Inset Kitchen Cabinets

[PamelaMellon]

Any good round about's on how to show the vertical cabinet lines in elevation view for Inset Cabinets, Cabinet Line Modular lines in layer options shows entire construction of box Looking to display Vertical line where cabinets abut, so division of frames are indicated, so cabinets do not read a a combined cabinet. Other the the obvious CAD lines which will not update with any modification to cabinet size during design development, layout etc.

[Alaskan_Son]

If I'm reading correctly, place a toe kick manually and then you can just use the Module Lines.

[PamelaMellon]

Yes. Exactly.

 

[Alaskan_Son]

3 minutes ago, solver said:

What I showed above was just to understand what you wanted, and did not represent a way to accomplish it.

 

I don't have an answer.

 

I once tried to do the same thing and attempted to use a molding on the countertop offset to cover the toe kick. Looked good in elevation, not so good in 3D. 

 

 

I feel like I must be missing something because the Cabinets, Module Lines layer should do exactly what you're looking for. 

[Alaskan_Son]

7 minutes ago, solver said:

How do you get rid of this extra line? It only shows on the ends that are not against another cabinet or a wall.

 

 

That's where the manual toe kick comes into play. It's more accurate anyway.  Those are typically installed as a separate molding and not part of the cabinet.

[PamelaMellon]

Looks like all ways suggested is an additional layer of work. K&B design is a finite and exact area of design. Boxes plus pizzazz. I was thinking that in cabinet defaults there could be a "preference option" that allows, modulation of line display of Face Items in elevation; can designate fill, line style etc. and how cabinets appear in plan view.

The display Cabinet Modular lines, exists in OLP, but when doing presentation drawings it is not an option, way to confusing to the client, they are not interested in how the cabinet in constructed. UGH. perhaps with next release this option will be available. 

 

Thank you for your reply!

[PamelaMellon]

Just as an aside. Chief is pretty invested in the Kitchen & Bath industry, supporter of NKBA exam prep etc. It would behove them to address an issue such as this that, while easily addressed if working in CAD, would serve them well. Just say'n!

 

[TheKitchenAbode]

In an elevation view you can snap vertical cad lines to the cabinet bank abutments. They snap at the very top of the cabinet, for base units with a counter top this snap point is the very top of the counter top.

 

Would look like this.

 

[Dermot]

Turning on the cabinet module lines will show all of the pieces of the cabinet.  For frameless cabinets, it will also show you that we are faking them by building them with a 3/4" thick face frame.  This means that you may have a bunch of lines on the cabinet faces and sides that you might not really want.

 

To solve your problem, all you need to do is make every other cabinet a different material.  Just make a copy of the plan material that you are using.  You don't actually need to make any changes to how the material looks.  This solution takes advantage of the fact the program will only merge surfaces when they are using the exact same material.

 

[PamelaMellon]

Thank you Dermot, busy week and just getting a chance to get back to this. Just tested and your suggestion is brilliant.

With inset cabinets the switching of materials ( boxes only)  can be nuanced if a quick view is required to show a client in the preliminary stages. Usually WC with LO.

Its the plan set presented elevations etc. that is important, showing combined cabinets  (which we often do) and individual cabinets as they will be built in reality.

 

Thank you for your insight. Greatly appreciated.

 

 

[PamelaT]

Hi Dermot, back again with the same issue... I can not achieve the cabinet separation (for Inset Cabinets) in Elevation/Layout view by tweaking the finish- color etc of abutting cabinets. Did something change in X12

 

Thanks

[Ridge_Runner]

@PamelaTProbably need to "tag" him to make sure he looks at this thread again. Just type "@" without the quotation marks and continuing typing his username until the list that appears shows the usernames you can scroll thru. Click on his and it will notify him. @Dermot

[MarkMc]

12 hours ago, PamelaT said:

. I can not achieve the cabinet separation (for Inset Cabinets) in Elevation/Layout view by tweaking the finish- color etc of abutting cabinets. Did something change in X12 

 

Thanks

Do you have Cabinet Module lines turned on? They show fine for me without messing with textures.

