johnny Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Richard, Saving $15000 in additional Architectural Fees cost that person $2500+ for Chief Architect and probably $50000 in additional construction costs. This is a very true statement - and i'll add they probably get at least 30% (maybe more) less for their home when they sell it. These kinds of prints are an unethical builders dream. Heck, even ethical builders need to be called to task here and there on issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRAWZILLA Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 You guys are just dreaming up things that almost never happens. Of course, there are some designs that can never should be done. but your ego's are just nuts. I would never hire an Architect with that attitude. This thread has become, you guys strutting around like your some kind of god. Face the fact ,you are not the only ones that can design, weather the design is good or not is in the eye of the beholder. It's kind of like me saying your designs stink, having never seen any. Get real, your license really doesn't mean crap unless you have some talent. You'll starve to death. There is nothing wrong to design within a budget and not do what I would like to see b/c I'm god. You'll get more clients that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRAWZILLA Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 I disagree, you can't possibly be the only one who decides good design, the eye of the beholder could be another Architect or designer for sure. Never seen any of your work, i'll bet I could pick it to pieces, just like anyone could. Of course you try to discourage something that doesn't work. Maybe try to make it work, that's your job. What if someone really dislikes your design? Do you make it work, or say its my way or the highway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joey_martin Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Perry, while I hesitate to get into this at all, I am sure you are missing the point that Richard is trying to make. During my time in arch school, I was taught what good design was. It doesn't really matter what you, I, or anyone else thinks of it (per say). but are the proportions correct? Does the design have proper massing, scale, balance....etc. Textbook design, when done with these things in mind, doesn't care what you think is aesthetically pleasing, it is simply proper design. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kbird1 Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 " but are the proportions correct? Does the design have proper massing, scale, balance....etc." I don't really want to make this thread any longer but I am unsure why certain people only think an Architect can know anything about these things ? wow.... On a Sidebar which is why I Posted really , is that the OP is disgusted in how this thread has gone on and on with the DIY/Designer Bashing and She is now worried about having to deal with Architect's..... So nice going..... M. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gawdzira Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 This thread is an embarrassment to this forum. Take this discussion out of the Seeking Services area of the forum. I have no problem with the content, just the location. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbaehmer Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 This thread is an embarrassment to this forum. Take this discussion out of the Seeking Services area of the forum. I have no problem with the content, just the location. Agreed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lbuttery Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 agreed, it should be in the chatroom Lew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRAWZILLA Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Perry, while I hesitate to get into this at all, I am sure you are missing the point that Richard is trying to make. During my time in arch school, I was taught what good design was. It doesn't really matter what you, I, or anyone else thinks of it (per say). but are the proportions correct? Does the design have proper massing, scale, balance....etc. Textbook design, when done with these things in mind, doesn't care what you think is aesthetically pleasing, it is simply proper design. I also learned Architecture in college, good design is really what you make it. What you did learn is good design, as decided by your teacher. And I don't think I'm missing any point. When I hire someone to do drafting for me , I want it done my way. I also know what good proportion is, but it might not be what you think. That is why I try to come up with something that pleases everyone that works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRAWZILLA Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Agreed this is nuts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 (to start, i too agree this thread should be moved) I couldn't disagree more with this notion. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, of course, but the sad fact is that others have to live with the consequences of bad design. Just because you like the color orange, and think a house looks great when it's painted bright orange, doesn't make it good design, or appropriate for a neighborhood. There are objective principles to good design (proportion, scale, harmony, etc.) that are independent of opinion. I 100% concur with this (and what Joey said). Taste and good design are completely separate things. Something can be to one's taste, but be poorly designed. Flip side, something can be well designed but not per one's taste. As most probably know, Architects (and good designers) of the world have been using golden proportions for millenniums: Though I dont whip out a calculator to calculate the placement of everything, I often to overlay a "golden rectangle" over sections of my work for good mass proportion - but with practice you actually start to be able to eye-ball these proportions. In Vectorworks we have a Golden ratio tool-tip that is very nice. Here at practice in a simple home (found on internet): Again, this isn't an architect vs designer argument IMO. However, with an architect you know to some degree they have had schooling/training in design principles. I bet many here already know about golden proportions, but I run into lots of designers who dont. A good designer can learn the same things, and put them into practice, but i've found that to be an exception over the rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kbird1 Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 This thread is an embarrassment to this forum. Take this discussion out of the Seeking Services area of the forum. I have no problem with the content, just the location. Agreed it is getting outta hand..