ICTHOMES Posted January 2, 2017 Author Share Posted January 2, 2017 I think a template like Joey has as a file we can read in CA vs PDF be very helpful. It's more than the notes & views that are easy to modify or delete if not needed I'd like a closer look at. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 For what it's worth, part of me likes how much detail is being required to pull permits now-a-days. Its a bit of a reality check for those who think the software is going to do all the work. Id even like to see licensing requirements for residential design - perhaps AIBD. I am not saying someone would have to be an architect, but some sort of standard that makes "self-entitlement" a thing of the past for our field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parkwest Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 Yeah Johnny, that licensing pipe dream has worked great protecting we the people from bad builders, bad doctors, bad lawyers, bad plumbers, bad drivers, and especially bad marriages!!! lmao Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kMoquin Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 I agree Johnny. In Maine, unfortunately , there is no contractor licensing. You can be a store clerk one day and a builder the next, if you can convince someone to hire you. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 1 hour ago, parkwest said: Yeah Johnny, that licensing pipe dream has worked great protecting we the people from bad builders, bad doctors, bad lawyers, bad plumbers, bad drivers, and especially bad marriages!!! lmao ...and speed limits and laws dont stop everyone from breaking them while hurting others. Doesn't mean we should abandon laws altogether. It just seems a little nuts to me that home appraisers and realtors have to go through a process to get licensed (with continuing education) and yet the most potential dangerous and impactful aspect of structural home design can be done by anyone with CAD (in many states). A bad designer can effect the value of someone's investment more than a bad appraiser or realtor, not to mention down right dangerous. To be perfectly clear, I don't think every home designer needs to be an architect. However, I do think there should be some requirements and licensing involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OkcDesigner Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Ok you all are going to have a good laugh. Here in the heart land a good napkin sketch, will get you a permit. Builders have it down to site plan, floor plan, good to go. I had a return client that used Chief Trial to design his own plan and just pay me to finish it. Banks are doing loans from sales drawings from plan books. The local user base for Chief Architect here is Builders, they fix all issues in field.................. I tell every client. I generally save you more money than I charge. Some get it and some do not. I all ways ask what you call a plan when they ask my fee over the phone. Locals will do plans for $.50 per foot....... yes Site plan and Floor plan......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrownTiger Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 50 minutes ago, OkcDesigner said: Ok you all are going to have a good laugh. Here in the heart land a good napkin sketch, will get you a permit. Builders have it down to site plan, floor plan, good to go. I had a return client that used Chief Trial to design his own plan and just pay me to finish it. Banks are doing loans from sales drawings from plan books. The local user base for Chief Architect here is Builders, they fix all issues in field.................. I tell every client. I generally save you more money than I charge. Some get it and some do not. I all ways ask what you call a plan when they ask my fee over the phone. Locals will do plans for $.50 per foot....... yes Site plan and Floor plan......... I believe you, same in Indiana. No 2 pencil and 8x11 for floorplan and elevations. When I worked for a builder we got one permit under 15 minutes in a different county tho. PermitRequirements.pdf There code enforcement was very nice lady, she would call the builder and ask the receptionist - if what is in her picture is normal and follow the code. Of course the receptionist always said "absolutely we do this all the time" as she did not know anything about construction. And in the said case it was commercial building (salt dome) with the high steel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dssharp Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 10 hours ago, dshall said: a comment..... Joey does a great looking set of plans.... I have always admired his set of plans, they are so clean looking and not cluttered compared to mine.... however based on my experience, he would never be able to pull a permit in California with them. Just a few examples.... footing widths are not specified and there are no shear transfer details, window headers are not spec'd and hip sizes are not called out and there are not king posts under ridge beams spec'd out. Location of vertical steel in retaining walls is not spec'd...... plate heights in sections are not called out and there are only 2 sections , for a house this size and complex, it seems more than 2 sections will be needed. I suppose the point of the post is, you need to understand what the permitting jurisdiction will require. Simply copying someone's method will not always guarantee a permit. I began drawing plans in Houston back in the '70's and Joey's plans would be considered very nice and adequate........ 