Lmlowery

Purchasing a new Desktop

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My current desktop is really bogging down since I installed CA.  Sloowwww, out of memory, and I can't install any windows updates for lack of space on the tiny SSD.   I am looking at a new desktop with the following specs:

 

CPU: Ryzen 5 2600

Motherboard: ASRock X570 Phantom Gaming 4, Wi-Fi

Memory: 16GB DDR4, 3000 MHz

Graphics: GeForce RTX 2060, 6GB

SSD: 1TB

HDD: 2TB

Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit

 

Is that overkill or should I go for it?  

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2 hours ago, Lmlowery said:

Is that overkill ?

 

Definitely not  , it's about the bare minimum, especially with the new specs for X13 , but if that is what your budget allows then it should work.

 

M.

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5 hours ago, Lmlowery said:

I can probably add some to my budget.  What should i change?

 

Sorry I did not get back here yesterday after my Meeting to elaborate, but figured some others would chime in as I know @MarkMc

was looking to build a new Desktop this year too and had done quite a bit of researching "modern" components eg the AMD Ryzen

which I personally have no experience with but I believe most here are using at least the 3900 Series or higher.

 

If I was building now and couldn't wait , I would go with a 2070 Super minimum with 8GB memory for Graphics (unless I could find a "deal on a 2080ti ) to get a bit of further proofing as the Nvidia 3000 Series Video Cards are out, they just aren't readily available to the Public as yet , though if buying from a System Builder ( Dell,HP,MSI,ASUS etc) rather than as "Parts" you maybe able to get a 3000 Series card eg the 3080.

 

CPU: Ryzen 5 2600 

Get the best your budget allows - hopefully Mark or others will elaborate more on Ryzen for you...........

 

Motherboard: ASRock X570 Phantom Gaming 4, Wi-Fi

Could possible save here? Wifi is not needed really on a desktop if Router is close?

(ethernet cable CAT is still faster and more reliable)

 

Memory: 16GB DDR4, 3000 MHz

About the minimum these days , personally I have 32 GB in my Desktop ,

though this is something that could be upgraded later if MB accepts 4-8 Dimms

 

Graphics: GeForce RTX 2060, 6GB

Refer to notes above

 

SSD: 1TB

Get quality TLC based NVME  eg Samsung Evo Plus 

( QLC Drives are slower and have bottlenecks on large data transfers )

 

HDD: 2TB

Could be NVME or SSD (slower but cheaper and okay for a DATA drive)

 

Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit

I have Pro but I am not sure these days if it matters all that much like a

few years ago especially if you don't like to "tinker" with Windows.

 

 

But as in all computer upgrades Budget is the deterimining factor especially when it comes to future proofing in the 3-5yr range.

 

Mick.

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I always catch grief when I answer these types of questions. I have been using CA since v9.5, 16--17 years I think. I have never owned/purchased anything other than off-the-shelf HP computers from either Fry's or Best Buy. I don't do a ton of rendering, but I do provide some...S O M E...very light rendering from time to time, and have never had an issue. My current HP is this...image.thumb.png.dfe6ffa56f568ae6202b30bdd04e4607.png

 

and I added a GeForce GTX 750 Ti graphics card. I don't think I have ever spent over $1K, on a system.

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23 hours ago, Kbird1 said:

@MarkMc

was looking to build a new Desktop this year too and had done quite a bit of researching "modern" components eg the AMD Ryzen

which I personally have no experience with but I believe most here are using at least the 3900 Series or higher.

My main interest in the Ryzens was/is having PCIE4 and cores, a minimum of 8. So yes 3800X or 3900X/XT. PCIE 4 doesn't yet make as much difference, there are drives that can use it and the 3000 Nvidia and new Navi cards also support it. Intel is bringing PCIE4 to it's CPUs in the first quarter of 2021.

I really don't have any first hand experience and was going to stay out of this-thanks Mick ;)

 

On 11/13/2020 at 8:31 AM, Lmlowery said:

Sloowwww, out of memory, and I can't install any windows updates for lack of space on the tiny SSD. I am looking at a new desktop with the following specs:

Here's more than you asked for.

First off, if it were me. I would first think about just changing the SSD since performance suffers as they get full.

IF the MOBO accepts an M.2 I'd get a really good one (look at the 4k numbers not the big numbers) likely PCIE4 and then use it in a new system for the C drive. If not then I'd look at a bigger and at least better, likely used SSD to be used as data storage in the new system. That would buy time to sort out what to get, see exactly what X13 brings, learn if Intel's new CPUs are a better bet and likely give some sort of a performance boost in the interim.

