Charge for completed model

[mtldesigns]

Hey CA users.

 

I know there has been many conversations on how and what to charge.  BUT what do you charge for "THE" actual model?  I have finished this project,(the model, the layout construction package, with all the sections, views and notes attached), and now client wants that model.  They do have a Chief license, correct version even (x9).  During concept, I had no problem saving a copy for them to play with because it wasn't really detailed, and it kinda gave them a actual say in the design process (Simm's game?).  But now that this all is done, and I have many many hours invested, I am thinking I should not share without additional compensation.  Am I wrong to think that?  No where was it mentioned in our contract and agreed upon price that I would provide these items. I know for a fact, they want to change some things, so to me, if someone else has, they could complete those mods at a discount rate.  BTW, they are great clients, but this is business.       

[DRAWZILLA]

You have to take care of these kinds of things by signing a contract ahead of time., then no questions about what you provide.. Just don't give it to him or her, if you never agreed to it.  Of course if you want more work you might re-think it. Whatever is best for you.

[lbuttery]

I always give the actual plan to the client

 

they paid for it ...

 

Lew

[mtldesigns]

They are the first clients to ever ask for model, so lesson learned on mentioning in a contract.

 

I am thinking of giving them the watered down version.  Deleted sections, notes, dims. basically just the model.   

[johnny]

By default the law places ownership of plans into the designer/architect.  There are major conflicts that occur in ownership if you release digital files.  You can contract around this, but to enforce you to hire attorneys etc. 

 

I dont agree with Lew - a customer pays for the service not the intellectual property.

[mtldesigns]

I was thinking the same thing Johnny.

 

My initial thought was coming from, if a person bought a plan online, that's one price.  But if you wanted DWG's, there's usually a nice adder.  There's a reason they charge more for that. Potential lost work, the ownership, etc...

[johnny]

30 minutes ago, mtldesigns said:

I was thinking the same thing Johnny.

 

My initial thought was coming from, if a person bought a plan online, that's one price.  But if you wanted DWG's, there's usually a nice adder.  There's a reason they charge more for that. Potential lost work, the ownership, etc...

 

Yes, but keep in mind when a plan company sells a plan their income is MUCH higher over the life of that plan.  A typical peer-2-peer singlular relationship, like you probably have with your client, changes that dynamic.  Charge accordingly.

[Alaskan_Son]

I definitely don't think there's a one size fits all (or even most) answer to this.  I won't pretend to know what's best for your situation.  I think only you can properly gauge that but I'll leave you with a few thoughts on the subject:

 

• It obviously depends in part on your prior agreements (either written, spoken, or assumed).  In the absence of a clear cut agreement there are also the following considerations...
• Type of client (good, bad, one-off, long term, don't want to work for them again, etc.)
• Whether or not you have been paid in full yet.   In and of itself I would not use this as a deciding factor but it's definitely worth considering whether refusing to handover the plan file might cause unnecessary heartache or not, and if so, how much trouble is it really worth you (right or wrong).
• How exactly you charged for your work.  If for example I was charging by the hour and had spent 200 hours on the the project I may very well lean toward giving them the model...if I only spent a day on it, maybe not so much.  On the other hand, if I was charging by the square foot for permitting plans then I would be leaning toward holding onto the plans.
• What you started with.  Did you start with a completely blank plan file, did you start with a "base plan", did you start with a highly customized and loaded template plan, or did they give you a plan file to start with.  The amount of value you brought to the table from the start is certainly a consideration.
• Did you use any custom symbols, CAD blocks, macros, etc?  Things of value you added along the way that weren't charged to the job are certainly things you have a valid claim to withhold.
• How good you are at what you do and how much you charge.  If you charge $100 an hour and aren't very fast or efficient you might want to consider throwing in the plan file as a bonus.  If you charge $35 an hour and can regularly produce a set of CDs before lunch your service is already a bonus.  
• Lastly, you can always strip down the plan a bit if necessary so that you feel more comfortable sharing it.  

 

 

Just my $0.02

[mtldesigns]

Wow... definitely get a lot for $0.02 in Alaska.  Thank you ALL.. all great points.

 

A little history.  Client bought CA and tried to design his own home over a year ago.  When he contacted me, in 16, I cleaned his model up for a flat fee.  Everything was wrong, no two rooms had the same floor or ceiling heights, no roof line, walls flipped, etc.  I fixed the model and received payment.  Because I use a job specific Dropbox folder for every project that I share, I gave him the corrected CA file via DB.  I noticed earlier this year, that in the same folder construction docs were created using my model, via another design firm, I thought, ok no problem.  I did what I was paid for.  Forward to September 17, client contacts me and dramatically wants to change this house.  I did start this new model from scratch, starting with new plan.  But also had the old model and his new changes to reference.  I charged a flat fee, based on sq. footage, and have been pad in full for the services I have rendered.  Like I mentioned on my original post, they had many chances and did make many changes on this second go round.... thus making my dollar to sq. ft. ratio decrease ALOT.  But a contract is a contract.  Now that the project is complete and payment has been made in full, I was asked if more changes could be made.  And of course they can, but now the charge will be an hourly rate.  This and the fact that another group finished my previous design, is what threw up the flag.  Not to mention, its proprietary.  Just because I buy a custom Chevy Silverado, doesn't mean GM has to give me the plans.   

 

Oops.. sorry about the winded note...  I couldn't stop typing.  

 

Because they are descent people, and always paid on time and in full.  I am going to give them two options.  A stripped down model at no cost or a adder and a document signing off my ownership.  To me that seams very fair, and it puts it in their court.    

 

thanks again gents...  

[javatom]

I make the "deliverables" pdf files.  I create them with two sets of plans.  One has the model.  The other one has the details.  If a client pays more for the model they get the plan file of the model.  They NEVER get the details plan.  The items on that plan have taken a lot of experience to create.  I normally charge 500 to 800 even for a blank plan.  What they are getting is my anno sets, layer sets, setups etc.  A homeowner does not care but I have had new designers tell me that it has put them miles ahead of the game.  I have also had client fly to my location (Coeur d'Alene) for one on one training.  They always say the the best thing they got out of it was the blank plan which they use as their template.  My point on this is to be careful who you give a plan file to and be sure of how they intend to use it.

[Richard_Morrison]

If the clients want to change some things, they should come to you for the changes. It is YOUR liability, after all, and there is a certain amount of review required for any change. If they want the model for just for furniture placement, etc. then you might consider giving them a 3D-only version. I would never give a client modifiable 2D documents, or free access to my intellectual capital of details. What they have paid for is a one-time right to use those details on a particular project.