renosud

Mystery Materials

Recommended Posts

Hi,

I seem to have a lot of materials that have accumulated in my main template plan materials list [view plan materials from the materials format painter]. I have made sure the plan is entirely empty with no walls or content anywhere, including deleting all CAD Details just in case. The list is showing some 85 materials as 'in use', but from where? The problem is that when the model is exported as a 3DS files for use in other 3D modelling software, it exports all the materials [including the mystery list of 85] which can quickly exceed the upper limit [of usually 100 separate materials] set by many modelling tools. As a result, the 3D models tend not to work. I am completely baffled as to a] where Chief is picking these up from as 'in use' and b] How to get rid of them? 

Any ideas?

Many thanks

Clive

Mystery Materials.png

Edited by renosud
Typo

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Have you checked Default Settings>Materials? This is where many, many material definitions reside:

5a3a701ab01b6_materialsdbx.thumb.PNG.2d0507ec99a782f708f01cea5567ceda.PNG

 

Also, many other subcategories within the Default Settings hold material definitions:

5a3a70603cd07_componentdbx.thumb.PNG.543990b8797ce5b173e0dfb0a4a2fb47.PNG

 

And you can purge material definitions that are not longer defined for use in the 3D>Materials>Plan Materials dialog box:

purge.thumb.PNG.a25ecdf83ee1227c78f684c8dce741f2.PNG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, renosud said:

The list is showing some 85 materials as 'in use', but from where?

 

I suspect that you have developed your template plan over time, using it on projects in the past. Those materials that then show up as "in use" are not actually in use but were in use at one time. That indicates that you have become the effect of your own operating basis. In other words, the way you have been using your template plan is the cause of the excess, unwanted, leftover materials. My advice is to review what you have been doing and change your operating basis which is causing the results you are seeing.

 

DJP

  • Upvote 1
  • Downvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There may also be some objects that still exist in your template that you are just not seeing.

Turn on all layers, then check every Floor Level, and delete anything that shouldn't be there.

Also check CAD Details, Elevations and Sections.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And use the Purge button if you see Unused Materials on the List.......

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Everybody,

Thanks for the ideas. Have checked the purge angle. Everything that is there is tagged 'in-use' with nothing to purge. To clarify David's point, this is my template plan [saved as a template] that has indeed developed over time, but doesn't everybody do that? Have checked all sections/elevations etc, and all floors with 'all on' layer set - nothing hiding there. If anybody wants to take a look, you can download it from the link below. [Chief X9 - latest release]. Off to bed here in the South of France, so will pop back tomorrow to see if any of you guys can shed some light on it. As always, many thanks for your generosity and patience. 

Best wishes

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ngF1TwBNNS8ISVsPRszSzYvL0sXf5FU4/view?usp=sharing

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You haven't specified exactly which materials are a mystery, but looking down the list you posted, I quickly found the following:

 

602 Greentea Concrete

5a3ae1de6e011_602GreenteaConcrete.thumb.PNG.3e48e51cd3d287d310b6d2fd2b30d772.PNG

 

2980 North Cove - 520 Italian Stucco

5a3ae1f4c33a6_2980NorthCove-520ItalianStucco.thumb.PNG.12ec010be987a015b2090cd3f9b382ea.PNG

 

2713 Bona Vista - B37 Concrete

5a3ae20c026ae_2713BonaVista-B37Concrete.thumb.PNG.e92a25922fb258afcd0f3d2e3522d08c.PNG

 

2091 Soiree - 701 Iron Horse

5a3ae21d7495a_2091Soiree-701IronHorse.thumb.PNG.75c85a8e2e9eab5d93683370bb91fdce.PNG

 

They can all be discovered if you follow the advice of my first reply to your post. Yes, you have to dig a bit, but none of them are a mystery.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Robert,

 

OK it's clear now. I can see that they are not a mystery. In fact I opened a chief example plan and realised that even without adding user materials during the evolution of a plan,  there are over 60 materials by default in the plan materials list sitting in the background. This just needs careful management because it's very easy to build up over 100 different defined materials. Technically, just to clarify for any Sketchfab users, as soon as the 'different materials ' passes 100, the model is rendered to a single default material as confirmed by the technical helpline. This does not mean just a count of the list of different materials in the 3DS export [which is then zipped for upload to Sketchfab]. Often the listed materials in the export can be as few as 20-30. The issue appears to be that the 3DS file itself embeds all of the default materials in the polygon architecture [even if there is no supporting texture file]. I have tested this by first deleting some of the exported material jpegs from the 3DS export to 'reduce' the materials, which had a minimal effect. What actually worked in the end was going into the plan materials list and merging many materials to reduce the whole list to less than 100.