 

This link shows the CPU you are looking only shows an 8% improvement over what you currently have. The GPU has a 22% boost and does RTRT. I'd consider it minimum myself. Link here.

While benchmarks are a bit of voodoo, more useful for gamers and marketing they do offer at least a relative idea. BUT those numbers are an aggregate, in Chief your performance gain can be more or less. Without knowing a lot about all of the various parts of the benchmarks it can still be difficult to tell. I jsut whent from a 6700k to a i7-10875H , supposedly a 2% increase. The apparent difference in Chief is better than that, the utilization numbers indicate so mostly due to the much larger increase, 88% in 64-core speed and the extra cores. FWIW I asked CA at IBS about multi-threading and performance and was told that they where doing work on it-no idea how that pans out but the improved performance they showed in the preview for rendering Watercolor w/lines is most welcome.

 

What resources does CA use? Every now and then I check this. Two screen shots from 'CPUID HWMonitor' showing utilization of system in my signature with a moderate, 20mb, house plan. Drive and RAM don't show a lot and not included with this software. (the only reason I have so much RAM is was a small increase and in case I ever get around to trying a RAM drive-we'll see if that happens)

 

first is open exterior elevation from layout (plan and layout already open) note how little the GPU is used

image.thumb.png.4bb2e959d641ff99b78cdcb5d3a8a599.png

 

with layout, one plan view and the elevation open reset minimum to 0 then opened half a dozen tabs-few interior elevations, plan view and likely one camera (don't remember)

image.thumb.png.a8590ff0281a3cd7f9ee531d1aa7850b.png

 

Then GPU intensive-same plan open a PBR- my previous system (6700k, GTX980m w/8GB vram) would have pegged both CPU on some cores and GPU at 100% albeit briefly.

image.thumb.png.ddfe61db3ee00fd96f99279887a383ef.png

I tested PBR on one of the worst plans that I have for that- 40mb hospital cafeteria,150 custom symbols and over a dozen textures, plenty of lights. Originally I ended up splitting the plan  and used reference sets for both 2d and 3D, furniture on one and the building on another, so I could work. I tested the complete plan not the split ones, it pegged the everything, all cores and the GPU at 100%. I mention it because the other thing I noticed was it use 100% of GPU memory when active or moving around the PBR and the GPU memory never went below 90%. So if doing a lot of PBR work the video memory matters.

 

What a new system needs to be only you can decide that. As Joey said he manages to stay under $1k and has been doing this successfully for a long time. If you check signatures on the forum you will see people using a a very wide range. Noticed one recently that is about 10 yrs old.

 

I normally aim for a 5 year life span (my new system is an exception; intended to build a desktop but gave daughter my field measure laptop and wanted an RTX card NOW :)

I figure 1)a target budget-what I'd like, 2) a maximum I'm willing to spend-what I can get my hands on, and 3)what I can get away with and the CFO (wife) will allow. Usually end up in the middle somewhere. Then deduct a 25% tax write off and divide by 5 for annual cost, then 50 for weekly overhead. Joey's system comes down to $150/yr or about $3 per week.

I've taken to getting BTO, built to order, machines at around $2500 (give or take 25% depending on budgets 2 and 3). $2500 less 25% tax deduction comes out to  $375/yr; $31/month (when I had a showroom rent was $1200/mo) or about $7.50 per week . ROI based on hourly rates: at $75/hr the new system would need to save me 5 hours a year at $100 only 4 hrs a year.

 

I always consider the entire system since I have found that better parts matter to performance, but do lean heavily toward the CPU for Chief.

It does appear that X13 will make better use of GPU and the 3000 series appears to be a big boost there. (but with Navi an unknown in Chief and there may be price pressure on whatever RTX 2000 series are still around?) Since I started with BTO laptops I also look at the extras-thermal protection, screen calibration, system burn-in and testing, no bloat ware, never bother with extra warranty any more though...All in all a PIA but that's who I am; just happy that I only have to deal with it every 5 years. As I said more than you asked for...but trust me on the sunscreen :)

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35 minutes ago, MarkMc said:

was going to stay out of this-thanks Mick ;)

 

Sorry :)  but Wow you jumped in with both feet there , I know you are busy, so was only expecting a comment the Ryzen CPUs since I don't know about them specifically...

 

Thanks.

 

M.

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18 minutes ago, Kbird1 said:

Wow you jumped in with both feet there , I know you are busy,..

Work avoidance, lining up everything in a cobbled together over the course of 100 years as built, sides sometimes can't help myself.

20 minutes ago, Kbird1 said:

was only expecting a comment the Ryzen CPUs since I don't know about them specifically.

What I know is limited. Larry among others has one though.

