  Whatever that means.

I also used "Enable Environment Light (Outside)"...intensity is set to 1.0 (which I think is the default?)

I also checked "Use Sky"...whatever that means.  Sounded logical for an exterior RT.

 

19 hours ago, Dennis_Gavin said:

Looks great Steve,  The only thing I would do is adjust the shrubbery slightly so they are not all exact copies,

Also, either find a new grass material or maybe try increasing the size of the one you are using.

 

Dennis...thanks for the tips.  In the attached RT I changed the grass...changed the X and Y scale to 60x60.  Added a bump map.  Same for the brick...I added a bump map.  

 

- Just FYI...for the grass...all I did was copy the "texture" file into the "Bump Map" file field and added a "Height Multiplier"...in this case 0.03.  I did the same for the brick..but inverted the height multiplier.  I also adjusted the height of the plants to make them look a bit more "realistic".

 

These things really did improve the RT.  Thanks! 

    

 

 

[Dennis_Gavin]

nice job!

[mrscott]

Thank you both! This is the kind of input that makes RT'g worthwhile. I haven't tried adding bump maps are adjust texture size but I can see where it is worth the effort. X9 is a nice step forward from previous versions but honestly I did not do much with RT'g in X5 - X7.

 

Question for both of you.

what CPU are you running and how long did the RT run?

 

thanks,

 

[mrscott]

8 hours ago, SNestor said:

 

Scott - thanks for the compliments...but really, it's all trial and error.  That is why I don't do these too often...only when I have some time and feel like messing with Ray Tracing. 

 

Doing this Outdoor RT I have learned a few things...

 

- Seems to me the biggest factor in changing the brightness is the "Lighting" menu in the RT menu.  I have experimented...and to me somewhere between 3-4 is good.

- I have also experimented with the color of the sun light.  White is typical...but for this RT I have used a very soft "yellow".  A very light "blue" sunlight is good also.  Just depends on the backdrop and the colors on the house.  

- I also adjust the sunlight so that it shines on the house and creates the shadows I want.  I don't ever just use the standard "sun follows camera".  

- I've recently been experimenting with "focal blur".  If you put something in the foreground...and lower the F-Number...I used 1.4 in the attached RT...it will put some blur on things in the foreground...gives the RT a real "camera" feel.

 

I didn't use Photon Mapping...not sure what it is...but I think I tried it a few times and didn't like the way it looked.  

I don't know what "Ambient Occlusion" is...or how it really effects the RT.  For the attached RT I used 0.3 for the minimum and 1.0 for the maximum.  Whatever that means.

I also used "Enable Environment Light (Outside)"...intensity is set to 1.0 (which I think is the default?)

I also checked "Use Sky"...whatever that means.  Sounded logical for an exterior RT.

 

 

Dennis...thanks for the tips.  In the attached RT I changed the grass...changed the X and Y scale to 60x60.  Added a bump map.  Same for the brick...I added a bump map.  

 

- Just FYI...for the grass...all I did was copy the "texture" file into the "Bump Map" file field and added a "Height Multiplier"...in this case 0.03.  I did the same for the brick..but inverted the height multiplier.  I also adjusted the height of the plants to make them look a bit more "realistic".

 

These things really did improve the RT.  Thanks! 

    

 

 

You got a bump from me for including your settings. 

[SNestor]

1 hour ago, mrscott said:

Thank you both! This is the kind of input that makes RT'g worthwhile. I haven't tried adding bump maps are adjust texture size but I can see where it is worth the effort. X9 is a nice step forward from previous versions but honestly I did not do much with RT'g in X5 - X7.

 

Question for both of you.

what CPU are you running and how long did the RT run?

 

thanks,

 

 

Scott - this last RT was 100 passes.  Not sure how much time...maybe a bit more than an hour.  Honestly, there wasn't much difference from 50 passes.  I just set it and left.  

 

I use a 2 year old Mac.  See my signature.  It's powerful enough...