 

Here's an example of a typical sketchfab model for our type of complex renovation projects in the South of France: typical sketchfab project Our clients, from all over the world, love this kind of interaction and so when you suddenly have to stop sending them models because the materials count passes 100 and the models fail, they get withdrawal symptoms. The Chief 3D viewer is too basic for us and does not present the same ultra professional image as sketchfab.  Any other sketchfab users will need also to be cautious in managing the total number of materials to less than 100. As a final point, I asked the technical guys at sketchfab if this upper limit could be increased, which they are considering. Sketchfab is really a 3D artist modelling platform, but they are aware that they are missing significant commercial opportunity for small architectural firms, who because of the complexity of the models, will quickly pass the 100 materials threshold. 

 

Many thanks

Clive

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, renosud said:

that has indeed developed over time, but doesn't everybody do that?

 

No, I make my templates from scratch for each new version using the fresh "profile.plan" as its basis. To use an older version's template plan just brings old baggage with it. Customizing a new profile.plan only takes a few minutes to do per - version and is what I do.

 

DJP

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi David,

Thanks so much for the clarification, that's interesting. If I understand you correctly, you use the default Chief profile.plan [unadulterated] and then add back in what you want? Does that mean importing all your custom wall styles, annotation sets/ layer sets etc each time? e.g. you do not save all this into the profile.plan and make tweaks etc to the profile.plan as the base template?

CP

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, renosud said:

Does that mean importing all your custom wall styles, annotation sets/ layer sets etc each time? e.g. you do not save all this into the profile.plan and make tweaks etc to the profile.plan as the base template?

Yes, that is what I mean and do. Wall definitions can be exported and then imported later into your current profile.plan

 

DJP

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I concur with David's approach.  I would add though that walls can also just be stored in the library too so you don't even need to go through the export/import process.  You can be a lot more selective that way too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi David/Alaskan Son,

Wow. It never even occurred to me to put the walls in the library. A fantastic and super flexible way to keep, use and amend them. Many thanks. I'll really look at David's method here, it's clearly a more controlled and clean way to work. I suppose bad habits stick an really bad habits really stick.

CP

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Walls, Material Regions, Doors, Windows, Cabinets and many other things can be stored in the Library.  Organizing the Library into Folders is really important for efficiency.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Would someone please confirm below or post the file info for Profile.Plan for X9 please  ie Date size etc , a pic from Explorer would work fine I think, I am unsure if mine is "clean" any longer as the two files now have different dates  ie the one in the Data Folder is newer than the backup one in C:\Programs\CA\Templates , but I am not 100% sure it is Clean either....

 

Or post a "known" clean version please.

 

Thanks,

 

M.

 

 

Capture66.JPG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, DavidJPotter said:

Mick, you can just reinstall X9 and get your own "fresh copy" of the profile.plan.

 

DJP

 

Yes, that was why I asked someone to post a copy and I didn't want to reinstall , in case it messed something else up by setting everything to OOB settings again...... eg Preferences etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Kbird1 said:

 

Yes, that was why I asked someone to post a copy and I didn't want to reinstall , in case it messed something else up by setting everything to OOB settings again...... eg Preferences etc.

 

I would post a fresh copy except mine is no longer "fresh".  I use that profile plan as my personal template.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks Michael..... how about the backup file in C\Programs\Chief Arch.\Templates ?    or have you alter that backup like me already too?

 

 

Another Question , I have on this is , what can be re-imported without possibly messing up a "Fresh Copy" ?

 

  1.        Anno Sets
  2.        Layers Sets
  3.        Macros
  4.        Wall Defs
  5.        Toolbar Configs
  6.        HotKeys
  7.        Line Styles

anything else ?  or none of the above ? 

 

I am thinking Importing the Defaults would be a bad idea but I am thinking about everything in there like Text Styles etc , or are they included with the Annoset anyway?

 

 

Maybe I should make a new Topic on this ?

 

M.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, JJohnson said:

Hardly used

Fresh Untitled 1.plan

 

Thanks JJohnson

 

everyone should have a backup Profile.Plan file in C:\Programs\Chief Arch.x9\Templates of all Chief OOB Templates , just in case they ruin the ones ( like me) in the Chief Data folder at : My Documents\Chief Architect Premier X9 Data  in my case I think I may have accidentally edited that already.

