mulled window question

[AMYGVHB 0]

Everytime I mull windows , there is a thin piece of trim material between the units that shouldn't be there.  This always happens, but this is the first time it's become painfully obvious because the window frame is black and the trim is cedar. The top of the bottom window and the bottom of the top window are at set to the same height prior to mulling.  See pic for reference.

Bottom window is a casement, top window is a picture.

[robdyck 302]

You can't remove that. It's super lame.

[rgardner 41]

You m

24 minutes ago, AMYGVHB said:

Everytime I mull windows , there is a thin piece of trim material between the units that shouldn't be there.  This always happens, but this is the first time it's become painfully obvious because the window frame is black and the trim is cedar. The top of the bottom window and the bottom of the top window are at set to the same height prior to mulling.  See pic for reference.

Bottom window is a casement, top window is a picture.

I don't have that issue when mulling units unless there is a gap.  Can you post a plan file?

 

By chance did you try manually moving the window instead of with the dbx?  A window can be off by 1/16" in size or position and sometimes round to the 1/8" so maybe your lower windows is actually placed at 79 15/16" and your upper at 80???

 

 

[Dermot 398]

Make sure your windows are sized and positioned properly before mulling them and then set your interior and exterior mullion depth to 0.

[AMYGVHB 0]

Thanks Dermot! This theory worked but instead of setting the mullions to  0",  I had to set the interior and exterior mullion depth to 3" for it to completely disappear.  Maybe because it's a 6" wall?  Thank you.

[robdyck 302]

4 hours ago, Dermot said:

Make sure your windows are sized and positioned properly before mulling them and then set your interior and exterior mullion depth to 0.

I can't get this to work (the way I'd like) because my windows have 'frames'. The frames remain along the mullion and aren't affected by the "mullion depth' settings.

If the frames are removed, then the thin mullion can be made to disappear, but not using a value of zero. Also, removing the frames creates additional problems which affect the accurate sizing and appearance of the windows, the display of casings, and some control of materials. 

Example: to replicate the removed frame, the casing reveals need to be adjusted (faked). On the exterior, a negative overlap to simulate the frame size, means the face of the frame takes the exterior casing material, instead of the exterior sash material. It also means you can't properly replicate the depth or thickness of the window frame.

 

One of the challenges in modelling this is that many types of windows (in real) have 2 separate components that Chief uses the 'frame' to represent. The 'frame' which wraps the sashes and is part of the structure of the window is different from the interior 'jamb' or 'liner' which can vary in its depth based on the wall thickness and provide the finished surface to the interior of the window.

 

 

[dskogg 13]

i just set the mullion depth to 1 inch in options and it removes this line

[robdyck 302]

 A few more options could be given within the dbx to aid in modelling these windows.

-first off, there should be a jamb liner option that is separate from the window frame. The jamb liner would mimic the frame but to the interior only but would follow the opening only, not the window units. In the past, I've replicated this by using a pass-through window or door in the same location as a 'troublesome' window (just for better control of the casing).

-we should be able to specify the depth of the frame at the mullion. Currently, the dbx for mulled units leads us to believe we can control it, but then we realize that the mullion Chief produces is separate from the frame. 

-we could use an option to add an astragal or other trim molding to cover the mullion.