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 This thread is an embarrassment to this forum. Take this discussion out of the Seeking Services area of the forum. I have no problem with the content, just the location. As I said in my previous comment, I agree with you guys this thread should be moved - but in the OP comment, this question is what spurred the discussion: "We are at a point we need to partner with a professional to finish the plan (for sure the roof needs work), ensure the structure is safe and meets local regulations, etc. My thinking is that an architect currently using Chief would make this process much more effiencient due to the software compatability. Is this a proven approach?" We are seeing just how open-ended that question can be. ...but yes, please move this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRAWZILLA Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 thinking is that an architect currently using Chief simply--NO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe_Carrick Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 simply--NO Perry, If she has said: thinking is that a good architect or home designer currently using Chief wouldn't your answer be YES ? You could probably have made that condition very early and we wouldn't be sounding like a couple of warring tribes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lbuttery Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Is this a proven approach?" Johnny: see my reply in post #2 I took her query to be "can an architect using Chief Premier work with my HD PRO plans ???" BTW: I know about the Golden Ratio ('ve read Vitruvius and Palladio) does that make me a good designer Lew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lbuttery Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 It was post #4 and #5 that started the firestorm ... Lew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRAWZILLA Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Joe , most people have no idea what Architect means, I have had to correct many. Most people call me an Architect not knowing. I do explain the difference to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yusuf-333 Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 With out being an architect some one may think he has the talent to design, but that can't be well with out applying architectural science some how in his works, I mean if he believe that he can't design with out referring different tools and compiled architects data then it is obvious he respects architecture and the architect. But believe me, if there is some one here arguing design with out the knowledge of architectural science is OK , he really misses the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Is this a proven approach?" Johnny: see my reply in post #2 I took her query to be "can an architect using Chief Premier work with my HD PRO plans ???" BTW: I know about the Golden Ratio ('ve read Vitruvius and Palladio) does that make me a good designer Lew Look at it this way - In the modern art scene there is a category of art call "abstract". I think a popular comment from some people is "my 3 year old could make that", yet to art connoisseurs they can see the compositional differences with ease. In fact, I would propose that if you had a 3 year old paint abstract art and placed it side-by-side with a professional piece, most people would be drawn to the better composition in mass - even though they might not be able to identify "what" makes it "look" or "feel" more pleasing to the eyes. If you employ good composition, one of which being appropriate proportions (ie Golden Proportions), then your learning about these ratios will indeed help your designs. Yes, I do believe that. Here is a neat little article you might like - http://www.emis.de/journals/NNJ/Salingaros.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRAWZILLA Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 No one is, Yusuf. Good design is good design, no matter who does It, and who see's it. Everyone applies the best knowledge they can, some good some not so good. the marketplace will determine. Certainly not someone on this forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lbuttery Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Johnny: BTW: I hate "modern art" (99%) I dislike "modern architecture" (80%) Lew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 It was post #4 and #5 that started the firestorm ... Lew ....lol You're right, it had nothing to do with #6 in saying - "You probably don't need an Architect", "building design can be done by anyone including yourself", and "Architect's always try to scare everyone". That obviously had nothing to do with this thread going this way. #4 pointed out you can't legally say "architectural design" (which is true), and #5 I pointed out that a layman DIY shouldn't think they can design a home without professional help. Not one post have I made a distinction between a good designer and architect. I made the distinction between a DIY and a professional. If you honestly think that "anyone" can buy box software and design their home, and have it turn out well, then you basically devalue what you (and we) do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lbuttery Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Johnny: I doubt if post #6 would have been made without post #4 and #5 I know that architects can "usually" provide a better design than I can or "most" self-taught designers Again, I have referred a number of clients to seek out an architect but my only complaint is that the architects stop chiding us "selfers" for doing a dis-service to our clients I still believe if the client is happy then that is the bottom line everything else is just one opinion versus another get 10 or 100 architects in a room and I seriously doubt there will be "consensus" on whether certain plans are "ugly" can you really drive down the highway and know for certain that some of those "ugly" designs that you despise weren't done by an architect ??? Lew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRAWZILLA Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 I think the lady was talking about her home, and I'm sure anyone can design that. Weather its good or not is to be determined. That was a correct statement Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Please sign in to comment
You will be able to leave a comment after signing in
Sign In Now