stone deck posts

[SHCanada2]

does anyone know how these are structurally done with flush beams?

 

something like

 

 

where lets say the brick is 14"x14" on the outside

 

suppose the flush beam at the end of the deck is 3 ply. This would be 4.5 inch. and suppose the post inside the stone was 6x6. if the post was centered under the beam, the post would be 0.5" proud of the outside of the deck. Add to that the stone at a thickness of 1" or so, and it is 1.5" proud.

 

so are people just adding another cosmetic ply at the end to make up for this. If so, then the post itself would need to be box framed out with 2x4s, such that on the inside below the deck, it would come out around 7"? are the 2x4s just affixed to the post and thats good to hold the stone?

 

The above shows it on concrete pads, which I guess could hold it if it was deep like a footing, but for a standard 10 or 12" pile up North here, does this 2x4 build out sit on the 2" left on the pile beyond the post surface area. i.e. if the post is centered on the pile, there is not a lot left to support 7" of a boxed 2x4, especially given the post would be centered

 

and if the customer wanted 20" outside dims...just keep building out a 2x4 box and hope it holds?

 

thanks

 

[VHampton]

Edit... (as per Alan's sketch below). 

 

That Ledgestone is probably all non-load bearing veneer.

 

With the girder (and post) presumably in the center of the column... The outer deck perimeter is probably packed out.

 

In the same manner as one would do w/ rake boards at a gable end overhang. 

 

 

[tundra_dweller]

I'm going to make some wild guesses here, but I would say the posts are not centered under the beam and probably offset towards the house and notched to accept the beam some distance that would allow for the box framing & stone veneer to come out near flush to the edge of the beam.

 

For the footings, I would imagine you could use a standard 12" sonotube footing and keep the top of the tube form 4-6" below grade, then form out a square or round to whatever size you need at the top 4-6" of depth, kind of like a reverse bell footing. Run your normal rebar cage in the sonotube and tie in some horizontal rebar in the top of your box form, and pour all at once.

 

[Gawdzira]

[tundra_dweller]

Yes indeed. What we used to do before the bigfoot type forms were common was to auger 24" holes, pour a 12" thick pad at the bottom of each hole first (embedding rebar in the pad and leaving 4' or so of vertical rebar dowels exposed so they fit within the sono tube as needed, then come back and place our 12" sono tubes on the pad, backfill and pour the sono tubes. The bigfoot forms cut out that entire step of pouring the separate pad footing first.

 

Here in hard frost country we have to have the bottoms of our footings at least 60" below grade, and the wider pad footing not only distributes loads to avoid settling of the footings, but it also "locks" the bottom of the footing in place to help avoid freeze/thaw cycles moving the entire assembly up & down. Although we've still seen them move in poor soils. Definitely don't want to be pouring just a tube form without a wider element at the bottom.

[Chrisb222]

42 minutes ago, Gawdzira said:

 

Yep that's how I would do it... if I wasn't so lazy. Heck, I was too lazy to do the drawing. 

[SHCanada2]

thanks, fur out the beam would seem to be good answer. ...perhaps make it like a torsion box

 

here they allow sonotubes for decks only,

[VHampton]

Excuse the earlier posts about girder center etc... 

 

Just now realizing that the question was more about the "ladder framing" along the outer edge. 

 

Alan's sketch is exactly how it's done when the flush girder terminates the joists, but the deck framing needs to extend past the columns.  

 

 

 

 

 

[Gawdzira]

This does create a slightly more complex detail to get the connection of the guardrail post. Make sure to spec solid blocking at the guardrail connection and thru bolt back to the beam with additional blocking per the various deck railing framing guides.

[MoeGia]

11 hours ago, VHampton said:

Excuse the earlier posts about girder center etc... 

 

Just now realizing that the question was more about the "ladder framing" along the outer edge. 

 

Alan's sketch is exactly how it's done when the flush girder terminates the joists, but the deck framing needs to extend past the columns.  

 

 

 

 

 

I'd prefer to have solid blocking.  The ladder framing creates lots of cozy spaces for bees unless the top and bottom are screened.

[VHampton]

Agreed Maureen. The underside of an exposed deck can provide nooks for just about anything. 

 

The elevated deck in the image shows covered seating below, and presumably, it's water-proofed, with a soffit (which would eliminate bee concerns).

Quote

Make sure to spec solid blocking at the guardrail connection and thru bolt back to the beam with additional blocking per the various deck railing framing guides.

 

100% agree. The rail posts will probably want to be centered on the girder. It's common for a spliced connection w/ blocking and bolts.

[SHCanada2]

if it is solid beyond the flush beam, how would the water drain if it is 1x6 deck boards and the blocking+ beam is > 5.5"? just put on joist saver or bitumen based sheet and let the water run along the top of the blocking/flush beam to the end?

[Gawdzira]

The solid blocking does not have to be continuous but I would make it around 12-16" ( you may have to translate to Canadian math number measure stuff?) at the center of the post to give the post stability from rotating the rim.

Simpson_Guardrail_Post_Connectors.pdf

[SHCanada2]

i thought you were going to say that

 

Most plans here are in ft-in, except for site plans, which are in m, and geodetic if required..in m. all the usual 12", 16", 24" for spacing are still used

 

believe it or not, there is a Canadian version of the simpson catalog, just becuase we are special

 

[GeneDavis]

Looks like a Houzz pic, with the little white price tags.

[SHCanada2]

yes, this was not a picture taken by me, it took me a while to find a clear example like this, on the internet. It seemed for most, the post either went all the way up through the railing, or part way up the stone went to the post, or most were not a flush beam