Real Time Ray Tracing Questions/Problems/Solutions


kgschlosser
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can't one just download the sample plan, and see how long the camera Scott was using takes?

 

My RTRT takes a few seconds for my plans...granted my plans are simple but still if one can do the sample plan in the time Scott did it, and one cannot do their own plan in a similar time, then it would point to something in the plan.

 

It seems to me one would confirm the sample plan behaviour,, and if it is the same as Scott, contact tech support on one's own plan

 

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2 minutes ago, jasonn1234 said:

can't one just download the sample plan, and see how long the camera Scott was using takes?

 

My RTRT takes a few seconds for my plans...granted my plans are simple but still if one can do the sample plan in the time Scott did it, and one cannot do their own plan in a similar time, then it would point to something in the plan.

 

It seems to me one would confirm the sample plan behavior,, and if it is the same as Scott, contact tech support on one's own plan

 

Yeah it should be that simple but...?

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Yes the View OPENS in a few seconds as stated in the Video perhaps even less with a 3080 or higher, that it not the same as being Crisp and Clean, i.e. near "Photo Realistic", no Fire Flies etc, as KGS expects, that takes thousands of Samples and is 1 - 2 mins or even longer, even on a 3080Ti, I'd hate to think what today's Gamers would be saying if things were this slow in any modern Game 3D engine..... for example Unreal 4  ( or 5 now ) is beautiful.

 

* just as a note ... doing some recent testing, my 3080Ti is about 50% faster than my Laptop's 2070s in the same plan / Camera / No# of samples etc, however the Final Image is NO different.

 

The 1st thing I noticed in the X14's What's New Presentation was no mention whatsoever of Improvements to the Astral 3D Engine..... I had my fingers crossed X14 would fix some of the Issues I have in X13, but sadly no, and the last Update to x13 has even brought back the (Surface?) Triangles in Layout Boxes too so I expect to see them in X14 as well.

 

This is from today....in X13 .........

                       Layout                                                            Elevation Camera

image.thumb.png.88c2f02723a1278db473ce2afe6dd528.png image.thumb.png.d32d7f54204dc303532973f17980b385.png

 

 

I have also been complaining about the "graininess" since we got RTRT, 1st thing I noticed in the Video mentioned above actually, I was disappointed then and still am having spent thousands on dollars on new Hardware and in some cases the OpenGL in X12 looked better...... it has not improved since Day 1, so as you can imagine I can see some of this from KGS's point of View.

 

And I think everyone here is well aware of Chief's "Memory Leak(s)" and the need to shutdown and restart etc when things "get weird", so conspiracy theories aside some of what is said above is quite true.

 

 

M.

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On 4/20/2022 at 12:00 AM, kgschlosser said:

With Nvidia graphics that is the RT Cores. That is the reason why I do not see my car use go over 50%. That's because DXR is not able to use the card to it's potential

Its the RT cores plus tensor cores and DXR does use both. What did you mean by this?
 

 

On 4/20/2022 at 12:00 AM, kgschlosser said:

to update roof planes for things like changes to the gutters

Not sure what you mean, my roof planes are updated 100% of the time when I change a gutter. I could show a video, you may need to call in to tech support if yours are not

 

On 4/20/2022 at 12:00 AM, kgschlosser said:

"low end laptop" render that fast using the version of x13 that is for sale, It's impossible

You're really missing a lot of crucial information to this statement. It takes a graphics card 5 times as long to pull a 1000 samples on a shower vs an open room with no objects involved. This comes down to the skill of the technician and their understanding of rendering. If you had seen the link I provided earlier you would say that I raytrace scenes very quickly on a low end laptop.

 

 

On 4/20/2022 at 12:00 AM, kgschlosser said:

Just to let you know I am a programmer/software engineer so I know how the code in chief is written. DXR does not use the Nvidia specific ray tracing functions from the OptiX SDK but instead uses a software based shader approach which doesn't use the RT cores in the card. I know this because of the DLL's that are loaded and not 1 function from the OptiX SDK are seen in any of the DLLs that have been loaded.

 

The Nvidia OptiX API/SDK which is the way to utilize ray tracing with Nvidia adapters has been around since 2009. So there is no excuse as to why it is not being used. The ATI API has been around for a similar length of time as well...

 

This is exceedingly frustrating because of the amount of time it is going to take to learn a new piece of software and there is slim pickings as far as software goes for stick built residential.

 

Oh and after 30000 samples the renderings are still grainy They are better then when it is set to 20000 and that is better then set to 10000 so it is still improving the image at 30000 samples

 

Just going to offer this up again, as stated previously, their is a denoiser at play when you EXPORT your image. It will not occur otherwise. Set your target sample rate, then use File/Export/Image/ and you will see for yourself that there is in fact a denoiser.


 

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On 4/20/2022 at 7:36 PM, Kbird1 said:

 

I have also been complaining about the "graininess" since we got RTRT, 1st thing I noticed in the Video mentioned above actually, I was disappointed then and still am having spent thousands on dollars on new Hardware and in some cases the OpenGL in X12 looked better...... it has not improved since Day 1

 

And here's one for the Happy little down-voter here on the Forum ,    2500 samples and not worth showing the Client......