 

I looked on CA website in case they had a Download for such issues but couldn't find one....

 

Mick

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Regarding templates, you should not modify the ones installed in the program folder. In fact, you should probably not modify anything installed in the program folder.  If you have, I would recommend that you uninstall and reinstall the program.

 

Modifying the ones in your data folder is OK but I think it is preferred to create new templates rather then modify the ones shipped with Chief.  You can always make your template the default for new plans by changing your preferences so there really is no reason that you need to modify the ones we ship.

 

On a side note, I would never trust that a template plan posted on this forum is actually the same as the most current one that gets installed.

 

If all else fails, contact tech support for more help.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi  thanks Dermot , I am not 100% sure if I have altered the one in the Programs folder , it is different size from the one in My Data folder though ( and it is a different size than the one posted by JJ too) that was why I was trying to find out the File Size etc of a "clean" Profile.Plan File. 

 

But I may have accessed and accidentally saved it ( Used Save icon , instead of Save As Icon), after accidentally altering the one in the Data Folder too, while doing a test plan, helping here on the Forums. 

 

Mick.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Please sign in to comment

You will be able to leave a comment after signing in



Sign In Now

  • Member Statistics

    27619
    Total Members
    6254
    Most Online
    Ino-DEC
    Newest Member
    Ino-DEC
    Joined
  • Similar Content

    • By Renerabbitt
      POST 0
       
      You've found it! A thread offering up some of my favorite symbols and content for Chief Architect X-11.
      These items are for X-11 only. If you haven't updated yet I encourage you to do so, it's a great release.
      The following content is listed by category with both a link to the post within this thread for easy navigation and a link to a direct download if you won't to cut straight to the chase. new/recent uploads are in RED font
      CLICK ON THE "DL" FOR INSTANT .CALIBZ DOWNLOAD:

       
      CONSTRUCTION ASSEMBLIES/ARCHITECTURAL ITEMS:
      RABS 42 CABLE RAILING - DL    RABS MODERN FRONT DOOR AND DOOR ASSEMBLY - DL   RABS INTEGRATED SINK - DL NEW!!! 03/26/2020  
      ENTOURAGE:
      RABS CHARLES-HILL GROUPED LIVING ROOM - DL RABS CHELTON GROUPED LIVING ROOM - DL    ACCESSORY HOME #1 - DL ACCESSORY HOME #2 - DL ACCESSORY HOME #3 - DL  
      KITCHEN RELATED:
      3-ISLANDS - DL LA CORNUE 1908 RANGE - DL CAFE APPLIANCES, PAINTABLE(CORRECTED) - DL  
      LIGHTING:
      PENDANTS AND SCONCES - DL-1 - DL-2 - DL-3 - DL-4 RECESSED NC HALO 4 INCH LED WITH HOUSING - DL NEW!! 03-22-20  
      MATERIALS:
      TILE AND COUNTERTOPS #1 - DL 1(ONEDRIVE LINK) - DL-2 CUSTOM WHITES WITH PAINT TOOLBAR ICONS - DL-1 - DL-2 - DL-3 - DL-4 - DL-5 - DL-6 RABS RUGS 1V1 - DL          RABS STARTER KITCHEN MATERIALS PACK - DL         RABS FLOORING PACK 1 - DL            RABS OLD GOLDEN OAK FLOOR - DL     
      SYMBOLS:
      FIREPLACE ASSEMBLY 1 - DL     ACKLES BED AND EDISON TABLE LAMP - DL-1 - DL - 2 TEAPOT MATERIAL EDITOR REPLACEMENT - DL-1 - DL-2 FINMARK TABLE FROM CB2 - DL FIREPLACE MANTLES 1 AND 2 - DL    RABS STRETCHABLE PICTURE FRAMES - DL     
       
      VIDEOS: 
      YouTube Channel  
      Many of these I have personally made or modified. Some of the content may have been created by others for which I will give credit. Many of the materials have free licensing, so no credit is needed. 
      Some of this content may slow down your program as I have a high powered machine and often times use complex and high resolution textures. I will try and give as much detail as possible. Use at your own peril!
       
