PHYSICALLY BASED RENDERS COLORING

[sthieldesign]

I am really struggling with the coloring of the Physical Based Renderings. They cast a pink or blue/green color to everything. I have adjusted backgrounds and sun saturation to no avail.  Anyone have any tips?  I have attached some examples.

[ericepv]

Susan:

 

The color assigned to your light sources can affect the color of the scene as can the amount of artificial light and ambient light along wit their respective settings. It would help if you post the plan.

 

Eric

[Kbird1]

The Color Cast comes from the background used , many many posts on the Forum about it ...... and has been an issue since we got PBR

 

Turn the Sun Lumens way down (Low thousands) and in X13... turning the Daylight Intensity down can also help, ( 700-1000 range) and

checking Cap Live Samples will also stop the GPU from overworking at full speed , try 1000 - 2000 - 3000 settings for example,

I have mine at 2500 currently with my 3080.

 

M.

 

 

[RodCole]

Try the backgrounds that have snow in them if you want more natural colors.

 

It may not make much sense, but that is what I have found.  What would be nice is to have a background photo that has snow in the lower portion of the pic and a neutral blue sky above that with a few clouds thrown in.  Then when you place plants from CA's Library the scene it would look correct and the color would not be off.

 

The other thing I have thought of is to edit your site pic to lighten it up a bit and then add the library items.

 

Chief backgrounds seem to be working in a manner similar to HDRI light sources in other rendering engines.

 

Hope that is helpful.  Show us more stuff when you are flying.  Good luck.

[caf200]

On 11/18/2021 at 10:02 AM, sthieldesign said:

I am really struggling with the coloring of the Physical Based Renderings. They cast a pink or blue/green color to everything. I have adjusted backgrounds and sun saturation to no avail.  Anyone have any tips?  I have attached some examples.

 

For the OP for future searchers.

 

a) I usually toggle off daylight.

and/or

b) Menu 3D then Edit Active Camera to remove background then change Background Color to Black.

[Renerabbitt]

27 minutes ago, caf200 said:

a) I usually toggle off daylight.

and/or

b) Menu 3D then Edit Active Camera to remove background then change Background Color to Black.

I would STRONGLY discourage both of these options. Why are you turning off your background and setting no sun? The OP's desired result is a daylit condition with a background.

[DanielleDubuc]

I had the same issue and fixed it by lowering the sun lumen down to 600. that also fixed the problem with the blue back light window treatment.

[winterdd]

On 11/18/2021 at 10:02 AM, sthieldesign said:

I am really struggling with the coloring of the Physical Based Renderings. They cast a pink or blue/green color to everything. I have adjusted backgrounds and sun saturation to no avail.  Anyone have any tips?  I have attached some examples.

Nice designs!

[RodCole]

Lately I have been experimenting with lowering the backdrop intensity with generally good results.  Depending on the render I sometimes bring it down to 10 or less and punch up the scene with additional lighting.

[caf200]

On 11/18/2021 at 10:02 AM, sthieldesign said:

I am really struggling with the coloring of the Physical Based Renderings. They cast a pink or blue/green color to everything. I have adjusted backgrounds and sun saturation to no avail.  Anyone have any tips?  I have attached some examples.

 

15 hours ago, Renerabbitt said:

I would STRONGLY discourage both of these options. Why are you turning off your background and setting no sun? The OP's desired result is a daylit condition with a background.

 

I very much respect your opinion and work I've seen ... however ...

 

* It was not 100% that daylight condition was a requirement. She also had one bathroom picture.   

* It seems that to really understand one aspect of lighting is to see it a night or on a very cloudy day.  That is when the lights are critical for task, ambient, or accent depending on your 'use case'.

* I have 100% seen the greenish tint / cast in my PBR views and it is AWFUL and unrealistic.  It definitely seems to be related to my backgrounds (one has a lot of trees).  The backgrounds and daylight reflections off of them through the window really seemed to have a negative influence.  I cared about room lighting and not unrealistic leaf reflections  

Hope that helps explain my angle and answer. 

[Kbird1]

The Color cast issue from backgrounds has been around since we got PBR 4-5 years ago , and it seems in X13 the Lumen levels are even higher ( though labelled the same eg 100,000 ) , which has made 3D Viewer Exports for me unusable for Client Viewing as they as so overexposed you can't see colors well especially on the Interior. 

 

M.