These ALL have the same material, and use the OOB K&B template

I've been showing inset cabinets correctly in elevation for quite a few years now without messing with materials or jumping through hoops (toe kick is a bit of a PIA). Perhaps post a screen shot and a quick plan with a saved camera? As Alaskan Son said last year- feel like I'm missing something?

[rgardner]

4 hours ago, MarkMc said:

Do you have Cabinet Module lines turned on? They show fine for me without messing with textures.

These ALL have the same material, and use the OOB K&B template

I've been showing inset cabinets correctly in elevation for quite a few years now without messing with materials or jumping through hoops (toe kick is a bit of a PIA). Perhaps post a screen shot and a quick plan with a saved camera? As Alaskan Son said last year- feel like I'm missing something?

Mark has WAY more experience than me on this but I don't have an issue as well.  Could it be that you are trying to do it in another view other than vector?  it wont show the lines in standard view for example.

[PamelaT]

Hi all, yes understand that have the cabinet modular lines turned on will allow divisions to be shown, but it indicates how the cabinet is built, which is distracting in presentations. In the past just tweaking the finish would indicate divisions in the elevations, however in X12 this is not possible @Dermot 

[MarkMc]

31 minutes ago, PamelaT said:

cabinet modular lines turned on will allow divisions to be shown, but it indicates how the cabinet is built, which is distracting in presentations

Then why not simply turn them off in that view? you can either do that on the fly with the ALDO of have a dedicated layerset. I reallly don't understand. What type of view are you using, vector, standard, watercolor w/lines, other? Post a screen shot.

Follows Module lines ON,

then OFF,

then watercolor w/lines module lines off.

I used an old plan of beaded inset just in case there was a migration or other issue, didn't bother with toe kick as I rarely do.

BTW you can usually get rid of the toe on the ends by making the side unfinished. I always specify finishes in the OIP rather than rely on the automatic ones so not an issue for me in schedules.

[Dermot]

It's my understanding that Pamela wants to display just the lines between the cabinet boxes but not all of the face frame parts.  Turning on the layer for the module lines will give you all of the lines and is not what she wants. 

 

In X11 and prior, you could get the box edge lines just by making the two adjacent cabinets have different materials.  This was the "trick" I posted back in 2019.  In X12, this behavior was changed, probably accidentally when we were working on other cabinet features, and changing the material no longer adds the box lines.  Apparently, no one noticed or reported this to us until recently when Pamela contacted tech support. We will look into this more but I can't make any promises on when a fix might be available.

 

For now, you can either turn on the module lines layer and get all of the lines or you could try making one cabinet as little as 1/16" deeper or offset from the wall (but these may have other unwanted side effects).  You could also send your views to layout using plot lines and remove/add the lines you want but this is considerable more manual work than what worked before.  I don't know if someone else can think of another way to get Pamela the results she wants.

 

[PamelaT]

 

That's what I thought Dermot that something switched in X12... here is an elevation done with the tweaking of materials to get the desired effect in elevation view. For our business it is important that we give the exact representation of how the cabinet boxes will look. While we often Gang Build multiple cabinets together this does not pose a problem, but when we are independently placing cabinets it is important that the client understand how things will actually look, as we have clients sign off of final drawings. Hope we can get that little work around back soon. And thank for the clarification for everyone who was kind enough to chime in and help me out @Dermot 

[MarkMc]

18 minutes ago, PamelaT said:

here is an elevation done with the tweaking of materials to get the desired effect in elevation view.

I understand now; never been an issue for me and I find it useful to have the same elevations for the client as I am sending to the mfg, to each their own.

Until you get what you want this works. If I wanted what you are after I'd be doing this before playing with materials.

 

Take elevation with cabinet module lines ON, take a detail from view, when that opens select only the module lines, I blocked them but can be done otherwise, copy, go back to the elevation and turn module lines off, paste and hold position. At least until you get what you want quickly. Only downside is the lines are not live if you make changes. Blocking them gives a visual indicator if something changed. Then can either redo the detail and block OR if only one or two changes unblock and point to point move the desired lines.

 

[PamelaT]

Thanks Mark, The work around available in X11 was far simpler for us since we do not do elevation views in color.

have a great weekend.

 

[MarkMc]

39 minutes ago, PamelaT said:

since we do not do elevation views in color. 

Works the same in black and white