      No but seriously dig through and enjoy, I've spent a good number of hours ensuring the quality of these symbols and will update them periodically- so CHECK BACK IN! and PLEASE GIVE A LIKE FOR THE POST OF ANY SYMBOL YOU LIKE, IT ENCOURAGES ME TO GO BACK AND REFINE/REDUCE/OPTIMIZE THAT SYMBOL. GIVE A DOWNVOTE AND IT'LL PROBABLY ENCOURAGE ME TO DO THE SAME THING...YOU'LL JUST BE A JERK FOR IT
       
      CHANGELOG:(PACIFIC TZ)
      Page 1:
        Post 0:
      02-12-2019- 4:45PM: Removed the poll, migrated this thread. re-uploaded from X11 public beta 02-20-2019-2:59PM: Added a Poll for user content requests 03-30-2020-6:49PM: Deleted Video Links and added link to YouTube Channel   Post 5:
      02-12-2019- 4:45PM: centered the hearth on the symbol   Post 18:
      02-12-2019-9:52PM: Posted and fixed DL links  
       
       
       
       
      Here is a symbol to get you started:
      @Cheryl_C_Crane Think you requested this,
       
      RUSTIC BRICK 2.calibz
      Number of Textures: 2
      Map size: 1024x1024
      Filesize: 3.13 MB

       
       
    • By Chief_Content
      Our Content Development Team has been churning out new PBR friendly materials over the past few releases. These are materials that include a combination of Normal Maps, AO Maps, Roughness Maps, and Metal Maps. We use a software specifically designed to generate custom materials for 3D Rendering called Substance Designer. The program leverages parametric values to control sizing, colors, pattern, and other elements to generate unique tile-able texture maps along with automatically producing the other relevant maps need to create the effects that you expect to see in PBR and Ray Trace views.
       
      Our process includes generating individual materials then importing them into Chief Architect and distributing the catalogs that you download and use. This converts the parametric materials into static images that aren't as flexible as those that are created in the Substance Designer Program.
       
      Much like the Client Viewer and 3D Viewer products that are available for use with Chief Architect, Substance offers a product that allows others to leverage the parametric files to create their own custom materials... without needing to be an expert of the full-fledged program. We would like to invite you to try it out and create your own custom materials from the file we've set up for Tile.
       
      How does it work?
       
      First of all, a healthy understanding of how materials work inside of Chief Architect is a good starting point, and we just happen to have a couple primer videos ready for you here.
       
      Advanced Materials
      Creating Custom Materials and Colors
       
       
      Once you understand how Chief Architect behaves with different properties and maps, you can dig right in and make your own maps using Substance Player (a free download) and these source files we've set up to generate materials.  Just download the Substance player from the link below and use it to open the builder SBSAR files you wish to work with.  To assist, we have a quick video showing how to use Substance Player to get your custom maps into Chief Architect:
       
      How to use Substance Player in Chief
       
       
      Substance Player (Download)
       
      Tile_Builder.sbsar
      Wood Builder Beta.sbsar
      Single Color Fabric.sbsar
      Multi_Color_Fabric.sbsar
       
      We'd love to hear what you think. Is this useful? Are there other material types you'd like to try with the Substance Player tool? Voice any requests or questions here, or via e-mail to content@chiefarchitect.com . 
       
      Chief Architect is not affiliated in any way with the Substance Designer or Substance Player software programs. Chief Architect will not be able to offer any support for the Substance software products or files. Using the program and files is completely voluntary. Substance compatible files are provided simply as a gesture, with no guarantees, extended to give access to more material options for those who are interested.
    • By AlisonWD
      Hello, 
      I am applying a wood material to kitchen cabinets and the wood grain is going vertical in the doors and horizontal in the drawers.
      I checked the cabinet specifications and it shows only one material for doors.
      How can I do the wood grain the same direction in the doors and drawers?
      Thank you. 

    • By YoderW
      Hey all,
       
      Is there a way to control what Chief names each material as it's importing a model as a collada (.dae) file?
       
      At my company, we use Chief to build the base model and then export as a collada file to import into Lumion to render. Lumion's latest version has the ability to automatically replace materials with "glass" or "water" in the name with those kinds of materials when importing, but for some reason Chief will randomly assign names to materials during the collada export process like "mat127-material," regardless of what they are named in the material settings. Other export processes will keep the material names, but those have their own problems in Lumion. The 3DS format, for example, is the best alternative, but it changes the scale of the model. 
       
      I can't seem to find anywhere in the preferences to mess with export settings, though. It's nothing that totally breaks our workflow, as it only takes a couple seconds to replace the material, but it would be a nice little quality-of-life feature we could take advantage of if we could get Chief to cooperate. 
    • By PPRGLLC
      I'm trying to change the material for the trim alongside my stairs independent of the riser material. I want the trim to match the baseboards in the rest of the house and the riser to match the tread. Is it possible to separate the trim and the riser material in the stair definition dialog?