A Little More Anno Set Basics

[Doug_Park]

And - did everybody catch a central point from Dermot:

 

Annotation sets can have an effect when you create text, cad, dimensions etc. - they do not change them afterwards.  So once your text or dimensions are the text style that you want, font, size, layer, etc., that's it, you're fine.  They are a tool for getting there.  It's a bit like driving across town - this route or that route.  Once you get there, well there you are!  

 

This is an important concept. Probably the first concept you need to understand in order to effectively use annotation sets. I like to think of these as "active default" sets.

[DRAWZILLA]

I remember before Anno-sets, it was a real big pain to annotate anything, and have said ,it could be the most time saving feature ever developed, been using them since they started and never looked back. we also wanted something like this for a long time.

[HumbleChief]

Larry's method now makes sense. Like Perry, the use of "Anno" to start the layer set was confusing to me.

I'll remember that for any future videos. When I first started with Anno Sets it was an easy way for me to remember that the Layer was associated with the Anno Set by labeling the Layer with the word Anno which I think reinforces the point that it's important to use whatever works and is comfortable for you and is easy to remember.

[HumbleChief]

I remember before Anno-sets, it was a real big pain to annotate anything, and have said ,it could be the most time saving feature ever developed, been using them since they started and never looked back. we also wanted something like this for a long time.

I so remember that time too Perry before Anno Sets and to me Chief knocked it out of the park when Anno Sets were introduced. Far exceeded my expectations.

[HumbleChief]

Well, sort of, but not across the board.  We can and do assign a specific Annotation Set to a specific "view" in layout.

 

1. Select a layout box - single click only.
2. Open it's dbx via the "Open Object" icon at the bottom of the screen (looks like a door)
3. On the Plan View tab - you can assign an Annotation Set.

When you assign an Annotation Set to a Layout Box, when you double click that layout box to edit the plan, it will then be in the correct Annotation Set for that view.  Any cad, text or dimensions you add will then be on the correct layer, be the correct text style, etc.

 

It's one of the most important reasons we use Annotation Sets.  It's not the changing of defaults for major work that's the time killer.  It's the little edits.  Why?  For major work, maybe it takes 60 seconds to change the defaults, then you do 2 hours worth of work.  For minor edits that 60 seconds (when lobbying for this feature, I counted 14 clicks....) applies to 60 seconds worth of work.  Uh oh, there went sanity and productivity.  Oops.

 

assign_anno_to_layout_box.png

Use this feature all the time. Yuge time saver.

[MoeGia]

I use the layout this way too. BUT, when you're working on framing and want to keep sections (or elevations) up to date with text, it would be wonderful to be able to move between plan and 3D and have each hold it's assigned anno sets.  Cycling into the layout to get to the correct anno set is an extra step.  I can do it, but I don't want to.  If it can remember it there, why can't it remember by switching views????  It breaks the flow and seems like an inconsistency to me.

 

Not to mention it's one of those things that trips people up.  When I think about folks learning this program now, I am very sympathetic.  This is one of those got ya's, that would make everyone's life easier.  How many times a day to you go to the anno set drop down and change the set because it's showing 'using active defaults'?  Too many times for me!  I bounce around between views a lot!

[Dermot]

I still find this odd and would prefer each 'view' to remember the annotation set.  For example; I'm working on framing in plan view, but have multiple sections open so I can transfer beam and post sizing and notes to the sections.  Going back and forth between the views means I have to toggle the annoy set each time because my sections are at 3/8" and plans are at 1/4" scale.

 

 

I don't get this behavior.  I can't tell from your description whether or not you are doing something wrong or if you have found a program bug.

 

The only time I have seen something like this happen is when someone had duplicate annotation sets.  I can't remember seeing another case where switching views would require you to select your annotation set again.

 

Views should always remember the active defaults they are using.  Whether or not the defaults match any of your annotation sets is a separate issue.

 

As long as your annotation sets are always unique, which means that you don't have two annotation sets with the same set of defaults, this will work exactly as if the view remembers the annotation set.  If your annotation sets are ambiguous, then the program will use the first one it finds which can lead to confusion.

