New Pricing Model for CA

[Doug_N]

According to an email that I just received from CA, as of January 10, 2023 CA will only be available as a subscription license.  For those of us that have a current CA license with a paid up SSA agreement, our agreement continues at the same price ($595 per year) so long as the SSA does not lapse.  If you let it lapse, then you are required to switch to the subscription model and that is going to cost Annual subscription: $1,995 (if paid annually).  

 

If there ever was a incentive to get or keep your SSA agreement in place...  this is it!

[Kbird1]

 

Are you not following this thread Doug? 

 

https://chieftalk.chiefarchitect.com/topic/37322-chief-architect-software-licensing-changes-beginning-january-10-2023/

 

there is also a FAQ here : https://www.chiefarchitect.com/licensing/

 

 

M.

[Doug_N]

I saw that on the website, but what thread are you referring to?

[Doug_N]

Ahh the thread in announcements!  I didn't see that.

[lbuttery]

Check CA's website as there is usually a "What"s New" PDF for each release 

 

Lew

[Smn842]

18 hours ago, Doug_N said:

For those of us that have a current CA license with a paid up SSA agreement, our agreement continues at the same price ($595 per year) so long as the SSA does not lapse

 

Your comment suggests the email stated the SSA price is fixed at that price from now on - did they actually state that?  I ask because I contacted CA a few days ago and they wouldn't make any statements about the ongoing SSA cost even in 2023.

 

I've not received that email yet and I am interested in the price as I am only a DIY/hobby user of Chief Premier.  I've had SSA since X9 but if the cost moves up towards subscription levels then it becomes too much for my non profit use.

[Doug_N]

4 hours ago, Smn842 said:

 

Your comment suggests the email stated the SSA price is fixed at that price from now on - did they actually state that?  I ask because I contacted CA a few days ago and they wouldn't make any statements about the ongoing SSA cost even in 2023.

 

I've not received that email yet and I am interested in the price as I am only a DIY/hobby user of Chief Premier.  I've had SSA since X9 but if the cost moves up towards subscription levels then it becomes too much for my non profit use.

Not a fixed price, the same price for the next billing period.  +

 

 

[lbuttery]

Note: Chief licenses have NO resale value - they can NOT be offered for sale

 

as CA will not allow transfers anymore

 

if you have no use for Chief it is now GARBAGE

 

I should have been able to sell my X14 with current SSA for approx. $2,500

 

I feel screwed 

 

Lew

[Michael_Gia]

8 hours ago, lbuttery said:

 

I feel screwed

Imagine buying a tv and then not being allowed to resell it?
 

Is this what communism feels like?

[Richard_Morrison]

15 hours ago, Michael_Gia said:

Imagine buying a tv and then not being allowed to resell it?
Is this what communism feels like?

It's more like subscribing to Netflix and then finding out you can't sell your subscription.

[lbuttery]

it's more like subscribing to Netflix and then finding out you can't sell your subscription.

 

NOPE, not the same at all

 

In our case, Netflix WAS allowing you to sell  your subscription

and then without notice they stop allowing re-sales

 

its more like Ford or Chevy suddenly saying you can't sell or trade-in your vehicle

 

Lew

[Mark3D]

Its not like a cheap price has been paid to use the software over the years has been paid it was fare money and then to be told it is now worth nothing  thats what it looks like when big business has it way and says stuff you to its existing 

[Michael_Gia]

3 hours ago, Richard_Morrison said:

It's more like subscribing to Netflix and then finding out you can't sell your subscription.

Since X7 and including the original price, I’ve payed close to $10,000 CAD, and I’m not allowed to sell the product that belongs to me to recoup some of that?
You’re ok with this?

They should’ve at least shipped a jar of Vaseline with that original purchase. 