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2 hours ago, MarkMc said:

What I know is limited. Larry among others has one though.

 

Care to comment on Ryzen CPUs for the OP Larry  :) 

 

@HumbleChief

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Upgraded my dual Xeon power guzzling diesel bulldozer that was built for RayTracing back when that was the only game in town to the Ryzen in my signature about a year ago? Really bad with time sorry so it could have been longer or shorter ago. It was a time when the Ryzens came out and gave a dollar for dollar run against the fastest Intel chip, comparably priced. Always had an Intel but went for the Ryzen and have been very pleasantly surprised. Was initially excited about PCI 4 and used that as a motivator to upgrade to the Ryzen but the more I read after the fact the more I learned there were few real world advantages to PCI 4 and have not bothered to upgrade to an M.2 drive or any of the other fancy PCI 4 stuff.

 

Really don't have any bottle necks with a few slow downs after the models get big but overall with the dramatic reduction in power consumption and the overall simplicity of a single CPU that's faster than the dual I was running I am very pleased.

 

But that was then and this is now and I have no idea what's what in the current CPU landscape and would need to do some serious research in order to decide which CPU I'd purchase tomorrow.

 

When I initially saw this thread I did not want comment because the budget seemed too low to really do a new desktop any justice and just didn't want to say out loud how silly I thought it was to buy a 2 or 3 year old processor that is yesterday's news and that would provide almost no performance gains over the current system. Heck maybe I won't say it out loud.

 

As to Joey's comment and experience, I think if you shop right you can get one heck of a capable machine for very little money but you have at least pay some attention to what you are buying. Knowing what you need your machine for also really helps but as far as specific advice for the OP I got nuthin' other than find some more money and buy a better spec'd machine or get Joey to buy one for you. lol.

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Wow that's been about a year and a half. Time does indeed fly - was I having fun? Hope that helps in some way.

 

 

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I got my new desktop the other day Alienware Aurora R11 with

Rtx 3080 with 32gb ram 1TB ssd drive

 

wow is it ever fast.

takes about 1s to render a water colour.. before my laptop took 5-10s

 

i had a framing model with about 20k surfaces and I ray traced with 100 passes in just over 2 mins

 

i also exported a spin video of a kitchen in water colour with a rotation angle of .25 degrees.. 60 fps, no problem at all...

my laptop would only export about every 30-45 degrees because it couldn’t keep up.


 

 

EC35C963-82BE-426E-98DA-CE2469D98570.jpeg

FB8D21AB-F412-4529-9822-DA6650C9D0D2.jpeg

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I'd say get the Ryzen 3900x with the free included Wraith Prism cooler as an absolute miniumum. They are getting cheaper as the newer Ryzen's have bee released. And I agree, an RTX 2070 Super is a bare minimum. But try the 2080 super.

 

I'm giving my assistant the computer in my signature, when I'm able to get all my parts. But here's my next build after the RTX and Ryzen becomes easier to acquire, hopefully by February. High end RTX and RYzen 9 parts are only going to OEM in large quantities. I see them pop up on Amazon for 10 seconds, but they sell out by the time I click Shopping Cart.

 

Ryzen 9 5950x

Corsair iCUE H150i RGB PRO XT 75 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler

MSI MPG X570 GAMING PRO CARBON WIFI ATX AM4 Motherboard

32 meg ram, G.Skill Ripjaws V 32 GB (4 x 8 GB) DDR4-3600 CL18 Memory

RTX 3080, I prefer MSI but anything I can get my hands on

boot and program drive will be Sabrent Rocket 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive

data drive will be Western Digital Caviar Black 1 TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive

Cooler Master MasterCase H500 ATX Mid Tower Case

Corsair RM 850 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply

 

This system should last me 2 more years before I hand it off and upgrade again.

 

Added edit:

I should also say, I have two systems I built 5 years ago that still run very well. One is my assistants and one I use at home late at night. But it'll probably bog down too much with X13. A new RTX 3070 might help me squeeze another 2 years out of it. Here's the specs:

Intel Core i7-4770K 3.5 GHz Quad-Core Processor

Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler

MSI Z87-G45 Gaming ATX LGA1150 Motherboard

 

Corsair Vengeance LP 16 GB (4 x 4 GB) DDR3-1866 CL9 Memory

Western Digital Caviar Black 1 TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive

Samsung 840 EVO 500 GB 2.5" Solid State Drive

EVGA GeForce GTX 780 3 GB Superclocked ACX Video Card

Cooler Master Storm Trooper ATX Full Tower Case

Corsair HX 750 W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-modular ATX Power Supply

 

 

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