 

image.thumb.png.ab555c6b76a7b1aa7f911c9ac6912401.png 

 

 

thought I'd Zoom in to just to see if any better and no......

 

image.thumb.png.558e754c172437c11d74408b4095f682.png

 

Mick.

 

 

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On 4/22/2022 at 11:11 AM, HumbleChief said:

Man that is bad. What does tech support say/suggest?

 

Sorry was generating the Close-up above and didn't see your post ......haven't got as far as TS yet but suspect they will blame my lighting or the Sun intensity etc.....

 

I think I have enough lights for the scene ----  all set to 300 lumen mind for subdued even lighting .... but still playing ..... so much for the Cabinet Company "Selling the Job" tomorrow at the Client Meeting.....

 

image.thumb.png.818182e5fe5ef27429666cba82e5dca5.pngimage.thumb.png.f142abf2ed604eef7dac297ff5417b29.png image.thumb.png.22e3ba1811aec8fca9f7c6c1ffb2b9af.png

 

 

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Cleaner  from a distance anyway......after 10,000 samples with the 3080Ti screaming for mercy for 7 mins  or so ....bonus my Office is nice and warm now too.....
 
image.thumb.png.ec60d818767d6787e780528bb3bedcf5.png 
 
But zoomed in not so much.......... Drywall has always been bad , from the start , perhaps we still don't have real PBR Materials in Chief ? I am not sure....
but am surprised the Cabinet Hardware is so "grainy"
 
image.thumb.png.e693dd097ea73c615c3dcbfce8edbaf3.png
 
 
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15 minutes ago, Kbird1 said:
Cleaner  from a distance anyway......after 10,000 samples with the 3080Ti screaming for mercy for 7 mins  or so ...
So you're saying perhaps not "Real Time"?
 
Real Time Definition
 
noun
    • COMPUTING
      relating to a system in which input data is processed within milliseconds so that it is available virtually immediately as feedback, e.g., in a missile guidance or airline booking system.
      "real-time signal processing"
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41 minutes ago, HumbleChief said:

So you're saying perhaps not "Real Time"?

 

The View Opens  "instantly" on the 3080Ti, but it is far from "Photo Realistic" as I think I have now seen in some of Chief advertising...

 

 

* Still worth getting that 3070Ti Larry :)   and only 1/2 the cost (now) of a 3080 Ti....    go on.... ya know ya wanta....:)

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21 minutes ago, HumbleChief said:

Oh I REALLY do. Don't need it, can't use it but I really wanta...:D

 

Watch ya back the RED SMARTIES are being dropped again with free abandonment at the moment :)

 

M. 

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5 hours ago, Kbird1 said:

 

And here's one for the Happy little down-voter here on the Forum ,    2500 samples and not worth showing the Client......

 

image.thumb.png.ab555c6b76a7b1aa7f911c9ac6912401.png 

 

 

thought I'd Zoom in to just to see if any better and no......

 

image.thumb.png.558e754c172437c11d74408b4095f682.png

 

Mick.

 

 

Can you post your plan with materials please 

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8 hours ago, Kbird1 said:

Still worth getting that 3070Ti Larry :)   and only 1/2 the cost (now) of a 3080 Ti....    go on.... ya know ya wanta....:)

They aren't even taking orders again. :(

1520778815_RTX3070ti.thumb.PNG.d013381e179d6fbf1bb22e62527752cc.PNG

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1 hour ago, Rich_Winsor said:

They aren't even taking orders again. :(

1520778815_RTX3070ti.thumb.PNG.d013381e179d6fbf1bb22e62527752cc.PNG

 

It was the XC Ultra that was On Sale but it looks as though you are right.....it is gone off the Restock Sale Page too.

 

Newegg had the same price but is also sold out now....

 

M.

 

 

 

 

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I know that the RTRT views actually Print much better than they look on the computer screen, have you tried to actually print to "PDF". Not sure but it works for me.

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7 minutes ago, DRAWZILLA said:

I know that the RTRT views actually Print much better than they look on the computer screen, have you tried to actually print to "PDF". Not sure but it works for me.

 

I typically don't use Live View in Layout as the PDF Size EXPLODES exponentially, a recent example was 22.3mb without and 52.7mb with , ( so it can't be emailed any longer) but you are correct , the Views in PDF do look nicer even STD View with Lines as in the example above looked nicer than in Layout.

 

The above was some Preset Cameras for Client Views that could be opened 1 by 1 for Viewing but IMHO....  ASTRAL 3D and RTRT just ain't there yet.

 

M.

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1 hour ago, Kbird1 said:

 

I typically don't use Live View in Layout as the PDF Size EXPLODES exponentially, a recent example was 22.3mb without and 52.7mb with , ( so it can't be emailed any longer) but you are correct , the Views in PDF do look nicer even STD View with Lines as in the example above looked nicer than in Layout.

 

The above was some Preset Cameras for Client Views that could be opened 1 by 1 for Viewing but IMHO....  ASTRAL 3D and RTRT just ain't there yet.

 

M.

I keep everything live except RTRT of course ,then you have to send a picture view, and not live, I wish we could send a live view, right now it does not turn out well.

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