Evolution

Need Some Roof Help

Recommended Posts

I didn't  think this roof was all that complicated. The first build actually came out looking very good. I wish I had saved a copy of that plan. Then the client wanted more changes. Next build on the roof really screwed up now.

I've attempted several iterations but when I try to manually adjust the quirky valleys everything goes hay wire.

I deleted the roof and drew in some cad line to mark where I think the ridge should be. I've actually had the hands on experience of building so common sense tells me if my main dimension wall to wall on each section of the home are the same, and the main roof pitch is the same, in this case 14/12 and the over hangs are all the same (ceiling height is 10') then the roof shouldn't have the crazy lines the software keeps building.

Hoping one of you roof guru's can help me with this.

I am posting the plan (for about the third or fourth time in this post and most of the other threads I've started).

Appreciate all the help in advance. The clip of the roof full view isn't very good but hopefully you can make out the weird offsets etc.

I need a smooth as possible eve and ridge line and the eye brows over the bump outs should all be the same I would think?

Plan 1a Main Level X6.plan

post-1662-0-10961400-1417731890_thumb.jpg

post-1662-0-23364500-1417731911_thumb.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted plan does not match your images.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted plan does not match your images.

I have been waiting for the client to decide on the over-all dimensions they wanted for the master areas, and actual finished ceiling heights vs plate height (i.e. 14' plate in most main areas-10' and 9' finished ceiling in some other areas). So, for some reason all the previous "minor" dimension changes caused CRAZY roof iterations when I do auto-rebuild. Hopefully they have finally come to a conclusion with major dimension changes. I have updated the current floor plan with most, of the major dimension changes and as they have provided info, added cabinets etc to suffice for now.

The problem now is, attempting to build the roof (manually) is becoming so frustrating, and time constraints wouldn't normally be a problem if my home computer hadn't crashed, so currently I can only work on it in the office. I have zipped the original back up file of where we started (that is the roof line they want) and added the current updated plan file (that is the CRAZY roof they do not want).

Not sure what the best approach is NOW to build the original manual roof on the current updated floor plan and how to lock it so the roof doesn't change when I add any or change any interior walls.

All help acknowledge and appreciated!

Plan 2R SELECT Main Level X6 Current 12.16.2014.zip

Plan 2 SELECT Main Level BACK UPR original X6 Current.zip

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

One part is 26' wide and the other is 23' therefore the ridges are different heights.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

One part is 26' wide and the other is 23' therefore the ridges are different heights.

Yes, I understand that. From experience I know roof's on different sections with varying dimensions will cause differing results, but it should be possible to LIMIT the crazy results to some degree? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe an "override the rule of geometry" button?

I prefer to manually create all but the simplest roof forms. Then you can control the crazy. The algorithm just covers the plan with a roof - it does not design a roof.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bob -- I spent a few minutes cleaning up the plan. I'd share it with you but I'm using the trial version of Chief.

 

Mostly the roof issues are caused by varying ceiling heights. Make them all the same and the roof behaves.

 

The roof is auto built.

 

post-1284-0-02985700-1418765427_thumb.jpg

 

I noticed some other things that may or may not be a problem. Here is one. Notice the horizontal blue line and how the walls along it are not aligned.

 

post-1284-0-95347600-1418765903_thumb.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bob -- I spent a few minutes cleaning up the plan. I'd share it with you but I'm using the trial version of Chief.

 

Mostly the roof issues are caused by varying ceiling heights. Make them all the same and the roof behaves.

 

The roof is auto built.

 

attachicon.gifbob roof 1.jpg

 

I noticed some other things that may or may not be a problem. Here is one. Notice the horizontal blue line and how the walls along it are not aligned.

 

attachicon.gif bob roof 2.jpg

Eric, that seems simple enough. My home computer is down so Imwillnhave to wait until I am back in the office tomorrow. I watched the video on lowering the ceiling height while not changing the plate height, but the presenter talked fast and some parts of the vid were not clear. If I ever manage the roof I will have to work on lowering the ceiling without changing the plate height.

Thanks for the help,

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I noticed some other things that may or may not be a problem. Here is one. Notice the horizontal blue line and how the walls along it are not aligned.

 

Eric those walls were lined up! I used a cad line to line them up. I don't know what happened?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I noticed some other things that may or may not be a problem. Here is one. Notice the horizontal blue line and how the walls along it are not aligned.

 

Eric those walls were lined up! I used a cad line to line them up. I don't know what happened?

Bob, I wouldn't use a CAD line to align walls. It can work but sometimes even a little off will create some nasty results.

 

If you find you need walls to line up exactly across an opening drag a single wall across the opening and then break it to create the opening. Guaranteed to line up then.

 

Or use Chiefs wall align snaps that will also get them aligned.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My main software is Autocad Architecture which does a pretty good job figuring out roofs - this is what it came up with

post-3082-0-64584700-1418780369_thumb.jpg

post-3082-0-53718100-1418780377_thumb.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bob, I wouldn't use a CAD line to align walls. It can work but sometimes even a little off will create some nasty results.