[ChiefJeet]

The price of the annual licence is way too much. CA can increase the prices of SSA for perpetual licences to the same cost as the annual licence making your perpetual licence worthless. There sales policy has been fierce. By not allowing 'Save as'  to the previous version has forced people to keep upgrading. I hav not come across many companies introducing minor changes and then releasing a new version every year and that with full of bugs. With my SSA, I have been eligible for x14 since its release and have not yet downloaded it, just for the fact that I will be testing their bugs out for the next 6 months. I think I need to look a the alternative softwares. I simply don't like their sale policies.

 

 

 

 

[Designer1]

I feel like this new model is forcing ssa or your out. I don't patrón companies that don't honor and respect the reason why their in business, which is always the customer. 
 

I'm using chief till it's no longer good then dumping it for something else. If I don't feel respected by a company they don't get my money. 
 

Yes Revit is a subscription based model but then again revit can build complete skyscrapers and is a total design solution software not just light commercial and residential. 
 

Whats more, people are dealing with high prices for food, gas and everything else. The last thing  chief users needed was the feeling of a forced hand to pay the increased fees. 
 

Good Bye Chief!

[Smn842]

5 hours ago, ChiefJeet said:

By not allowing 'Save as'  to the previous version has forced people to keep upgrading.

 

My day job is software and I've worked on many applications in my time and saving back to older data formats is a nightmare for most applications with complex data.  Even if data related to new features can be removed or reverted to something similar there's the significant development and testing effort. 

 

Where I have seen this done customers are often very unhappy with any loss/change of any data and for a feature not used by most customers the net result is its simply not worth it.  The dev/test time is far better spent elsewhere. 

 

I am not a fan of the lack of a statement over whether Chief are going to move SSA cost towards subscription, but I don't think the lack of 'Save as' to older versions is for any reason other than its simply not worth it.

[richoffan]

4 hours ago, Smn842 said:

I am not a fan of the lack of a statement over whether Chief are going to move SSA cost towards subscription,

Neither am I. But you don't know what you don't know. Could it be Chief needs the income stream data from this change to make an informed decision on the SSA? I know personally I've never had push back on any price I've quoted  (especially on a change order )  Those that do "sign on the dotted line" see the perceived value of my services without comparing to Bechtel or Chuck with a truck....What I do know is that during a decades long relationship with Chief they have always been fair and reasonably transparent. I don't foresee that changing. As for charging more in these turbulent times - it ain't a hobby.

[joey_martin]

18 hours ago, Michael_Gia said:

I’ve payed close to $10,000 CAD, and I’m not allowed to sell the product that belongs to me to recoup some of that?

Are you saying that over the last 7 years or so since X7 that you haven't already re-coupled that investment in the form of fee's collected? I don't believe that for one minute. 

 

Also, I believe in the EULA that it states that you may own the software, but Chief owns the license to use and that's what you are paying for. Something along those lines.

[lbuttery]

Joey:

 

this used to be Chief's transfer policy that allowed re-sale and transfer of the license

in the real old days the fee was $50 - $400+

 

Hello,

 

Thank you for the question.  The seller will need to contact our Customer Service directly.  Customer Service will provide the seller with the necessary form and the license transfer fee.  The transfer fee varies depending on the history of the license and can range from $100 up to $900+.  The license transfer fee must be paid, and the License Transfer Form must be signed by both parties before the software license can change ownership.

 

Note that SSA is not transferrable. If you would like SSA, you would need to purchase it separately through an SSA renewal (if qualifies) or by upgrading.

 

Let us know if you have any questions.

 

Kind regards,

 

Derek 

Chief Architect Sales

 

Lew

[Kbird1]

1 hour ago, joey_martin said:

Also, I believe in the EULA that it states that you may own the software, but Chief owns the license to use and that's what you are paying for. Something along those lines.

 

I believe you'll actually find this is the other way around ..... i.e.  Chief owns the Software and we have only Licensed it's use after buying in  ( and paying SSA ).

 

1 hour ago, joey_martin said:

Are you saying that over the last 7 years or so since X7 that you haven't already re-coupled that investment in the form of fee's collected? I don't believe that for one minute. 