[caf200]

2 minutes ago, Kbird1 said:

The Color cast issue from backgrounds has been around since we got PBR 4-5 years ago , and it seems in X13 the Lumen levels are even higher ( though labelled the same eg 100,000 ) , which has made 3D Viewer Exports for me unusable for Client Viewing as they as so overexposed you can't see colors well especially on the Interior.  M.

My son and I have different computer setups (graphics) but we adjust the 'Camera Exposure' down (I use 0.03).  Not sure if you've played with that?

Default settings --> 3D View Defaults

 

[Kbird1]

10 minutes ago, caf200 said:

My son and I have different computer setups (graphics) but we adjust the 'Camera Exposure' down (I use 0.03).  Not sure if you've played with that?

Default settings --> 3D View Defaults

 

 

 

No , I have not tried that low of an exposure   ...will have to try it, Thx.

[caf200]

On 3/1/2022 at 10:41 AM, caf200 said:

* I have 100% seen the greenish tint / cast in my PBR views and it is AWFUL and unrealistic.  It definitely seems to be related to my backgrounds (one has a lot of trees).  The backgrounds and daylight reflections off of them through the window really seemed to have a negative influence.  I cared about room lighting and not unrealistic leaf reflections  

 

Here is an example of simply changing "toggle sunlight" between day vs night setting in my PBR render and the differences is dramatic IMO.  Night in general for me gives me the best feel and in real life that is when we'd typically have guest over and use more accent lighting. See the greenish tint ... and yes I realize the leafs don't help.

 

Aside: ignore some of the extra brightness of shelf lighting as I was experimenting with lumen and angles. Also experimenting with how can lights reflect of horizontal beam surfaces (threw up some horizontal soffits as an experiment).

 

Compare tip for below picts. Click on one and then use left and right keyboard arrow to swap back and forth.

[Electromen]

I'm new to PBR RT or RTRT but I've been working on it.  Try this:

 

Edit > Default Settings > 3D Defaults > Rendering Techniques > Edit > Physically Base (Ray Trace)

Camera Exposure =  0.4 > Check - Use Backdrop > Check -  Use Ray Trace > Check Refraction > Number of Export Samples = 2500 > Check Cap Live Samples > Daylight Backdrop Intensity = 100 > OK > Sunlight > Check Use Generic Sun > Intensity = 1,000 > Check Sun Follows Camera > OK  > Done

 

Use the Full Camera to create a 3D View > Right click the camera in 2d  > Open Object

This brings up Full Camera Specification.

There is a second way to open this is. In 3D, use an Icon on the Tool Bar > Edit Active View

 

Rendering Technique > Physically Based > If you hit Define, you should see the Defaults we set earlier

Check Show Color > Uncheck Show Watermarks > Check Show Shadows > Check Ray Casted Sun Shadows > Check Reflections > Uncheck Bloom > Check Edge Smoothing > Ambient Occlusion = 50% > Lighting > Automatic > Maximum lights =100

OK

 

Let me know if this helps

 

[Alchemyjim]

Also in "Adjust Sunlight" play with a yellower color. It seems to counter the blue from the backdrop nicely.

[Renerabbitt]

Just thought I would chime in with a couple of thoughts. If people finding this thread really want to improve their renderings it would be a good idea to learn a photo editing software and replace the backdrop altogether. Yes the backdrop will cast light into your scene, so why not do away with it and export as a .png with transparent background. From there you simply drop in a new backdrop. Takes all of 2 minutes and then you aren't dealing with color casting. I still use the backdrop in some scenes but its important to manually rotate your sun. 
I never turn down my sun settings, but when you rotate the sun, you will find that it stops illuminating your backdrop depending on the angle of rotation. 
The only setting then that I change is the suns angle and backdrop intensity. It takes me nearly no time, just a few minutes

[Electromen]

28 minutes ago, Renerabbitt said:

Just thought I would chime in with a couple of thoughts. If people finding this thread really want to improve their renderings it would be a good idea to learn a photo editing software and replace the backdrop altogether. Yes the backdrop will cast light into your scene, so why not do away with it and export as a .png with transparent background. From there you simply drop in a new backdrop. Takes all of 2 minutes and then you aren't dealing with color casting. I still use the backdrop in some scenes but its important to manually rotate your sun. 
I never turn down my sun settings, but when you rotate the sun, you will find that it stops illuminating your backdrop depending on the angle of rotation. 
The only setting then that I change is the suns angle and backdrop intensity. It takes me nearly no time, just a few minutes

I don't have my Adobe Photoshop account active right now.  I can activate for a month or so if this works.  The Backdrops default folder is: Documents > Chief Architect Premier X13 Data > Referenced Files > Bonus Backdrops.

