4hotshoez Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 I still struggle with how to make adjustments to foundation walls to work like I want them too. It should be simple, but when I make adjustments stuff moves the wrong way or cause the numbers in the DBX to change when I do not want them to. I could use a tutorial that explains how to successfully edit the foundation/room structure DBX to get the results I want. I have watched several videos and read from the knowledge base, but I am not getting the concepts or secret sequence of editing. Somewhere out there is the wisdom I need that is simple and works for all situations. All the videos I saw do not explain concepts, just "do this" I have a crawl space with a slab and porches with slabs 8" below the first floor and a garage floor 6" below the stem wall top, but all footings are at the same elevations and all top of stem walls are the same elevation. Chief wants to make them jump all over and I struggle to fix what should be simple. The problem I have had with a small past project is that changes to slab elevations also mess up windows and doors that were previously fine. Please show me the way. PostedPlan.plan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4hotshoez Posted March 9, 2015 Author Share Posted March 9, 2015 Why would placing a foundation cause my building to change elevation? Or my molding and windows dropped. I do NOT like this Sam I am. I have not been able to discover a predictable setting that does not mess up all my hard work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kbird1 Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 no expert but from watching videos by Scott I know some of the notches near the top are due to some areas having sill plates and others not ie where there is a slab. I assume you setup the garage foundation in the Foundation DBX to the same as the house? ie it is not at default still ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicinus Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 I'm following this thread with interest. I'm not an expert either but have had similar problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dshall Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 Todd, if you watch this vid, and give all of your framing members a different color, I will see if I can help out here. I tried to do it but I don't have the time to get the framing members colored. Coloring all framing members is very helpful in understanding what is going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicinus Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 I have a bit of a hate-love relation with the structure tab. I like the idea behind it and the control it gives, but I sometimes wish there was a more general way to control absolute levels, and then use the room structure as over rides. I briefly looked at your plan, and I'm wondering a bit about the crawl space, and if the fact that you created a room by using a slab as rat proofing changed the sill around it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay_on_Cape Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 Todd, I do these types of foundations all of the time. What specific questions do you have to achieve something you're not getting? Do you want the top of all foundation to be the same height (like attached pic) and also the same footing height? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4hotshoez Posted March 12, 2015 Author Share Posted March 12, 2015 Sorry, I got pulled off on another project as things are getting busier. I have a problem with know how the Foundation DBX is coded. IOW, when I make a change to one value in the DBX it changes others. There are too many variables for me to figure them all out without a deep and committed study for several hours. I would like to know from someone who has had experience what values I can change, what sequence, and which ones to leave alone. Knowing why would be nice too. I have windows that are changing elevations on the first floor after carefully getting them set. I have avoided building an foundation plan for this reason, but I need it for a structural analysis. (Thanks for the video Scott. I have not had a chance to view it yet this morning. So if there are answers to my questions in there, you will understand my post.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4hotshoez Posted March 12, 2015 Author Share Posted March 12, 2015 I would like the option to "lock" the footing depth once I have it established. Here in the Midwest, the sites tend to be relatively flat. But even so, the footings depths are typically one level and may I need the change the Stem Wall height from room to room without it affecting the footing or window elevations. Typically, we pour a 4" slab in the crawl space which is just a shallow basement. Then the garage stem wall top (SWT) is the same as the framed past of the house but the slab is just 6" below the SWT, making a floor difference of 18". Than there is a back porch with a slab 6" below the first floor with fill below, which messes with windows and the SWT as the adjacent floor of the house has a 12 5/8" framed floor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard_Morrison Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Part of the problem, I think, is that the slab elevation used to be much more stable. You'd set the slab height, and then you'd pick a very short stem wall, and the footing would elevate to the bottom of the slab and go no further. Somewhere along the line, it changed. Now the stem wall height takes the slab/floor elevation along with it, and its all just a mess of variability and resetting heights. Drives me nuts, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRAWZILLA Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 I have turned that in to TS many times in the past, there is a way around it though. Put a new scoop footing 8" x 8" along side of the stem wall ( on the slab side) and it will work as advertised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard_Morrison Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Put a new scoop footing 8" x 8" along side of the stem wall ( on the slab side) and it will work as advertised. Sorry, I have no idea what a "scoop footing" is. Must be SoCal lingo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kbird1 Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Sorry, I have no idea what a "scoop footing" is. Must be SoCal lingo. I guess so new to me as well..... pictures pretty please Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard_Morrison Posted March 13, 2015 Share Posted March 13, 2015 Thanks, Perry. But that really wasn't what I was talking about. I'm referring to a floor slab in a basement, say, not outside of one. It used to be that you could set the basement floor level to, say, -36", and then if you set the stem wall height to 2", the footing would rise until it hit the underside of the slab and then go no further, leaving a stem wall of 40" (or whatever). In X7, if you set the stem wall to be higher than the existing floor, it will override the floor height, and take it along for the ride. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kbird1 Posted March 13, 2015 Share Posted March 13, 2015 Thanks Perry another good video , did you send that little Plan into TS to report that Bug? In that situation with a framed floor and a concrete deck it actually destroys the structure , no sill plate any longer and the stemwall "grows" ( rather than shrinks) for some reason. even if you drop the Porch floor to -15" ( 2 x 7 1/2" steps) elevation from -6 , where the Porch slab should just butt into the stem wall it screws it up. or have I set something up wrong ? you used "straight deck edge" to make the Porch Room correct ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRAWZILLA Posted March 13, 2015 Share Posted March 13, 2015 I'm pretty sure it's a bug, already sent, but I have sent it in before for a few versions now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosco2017 Posted March 13, 2015 Share Posted March 13, 2015 4hotshoez, So if i'm understanding this correctly, you would like a video or explanation on how to control the foundations/footings using the dialogue boxes? A step by step on how to control the settings in these boxes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosco2017 Posted March 13, 2015 Share Posted March 13, 2015 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iyFnO9vr9e4 Not sure if this video will help, If you do watch it, make sure you turn on the captions. Audio is kind of choppy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4hotshoez Posted March 16, 2015 Author Share Posted March 16, 2015 Thanks Ross, I have figured out what you show in the video, but What I am now struggling with is that after carefully designing the 1st and 2nd floor of the house with proper eave heights and corresponding window heights, I had Chief build the foundation, but heights changed in different areas in ways that is not clear. The reason I know of the change is because I added molding in places that serve as the window head and line up with the frieze board at the eave. The manually added molding did not change elevation and is now in front of the window, which is about 8.5" higher. I have some imported elements such as custom porch columns that are in the elevation that I placed them, but now 8.5" too low, because of the change. And the frustrating thing is that this change is not consistent throughout the model as in some places the molding/window relationship was not affected. I worked hard to make this all work and Chief is messing things up in places that will require much more re-work. I am afraid that I may miss a few things and become a costly mistake. At this point I do not see Chief to be a reliable design tool if I cannot figure out what is going on with changing elevations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRAWZILLA Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 At this point I do not see Chief to be a reliable design tool if I cannot figure out what is going on with changing elevations. Not seeing the plan and with all respect, I think it's a case of user error. You just need to understand how Chief works., I do agree that the foundation setup is rather confusing for most people. A.B.L. Always be learning, After 10 years, I am still. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dshall Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Not seeing the plan and with all respect, I think it's a case of user error. You just need to understand how Chief works., I do agree that the foundation setup is rather confusing for most people. A.B.L. Always be learning, After 10 years, I am still. I agree with Perry. I would bet it is user error. It may be confusing, but I can get through it and if you know what you are doing, you can get through it..... with all due respect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kbird1 Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 I haven't added moldings to the exterior of windows so perhaps didn't/haven't noticed this problem , so I agree with Perry and Scott, it would be interesting to see the Plan or at least a test plan with the problem reproduced. M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosco2017 Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Todd, maybe post the plan one last time and we can take a look at it. Everyone has a method when it comes to building their model. Mine is as follows... Walls first. (1st, 2nd, & basement.) Next I add the roof, then I add all the windows, then doors, then I tackle the interiors (Such as moldings, cabinets, custom details etc.) I do this because of the same problem you are having. I only had this problem with my garage windows. Attach the plan and we can look over it. It's the first day here in Fort Wayne that the temp reached above 60, so I'll be out for the majority of the day. I'll take a look at it tonight if you post it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4hotshoez Posted March 16, 2015 Author Share Posted March 16, 2015 The original posted plan is still valid. Look at the band in front of the windows on the back of the garage and the front porch columns were set correctly but the roof over it has moved up and has caused me trouble because like you say Perry and Scott, I do not know what is happening as I have been the first to admit. But my complaint with Chief is that this should not be so hard to fight with. I would like to know, should I be building walls and foundation before I place any windows or roof? How would any one know that if this is true? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe_Carrick Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Todd, Generally, you build the foundation after walls, doors, windows, etc. However, there are some things in Chief (Generally CAD such as Molding Polylines, Slabs, Polyline Solids, etc) that are absolute elevation specified. When you build the foundation the Floor Heights are adjusted according to the foundation settings. IOW, if the foundation settings require that the 1st floor is 6" above grade then the floors will move up 6". So, it's a good idea to build the foundation before you add any of those other objects. You can always rebuild the foundation later but at least you have a starting point that's a good datum. ps: That's a major reason that I try to avoid all the CAD objects. Symbols are much more reliable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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