40 years later in California..... much more info is required . Energy calcs, structural calcs, truss calcs, BMP plans, Brush Management plans, coverage calcs, FAR calcs, impervious area calcs and keeping the wife happy calcs not to mention plans to assure your kids success in life calcs. Anybody in California with little to no experience who thinks they can provide a set of plans , will be in for a big surprise. Yup. 15 to 20 pages(sheets) is the norm here in cali now. on and on and on. Now 2016 codes and compliance. Place is becoming its own friggin country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parkwest Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 2 hours ago, johnny said: ...and speed limits and laws dont stop everyone from breaking them while hurting others. Doesn't mean we should abandon laws altogether. It just seems a little nuts to me that home appraisers and realtors have to go through a process to get licensed (with continuing education) and yet the most potential dangerous and impactful aspect of structural home design can be done by anyone with CAD (in many states). A bad designer can effect the value of someone's investment more than a bad appraiser or realtor, not to mention down right dangerous. To be perfectly clear, I don't think every home designer needs to be an architect. However, I do think there should be some requirements and licensing involved. Bad marriages have destroyed more people and their assets than any bad house design ever did... and marriages are licensed by the state! If licensing is there to reduce risk, shouldn't marriages be outlawed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RGWhite Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Florida is not far behind Cal. The cover sheet must have the minmum see attached. Also for what it is worth the product installation details have to be incorporated into the plans. Some might find it interesting to check out "Florida Approved Products" 24 x 36 layout-Layout.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rashid_Garuba Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 I am am degreed Architectural Engineer but here is my view.... In college I took a course called "Technology and The Human Conscience" which basically covered the state of man after the Machines take over. We know what technology has done to many a field lately.. Even truck drivers better beware next 10 years. In almost all decimated fields, the view before is "can't happen here" until it's too late. I think in Architecture the only aspect that machines/software cannot replace (I better watch my mouth!) is aesthetics.. Anything else, especially safety-related areas CAN be coded to significantly reduce the number of Humans OR the skill-level of those humans involved. This is why design still cannot be off-shored. Ultimately if an industry is inefficient (Taxi Industry-Uber, Law industry-Legalzoom, Hotels-AirBnB), it represents opportunity for the tech guys that won't care if a few Architects are a casualty... Any Architect Chief hires is technically committing treason as the name "Chief Architect" suggests something insidious. So Johnny, fully agree with you BUT the better Software gets, the less we will be needed which puts pressure on fees, thereby improving the standard of living (perceived or real) of the masses. If guys build from napkins and their end-user doesn't care, then you likely won't want such an end-user.. He/she is suited to the non-licensed/degreed "plan drawer"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2wheeltodd Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 1 hour ago, Rashid_Garuba said: I am am degreed Architectural Engineer but here is my view.... In college I took a course called "Technology and The Human Conscience" which basically covered the state of man after the Machines take over. We know what technology has done to many a field lately.. Even truck drivers better beware next 10 years. In almost all decimated fields, the view before is "can't happen here" until it's too late. I think in Architecture the only aspect that machines/software cannot replace (I better watch my mouth!) is aesthetics.. Anything else, especially safety-related areas CAN be coded to significantly reduce the number of Humans OR the skill-level of those humans involved. This is why design still cannot be off-shored. Ultimately if an industry is inefficient (Taxi Industry-Uber, Law industry-Legalzoom, Hotels-AirBnB), it represents opportunity for the tech guys that won't care if a few Architects are a casualty... Any Architect Chief hires is technically committing treason as the name "Chief Architect" suggests something insidious. So Johnny, fully agree with you BUT the better Software gets, the less we will be needed which puts pressure on fees, thereby improving the standard of living (perceived or real) of the masses. If guys build from napkins and their end-user doesn't care, then you likely won't want such an end-user.. He/she is suited to the non-licensed/degreed "plan drawer"... Architecture, engineering, and code compliance will be a software exercise in the future I predict. The art in Architecture will be left to the algorithms sure to come just as the "driverless car" is sure to come. The very software being used in this forum is the stepping stone to those ends sadly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 18 hours ago, parkwest said: Bad marriages have destroyed more people and their assets than any bad house design ever did... and marriages are licensed by the state! If licensing is there to reduce risk, shouldn't marriages be outlawed? Except there is no mandatory schooling or training prerequisite to getting a marriage license - such as courses on being a better husband or wife. Perhaps if there were things would be different in many marriages. When I say people should be licensed I am also suggesting there be training or schooling associated to reinforce the process. Even training under a "master" for some time would be enough for many people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 16 minutes ago, 2wheeltodd said: Architecture, engineering, and code compliance will be a software exercise in the future I predict. The