 

If the program is not working the way I have described, then I would recommend that you report this as a bug so that we can look into this further.

[WendyatArtform]

I use the layout this way too. BUT, when you're working on framing and want to keep sections (or elevations) up to date with text, it would be wonderful to be able to move between plan and 3D and have each hold it's assigned anno sets.  Cycling into the layout to get to the correct anno set is an extra step.  I can do it, but I don't want to.  If it can remember it there, why can't it remember by switching views????  It breaks the flow and seems like an inconsistency to me.

 

Not to mention it's one of those things that trips people up.  When I think about folks learning this program now, I am very sympathetic.  This is one of those got ya's, that would make everyone's life easier.  How many times a day to you go to the anno set drop down and change the set because it's showing 'using active defaults'?  Too many times for me!  I bounce around between views a lot!

 

 

Maureen,

 

I think I know what you're talking about.  (never mind, re-read post more clearly - i think you do understand how it works, just find it non-intuitive?).

 

But - For most people - important to know:  A saved camera does not remember an Anno Set.  So if you are in a plan and simply open a framing section or an elevation, that's not necesssarily going to be in the annotation set you want.

 

• Enter through layout box - WILL remember Anno Set, IF one is assigned in that Plan View tab.
• Enter through Project Browser - WILL NOT remember Anno Set automatically.  You will  need to use the drop down to select the correct one.  There are still benefits, in that 2 clicks can save you 14.  But still gotta select.

And for me - a solid Feature Request that would benefit many - I think it would be clearer and more intuitive if we could assign Annotation Set to the view itself in the Project Browser.

[Dermot]

A saved camera does not remember an Anno Set.  

 

 

Saved cameras should always remember their active defaults.  As long as your active defaults match one (and only one) of your annotation sets, it will work just like it remembered the annotation set.

 

There should be no difference between opening the camera from plan view, project browser, or layout (as long as you don't send the same camera to multiple layout pages).

 

Plan views are different.  The reason they are different is because you will almost always send the same plan view to different layout pages.  When you open a plan view from a layout page, it should reset the view so that it is using the same defaults that it had when you sent it to the layout page (or the defaults you set when you choose an annotation set in the Layout Box dialog).  In this case, it is the layout box that is remember the defaults because we don't have a saved camera for plan views.

 

I still think that the most important things to understand about annotation sets is that they are just a short cut for changing your active defaults and that all views remember their active defaults.

 

There still seems to be a lot of confusion here.  I'm not sure if my explanations of how the program works is helping.  I apologize if I am not being clear enough.  One thing to keep in mind is that all of my comments above only pertain to X7.  Prior versions did not necessarily work the same way.

[WendyatArtform]

Oops.  What he said!  ;-)

[dshall]

I don't get this behavior.  I can't tell from your description whether or not you are doing something wrong or if you have found a program bug.........

 

 

I said this a few posts ago........

 

 

I think we are all seeing something funny,  I am not sure if any of us can properly explain the behavior without doing a GTM to explain and discuss the inconsistencies.

 

 

Maybe we are not all seeing something funny going on,  but I am and apparently Moe is a bit confused....  not a killer issue for me.... but I think it is there......

 

If I could post a vid I would.......  but the vid gods are against me,  anyway,  I was just able to reproduce MoeGia's issue,  and I concur with her,  I understand what she is complaining about....  there is an issue she is trying to convey with headquarters...   hopefully headquarters will try to find out....

 

 

I am on the phone with GTM now,  maybe they can help me post my vids so I can show what I think MoeGia's issue is.

[dshall]

What is so frustrating to me with these kinds of posts is somebody says the sky is blue and some one else says it is green and that is where it ends.  There is no consenses in regards to who is right.  There must be a way that the two people can get together,  share what they are seeing and then reach a mutual agreement.

 

BTW,  who is right is not important,  what is important is for someone like Moe to be able to get her point across and for someone at headquarters to understand what she is saying and  then for the person at headquarters to show her what she is doing wrong or learn what the issue is.

[jbaehmer]

I don't get this behavior either....Dermot had mentioned that he had seen a similar issue when.  Can either of you post the plan so we can see how the annosets are setup?  It could be in there.