 

Personally I don't see what this has to do with it ?  Has my (work) Truck made me money over the last 10yrs? who knows ? but I'd sure be unhappy if I got an email from Chevrolet next week saying I can no longer sell it because come Jan. they will be selling all future Vehicles by monthly or yearly Subscription only.

 

M.

[joey_martin]

3 hours ago, Kbird1 said:

Chevrolet next week saying I can no longer sell it because come Jan.

Apples & Oranges

[richoffan]

2 hours ago, Kbird1 said:

Has my (work) Truck made me money over the last 10yrs? who knows ? but I'd sure be unhappy if I got an email from Chevrolet next week saying I can no longer sell it because come Jan. they will be selling all future Vehicles by monthly or yearly Subscription only.

 

If you had leased your truck the analogy would fair much more closely. If you leased your truck you would have all license to legally use the truck but you would not have title. You could sell, trade-in, and /or transfer  the lease with and only with the acceptance and approval of the leasing company. I've done it. It worked quite well financially and I never held title in my name. When you bought the truck you were given title and Chevy gave up all rights coveting that title. If you received an email saying you couldn't sell you could legally tell them to pound sand.  Now apply that to Chief:

From the EULA

PLEASE READ CAREFULLY: THIS IS A CONTRACT. 

 

This Chief Architect, Inc. End User License Agreement ("License Agreement", or "EULA") is a legal agreement between you (an individual or entity) and Chief Architect, Inc., and sets forth the terms and conditions under which you are licensed to use the Software. 

Chief Architect, Inc. grants you a non-exclusive, non-transferable (except as provided below) license ("License") to use the Software in object code only 

 

TRANSFERRING YOUR SOFTWARE: This software is licensed to you, and only you. You may not sell, give, donate, rent, transfer, or share this license with any other person or entity. In some cases, certain licenses may be permanently transferred to another individual, but only under the terms and conditions of the then current Chief Architect License Transfer Request Form, and only if the requested license transfer is approved by Chief Architect, Inc. If approved, such permanent transfer will include a fee paid to Chief Architect. To apply for a permanent license transfer, your license must be eligible for transfer. You must agree to the terms and conditions of the License Transfer Request Form and fill out, sign, and return this form to Chief Architect, Inc. for approval. A license transfer fee must also be paid in full prior to any transfer of the software license. 

 

Nothing has changed....No one has ever owned the software. They have owned the right to use the software in object code only. They may sell that right through transfer subject to the approval of the owner - Chief. 

[lbuttery]

Nothing has changed

 

Ummm, yes it has changed

 

CA used to approve the transfers - if all the conditions were met

 

Now they won't approve any transfers - except for within the same company

 

NO warning about the change

 

as for leasing a car - its the same - if they suddenly said you couldn't sell or trade etc

 

Lew

[richoffan]

1 hour ago, lbuttery said:

Nothing has changed

 

Ummm, yes it has changed

 

Offer Acceptance and Consideration. Lew, I know you're not happy. Everyone is unhappy about this to varying degrees and for varying reasons. The reality is we all agreed to the terms and conditions in the EULA and those are not changing. A condition suddenly becoming inconvenient for you does not establish bad faith. As for a car (truck) lease if Ford said they're are not accepting a trade on a Toyota that is their prerogative. If Chief decides unchecked transfer of existing licenses is detrimental to the profitability of the company that is, and always has been, their prerogative.

2 hours ago, richoffan said:

under the terms and conditions of the then current Chief Architect License Transfer Request Form,

Might I suggest you request a License Transfer Request Form and post it here. It would be helpful if you highlighted the changes to the form that are causing so much angst

[lbuttery]

A condition suddenly becoming inconvenient for you does not establish bad faith.

 

Ummm, yes it is bad faith 

 

they allow A  for decades and then they stop A - NOT allowed - with NO warning

 

that is BAD FAITH

 

Lew