art in Architecture will be left to the algorithms sure to come just as the "driverless car" is sure to come. The very software being used in this forum is the stepping stone to those ends sadly. As it is now there is no "real" reason a pilot has to sit in a plane - except people want to know there is another human on the line between them and a system they dont understand, and have an equal stake in the risk. Perhaps WAY in the future things will be different and everyone on earth will be dedicated to a space program of sorts while computers and robotics run everyday necessities. However, I can promise you there will be nostalgia longing for times we humans did most the mundane work....so we should appropriate what we have now. I think the recent show "Westworld" is an interesting sci-fi depiction of that possible reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe_Carrick Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Golf is still an individual human undertaking. Sometimes I wish for a Golfing Robot - but I would most likely never be able to beat him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rashid_Garuba Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 I will be buried in my Stick-shift V8..! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parkwest Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 3 hours ago, johnny said: Except there is no mandatory schooling or training prerequisite to getting a marriage license - such as courses on being a better husband or wife. Perhaps if there were things would be different in many marriages. When I say people should be licensed I am also suggesting there be training or schooling associated to reinforce the process. Even training under a "master" for some time would be enough for many people. And would your worldview change if you saw a traffic cop on a motorcycle giving a fine to a driver in an SUV for NOT wearing a seatbelt? Who will be the wizard of oz? What is that Latin phrase for, "buyer beware?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTHOMES Posted January 5, 2017 Author Share Posted January 5, 2017 Is there anyone left not too busy divorcing their spouses or moving out of Calinutso? We noobs never did get a good .plan. If I had one I give it up. I guess some won't share think theirs will receive a patent and has never been done before? Just think, more successful noobs, more sales/SSAs, better softwares... Anyhoo. I've been following Joey's excellent sample w/mods and the template Perry pointed to, thx for that....couple of questions working on my custom title block. 1. Joey has a red "copyright stamp" block I cannot find in the library CAD blocks. Is that a stamp I get at Officemax? Seems the proprietary note in the library be enough? 2. Working on my title blocks sideways is a real pain. Is there an easy way to rotate it all temporarily? I tried to click-drag select no cad block option, no rotate handles on sheets? Baffling why some is read @ 90 deg, why not just read it all vertically or horizontally? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenoeightspot Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 1. Make your own stamp like I did or buy from internet. 2. Theory behind title block text being 90 degrees-- you can read the title block information when the drawings are rolled up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joey_martin Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 I received the stamp from AIBD as a part of a seminar years ago. I stamped a sheet of paper and scanned the image in to be added to my plans. As for my templates. It's not that I am being selfish with them, but I offer them as a part of the training sessions I do, so the folks that have taken training with me have "paid" for them, so providing them to other for free doesn't seem right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe_Carrick Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 21 minutes ago, joey_martin said: As for my templates. It's not that I am being selfish with them, but I offer them as a part of the training sessions I do, so the folks that have taken training with me have "paid" for them, so providing them to other for free doesn't seem right. That's very reasonable. I have a similar policy about setting up Templates for other users. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dssharp Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 Yup make sure you have a stamp ... like mr frank loyd wright did. By the way if I'm not mistakin he didn't even graduate high school. Do good work there's your stamp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard_Morrison Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 13 minutes ago, dssharp said: Yup make sure you have a stamp ... like mr frank loyd wright did. By the way if I'm not mistakin he didn't even graduate high school. Do good work there's your stamp. You are mistaken. In addition to two years of college (engineering), he also apprenticed to other architects for an additional six years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dshall Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 6 minutes ago, Richard_Morrison said: You are mistaken. In addition to two years of college (engineering), he also apprenticed to other architects for an additional six years. If I am not mistaken, FLW apprenticed with Louis B. Sullivan who did a lot of Chicago's multi story metal buildings after the great fire. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard_Morrison Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 4 minutes ago, dshall said: If I am not mistaken, FLW apprenticed with Louis B. Sullivan who did a lot of Chicago's multi story metal buildings after the great fire. Correctamundo! (I'll give you point for that...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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