[dshall]

I don't get this behavior either....Dermot had mentioned that he had seen a similar issue when.  Can either of you post the plan so we can see how the annosets are setup?  It could be in there.

Posting a plan is an option,  however,  maybe someone can post a plan and layout that works and let's see if the posted plan and layout works for me....  I bet it will not work correctly... .....

 

JB,  please post a very quick down and dirty layout with a  plan file attached,  I would bet it does not work as I and Moe would like it to work.

[Joe_Carrick]

I barely have time to play golf - I'm pretty sure I don't have time to figure out what problem you are having.  I'm sure it has to do with a sequence of events - but I'm not sure what sequence you are using that doesn't work for you.  

[dshall]

I barely have time to play golf - I'm pretty sure I don't have time to figure out what problem you are having.  I'm sure it has to do with a sequence of events - but I'm not sure what sequence you are using that doesn't work for you.  

 

Well,  if it is only Moe Gia and I that have this issue,  it is probably not an issue,  we shall let it die a quiet death.

[Joe_Carrick]

I didn't say it was only you and Moe.  I might also have the issue - but I don't know what the issue is.  OTOH, maybe I don't have it ..................................... SDC

[dshall]

...... but I don't know what the issue is. ........

I don't know what the issue is either.  It's a non issue,  it's Monday night football tonight!  The Chargers won,  the Cowboys won,  life does not get much better.

[Dermot]

I would love to figure out what the problem is. 

 

If you can't post a video, then maybe you can post a plan that demonstrates the problem along with some very clear steps as to what you are doing. 

[johnny]

I could be way off base here, but I think the problem is that what they have visible in floor plan view isnt visible in any other camera view.  Views aren't attached to the layer-set process.

[dshall]

I could be way off base here, but I think the problem is that what you have visible in floor plan view should also be what is visible in any other camera view and its not.  Views aren't attached to the layer-set process.

Yep,  way off base.

[johnny]

Yep, way off base.

You mean this doesn't say that?:

 

I still find this odd and would prefer each 'view' to remember the annotation set. For example; I'm working on framing in plan view, but have multiple sections open so I can transfer beam and post sizing and notes to the sections. Going back and forth between the views means I have to toggle the annoy set each time because my sections are at 3/8" and plans are at 1/4" scale.

 

I would prefer to have the annotation set be remembered with the view.  I understand that plan view isn't static and can change for foundation, framing, plan views, etc, (although it would be helpful to have the foundation also remember it's annotation set).

[dshall]

I would love to figure out what the problem is. 

 

If you can't post a video, then maybe you can post a plan that demonstrates the problem along with some very clear steps as to what you are doing. 

Dermot,  I appreciate this,  but if Moe cannot explain it in her first thread,  and if I can't explain it in follow up threads,  I doubt another stab by me will be effective.  

 

If nobody else has the problem,  then Moe and I do not know what we are doing.  However,  if you are interested in teaching me what I am doing wrong,  I bet in a 4m minute  GTM  I can show you what Moe and I are looking for.

[dshall]

You mean this doesn't say that?:

 

I still find this odd and would prefer each 'view' to remember the annotation set. For example; I'm working on framing in plan view, but have multiple sections open so I can transfer beam and post sizing and notes to the sections. Going back and forth between the views means I have to toggle the annoy set each time because my sections are at 3/8" and plans are at 1/4" scale.

 

I would prefer to have the annotation set be remembered with the view.  I understand that plan view isn't static and can change for foundation, framing, plan views, etc, (although it would be helpful to have the foundation also remember it's annotation set).

JPC,  you might be correct,  but I cannot follow what you are saying.  As I said about 58 posts ago,  this is probably a situation where it takes a GTM to explain what the issue is.

 

I think I know what Moe is saying.  Her position makes perfect sense to me....  in fact I could expound on what she is saying.  

[dshall]

At the UGM I believe I learned that it was Dermot that came up with the ANNO set concept,  a huge time saver.  Wendy in a prior post talked about how the anno sets saved  14 clicks,  I agree,  the anno sets saved clicks.  What Moe is referring to is fine tuning the anno set concept to save a few more clicks.