Would it be possible to create an Action in Photoshop to convert the .jpg backdrops to .png with transparent backgrounds?  Batch covert them using the Action?  Then open the backdrop specification in CA and choose the new ,png location?

[Gawdzira]

What do you have the can lights set to for color. Try these settings

 

Change your light color to the following.

R=255

G=235

B=205

And set the lumens to 1200 for cans. 850 for pendants.

If you want even warmer light on the pendants do R255, G167, B79

 

Edit, gleaned from another post from here or FB?

[Renerabbitt]

16 minutes ago, Electromen said:

Would it be possible to create an Action in Photoshop to convert the .jpg backdrops to .png with transparent backgrounds?  Batch covert them using the Action?  Then open the backdrop specification in CA and choose the new ,png location?

What are you trying to accomplish with this action? I did not quite follow.

[caf200]

2 hours ago, Renerabbitt said:

Just thought I would chime in with a couple of thoughts. If people finding this thread really want to improve their renderings it would be a good idea to learn a photo editing software and replace the backdrop altogether. Yes the backdrop will cast light into your scene, so why not do away with it and export as a .png with transparent background. From there you simply drop in a new backdrop. Takes all of 2 minutes and then you aren't dealing with color casting. I still use the backdrop in some scenes but its important to manually rotate your sun. 
I never turn down my sun settings, but when you rotate the sun, you will find that it stops illuminating your backdrop depending on the angle of rotation. 
The only setting then that I change is the suns angle and backdrop intensity. It takes me nearly no time, just a few minutes

 

Great tips as usual. Hard to argue with your success.

 

I did find that rotating the sun did change the 'color casting' a fair amount.  In our current plan, I have a 7a, 12p, 9p, and midnight from our particular lat/long mid-summer.

 

Re: png transparent

I think this can vary a lot based on what parts of the image you make transparent.

This online website works pretty well and it an relatively easy to use interface with some flexibility (orange rectangles).

https://onlinepngtools.com/create-transparent-png

 

 

[Renerabbitt]

7 minutes ago, caf200 said:

Re: png transparent

I think this can vary a lot based on what parts of the image you make transparent.

Ah I see the disconnect, MY lack of specificity.
When you export an image using the image exporter(alt,f,e,p) you have the option to export as a png and enable Transparent Background. So my suggestion is that you use a backdrop with little to no predominant colors or keep the backdrop turned off, then export as a png with transparent background and simple replace the background in an image editor..
Also, here is a short vid showing sun manipulation and backdrop editing:

[caf200]

2 hours ago, Renerabbitt said:

Ah I see the disconnect, MY lack of specificity.
When you export an image using the image exporter(alt,f,e,p) you have the option to export as a png and enable Transparent Background. So my suggestion is that you use a backdrop with little to no predominant colors or keep the backdrop turned off, then export as a png with transparent background and simple replace the background in an image editor..
Also, here is a short vid showing sun manipulation and backdrop editing:

 

 

Re:  image exporter(alt,f,e,p)

Thank you for the extra details. I was talking about the background image being used and you were talking about generating an 3D camera image.

 

I did a test and found it very interesting and unexpected processing that the CA "Transparent Background" option does.

It appears to remove the background image from the windows, THEN re-render, then export that image.  I say that based on

a comparison of both images. See the ceiling above my window which was my clue. 

I made a GIF between to exports with and without using the 'Transparent Background' option so hopefully it demonstrates it.

The GIF animation works OK in the below image on my Win 10 Chrome browser current settings. 

Aside: GIF tool I used: https://ezgif.com/maker

 

Help related to Transparent background:

Quote

Check Transparent Background to produce alpha transparency in the spaces between all objects that can be seen in the current view. Transparency associated with Fill and Text Styles is retained, as well.

 

 

[Renerabbitt]

11 minutes ago, caf200 said:

re-render

Not a re-render, just an additional channel. This is common in rendering softwares. It’s been a request of mine that we have access to the various channels that are produced in rendering, such as the shadow channel, material and object ids, UV mapping, light and shadow and ao channels etc.

this all to say that you can think of the background  image and effect as a separate layer.

[Electromen]

5 hours ago, Renerabbitt said:

What are you trying to accomplish with this action? I did not quite follow.

After reading the rest if this thread, The Action wouldn't work as I thought.