Doug_N Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 Does anyone know how to show brackets supporting handrails on the wall side of a stairway? A plans examiner wants me to show them on the drawing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRAWZILLA Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 I DO IT WITH A CAD DETAIL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chopsaw Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 Symbols will show in plan view if you can find some. Maybe 3D warehouse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug_N Posted February 25, 2019 Author Share Posted February 25, 2019 Drawzilla, they want them in all views. What a pain. Chopsaw, I will give that a try. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRAWZILLA Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 2 minutes ago, Doug_N said: Drawzilla, they want them in all views. What a pain. Chopsaw, I will give that a try. Thanks. That's a ridicules request if you ask me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug_N Posted February 25, 2019 Author Share Posted February 25, 2019 I couldn't agree more. Some of the plans examiners get bored if there isn't a lot of work going through, and a very few of them play power games. The vast majority are very professional and helpful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rikdekker Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 you can show a cad detail as @DRAWZILLA suggested and then mark them with and x denoting "hand rail bracket" for all of the other views. Add a legend explaining the "x"s. Otherwise; pretty easy to build a close facsimile with poly line solids and add it to your library. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robdyck Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 13 hours ago, Doug_N said: Drawzilla, they want them in all views. What a pain. I've been there as well, Doug. I pushed back as far as showing brackets in all views at least in a residential project (and luckily, they conceded). I manually place brackets and I show them in the stair section view only and I always include a 'stair section' drawing that is clipped; No structural detail in this section, stair info only. On commercial plans, I include a large scale plan view drawing for the stairs and that's what I'd do for a residential plan if / when I had to. I've used some of the library brackets which look close enough when shrunk to the correct size, but for metal handrail brackets that might be used on an exterior rail, I've made my own. Also made my own 'cat's paw' wood handrail brackets. Keep in mind that if you're actually providing a stair detail which includes hand / guard rail details, Chief's auto rail is too close to the wall for Canada's codes. I always draw my own rails whenever I need to include details to ensure my rail profile and placement is code compliant. And I find it faster to build the model accurately, and then just 'take pictures' whether it's a section view or a 3D detail. I find it easier to update my drawings (that way) when my clients make changes after the drawings are complete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robdyck Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 I figured I'd show the difference between Chief's handrail placement versus a code compliant handrail placement. I've put a request in to Chief to allow us to specify the offset of the handrail. In the screenshot, the 'y' bracket I placed is the minimum distance from the wall according to the National Building Code of Canada. If we could specify the offset, that would simplify the process and allow the visualization tools to match real world requirements. Curious if anyone knows how to get Chief to connect these handrails? It can't be easy because Chief currently doesn't draw handrails on walls following stairs correctly. Chief holds the handrails' height as the specified distance in the 'z' axis meaning a 2" rail doesn't measure 2" perpendicular to its direction, but holds it as 2" vertically. Hopefully this also gets corrected soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug_N Posted February 26, 2019 Author Share Posted February 26, 2019 3 hours ago, robdyck said: I figured I'd show the difference between Chief's handrail placement versus a code compliant handrail placement. I've put a request in to Chief to allow us to specify the offset of the handrail. In the screenshot, the 'y' bracket I placed is the minimum distance from the wall according to the National Building Code of Canada. If we could specify the offset, that would simplify the process and allow the visualization tools to match real world requirements. Curious if anyone knows how to get Chief to connect these handrails? It can't be easy because Chief currently doesn't draw handrails on walls following stairs correctly. Chief holds the handrails' height as the specified distance in the 'z' axis meaning a 2" rail doesn't measure 2" perpendicular to its direction, but holds it as 2" vertically. Hopefully this also gets corrected soon. Yup the Ontario Building Code requires 100mm space between the handrail and the wall and that all handrails be continuous. Most examiners will allow that to be covered in notes, but you get the odd one that requires it to be shown in a detail. Good luck appealing to a supervisor, because from that moment on every job that you submit is going to get the magnifying treatment. Weeks will drag into months to get a permit. It only takes one plan examiner in a department to tar you as a problem designer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HumbleChief Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 Wow, its so hard to keep up the stupid these days - feeling your pain.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug_N Posted February 26, 2019 Author Share Posted February 26, 2019 Sorry misquoted the code, the max intrusion into the stairwell is 100mm (4") and the space between the handrail and the wall is 50mm (2"). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justmejerry Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 Doug, in the O.B.C. 3.4.6.5 Handrails "(11) The clearance between a handrail and any surface behind it shall not be less than 50mm." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justmejerry Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 For a minute I thought someone forgot to send me the memo about changes lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug_N Posted February 26, 2019 Author Share Posted February 26, 2019 3 minutes ago, justmejerry said: Doug, in the O.B.C. 3.4.6.5 Handrails "(11) The clearance between a handrail and any surface behind it shall not be less than 50mm." And in O.B.C 9.8.7.5. Ergonomic Design (1) A clearance of not less than 50 mm shall be provided between a handrail and any surface behind it. 9.8.7.6. Projections into Stairs and Ramps (1) Handrails and projections below handrails, including handrail supports and stair stringers, shall not project more than 100 mm into the required width of a stair or ramp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug_N Posted February 26, 2019 Author Share Posted February 26, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRAWZILLA Posted February 27, 2019 Share Posted February 27, 2019 6 hours ago, HumbleChief said: Wow, its so hard to keep up the stupid these days - feeling your pain.... I WOULD HAVE JUST TAKEN OUT THE 3D VIEWS OF THE STAIRS, PROBLEM SOLVED. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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