 

If you find you need walls to line up exactly across an opening drag a single wall across the opening and then break it to create the opening. Guaranteed to line up then.

 

Or use Chiefs wall align snaps that will also get them aligned.

I haven't learned that tool yet. I will def put that on my things to remember list!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My main software is Autocad Architecture which does a pretty good job figuring out roofs - this is what it came up with

That looks more like what I have been trying to draw manually!

Thanks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Once the roof is done and you turn off auto rebuild roofs, you may set the ceiling height and the roof will not change.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Once the roof is done and you turn off auto rebuild roofs, you may set the ceiling height and the roof will not change.

oh yeah, I remember seeing that on home talk I think.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have NOT given up on building the roof. After countless changes from the client, finally think things are NAILED down enough the over-all dimensions will no longer change (but there is ALWAYS Murphy's law). I feel the roof is in much better shape now than when I first posted my request for some help. At least for the most part, there are some ridge caps now produced that weren't there before, which If I understand the tutorials and videos I've read and watched over and over mean SOME progress. I do have a roof edge most likely interfering with a wall. I know I still have an issue with the main roof plan east - west lining up and connecting. Some gable ends WHERE THERE and now parts and pieces are missing.

The client came back and added a "circular balcony" and requested the roof also be radius over the balcony rail (I started it, and they said that is what they want) but I haven't had success in getting it modeled correctly) I left some of my last attempt in place, as the ridge line is +/- what they want. 

I think once you open the plan you will see more than just roof issues, however; I continue to work on finding and fixing what I can.

ONE NOTE please, if you wish to help me, I do APPRECIATE it! I know it is UP TO ME to learn the tools and the software and I may have gotten the cart before the horse, at least I AM NOT IGNORANT to that fact already.

 

If you intend to CRITICIZE and offer SARCASM, well; I appreciate "CONSTRUCTIVE" criticism, but I CAN DO WITHOUT the Sarcasm!!!!

THANKS for anyone who'd like to take me under your wing and offer suggestions aside from "study the user guide" I do that every free moment I can. Watch the GREAT roof tutorials, I have all the good sites saved to favorites on my Ipad, and almost every waking moment I am not performing all my other responsibilities I watch. D Scott Hall's which are some of the best.

 

I am posting the zipped file which is the very latest. Again, I am tweaking what I can every day.

Thank (each of you) in advance!!!

1.12.2015David Baker Lake House updated KEEP.zip

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

discounting the unfinished circular roof Bob ,what issues are you seeing? 

 

I see some wall problems at each end caused by roof plans protruding into the wall ,they need to be dragged back out to the outside of the exterior walls 

 

ie I pulled these two planes back out to fix the wall

post-315-0-89424400-1421177422_thumb.jpg

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bob, Here's how I'd go about creating the curved roof. I'll leave it to you to figure out the eave height and resolve the roof intersections and trapped valleys.

http://youtu.be/0KKasliuiKY

(sorry, no sound. I'm no DSH.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sound would def help. Looks neat but not what they're expecting. I will attempt a sketch tomorrow what they would like.

Thanks k

Kevin!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wanted to get the roof to auto build. Still needs some manual fixing.

 

Maybe this will help a bit, Bob.

 

I set all the ceiling heights to default, and deleted a bunch of unneeded walls in the attic space. Added some walls in the garage, and a one in the open stairwell.

 

The curved balcony roof would build, except for the angled wall to the side. You could generate it in a copy of the plan without that angled wall, then copy it and paste hold position into the original plan.

 

Do the below grade walls need insulation? A 2x wall inside them?

1.12.2015David Baker Lake House updated ROOF R1.plan

post-1284-0-04578600-1421272922_thumb.jpg

post-1284-0-95870700-1421272941_thumb.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sound would def help. Looks neat but not what they're expecting. I will attempt a sketch tomorrow what they would like.

Thanks k

Kevin!

 Kevin "The Moakster"  did a great job with the curved roof,  that is what I was thinking but I think he took it a step further,  thanks K,  if I get a chance I will do a follow up with sound mimicking K's approach but also taking a little bit of a different approach.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wanted to get the roof to auto build. Still needs some manual fixing.

 

Maybe this will help a bit, Bob.

 

I set all the ceiling heights to default, and deleted a bunch of unneeded walls in the attic space. Added some walls in the garage, and a one in the open stairwell.

 

The curved balcony roof would build, except for the angled wall to the side. You could generate it in a copy of the plan without that angled wall, then copy it and paste hold position into the original plan.

 

Do the below grade walls need insulation? A 2x wall inside them?

It definitely took on a life of it's own.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Built on a modified version of the house -- just flattened the walls out across the back so auto build would work. Copy and paste back on the original.

 

post-1284-0-49324800-1421290804_thumb.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Please sign in to comment

You will be able to leave a comment after signing in



Sign In Now

  • Member Statistics

    27478
    Total Members
    6254
    Most Online
    Oilersfan20
    Newest Member
    Oilersfan20
    Joined