KevinWaldron Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 Is it just me are others finding Chief is falling behind in being able to draw things (easily) that are required for the 2012 code? (The 2015 code is now in process) Not trying to stir up problems but many of the new changes that are needed for plan or plans code submittal just aren't included in Chief. Examples: 3D/2D duct design..... 3D/2D Sprinkler.....volume of rooms etc for Manual J's.........3D/2D Confined air space better than the soffit...........spring closures on house/gargae door.......( Would hope that Chief would know to do this automatically light GFI in the electrical and not have to manually do it) 3D/2D light enclosures (blower door test) BIM.......... Drip edge on Roofing automatically placed..... and the list goes on. Not saying that some of this can't be done in Chief but it's like using a pocket knife in comparison to other software available being able to use a laser. (other examples.........we personally think that 3D printers will play a major role in construction in the next 15 years........ Like to think that we can ride some of the technology with companies that we have been using for years.) Personal thoughts......As a design build firm....... in our opinion the software looks more and more like what a home owner would use not a professional. We already have a large arsenal of other software such as FormZ, Turbocad, Revit and others that offer a lot of the necessary power. As professionals lets urge the makers of Chief to regain it's place in the industry and stay ahead of our code requirements. Much of this is my opinions and I'm not trying to be contentious. I'd like to see changes to new versions more in line with real world needs not just catching up with other software. Blessings, . Kevin 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lbuttery Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 Kevin: I agree it would be nice if Chief was code-compliant but it never has been code-compliant and probably never will be while the 2012 codes are out and 2015 codes are on the way many jurisdictions are still using 2009 0r 2006 and some aren't even using the IRC or IBC codes some don't even use any codes to speak of even if a state has adopted a code set each county and/or town can modify those codes as needed Chief's plan check only looks at the most basic codes and even then doesn't try very hard Lew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glennw Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 Oh, and I live in Australia - USA is not the world! When is Chief going to be compliant with our codes - we have federal, state and local. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRAWZILLA Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 I hate to tell you guys but the current code is 2013 around here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Electromen Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 No Sprinklers in residential here in PA., no spring closures on doors either. Are Sprinklers required in residential in your area? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis_Gavin Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 Electro - New homes in some communities in my area of PA (suburban Philly) require sprinklers. And cause a lot of headaches for some homeowners as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Electromen Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 Electro - New homes in some communities in my area of PA (suburban Philly) require sprinklers. And cause a lot of headaches for some homeowners as well. That's interesting. Pittsburgh doesn't require it. I remember the State voting it down. People with well water were going to be required to have a large storage tank with gravity feed. This meant it would be above the top ceiling and would require a heater to prevent freezing. Can you imagine the cost? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis_Gavin Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 The pinheads in government don't care about costs. They have a money machine! (us) Why does there have to be constant code changes? These guys meet more than the original Congress of the US. Pretty soon we will have the safest most energy efficient homes that few can afford!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kMoquin Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 2009 I codes for us. I have never had an issue with code compliance that I can attribute to software. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Electromen Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 When I have a question about what the local inspector wants, I always ask in the planning stage. He/she appreciates that, it makes their job easier and I always pass inspection. They don't want to turn anyone down and return for compliance, they want to pass it and move on. Of course they must enforce the code but they'd rather see it pass and meet requirements. I have a very good relationship with the inspectors because I ask up front in the few cases that I'm not sure. Sometimes I ask their advice on design or cost saving possibilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BryceEngstrom Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 I have never had an issue with code compliance that I can attribute to software. Ditto. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyGump Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 2009 I codes for us. I have never had an issue with code compliance that I can attribute to software. As Bryce so eloquently put it "ditto" also. Do some actually believe that their software should do their code compliance work for them? By the way, the California 2013 codes are based on the 2012 International codes. Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRAWZILLA Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 As Bryce so eloquently put it "ditto" also. Do some actually believe that their software should do their code compliance work for them? By the way, the California 2013 codes are based on the 2012 International codes. Andy. With a lot of changes, the codes here go every 3 years, 2007, 2010, 2013, 2016. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevinWaldron Posted April 3, 2014 Author Share Posted April 3, 2014 I wasn't saying that Chief needed to automatically make the changes..... my contention is that we don't have adequate tools to easily do what needs to be done to comply with current codes and the software is following further and further behind in offering tools for real world situations. With the 2012/2015 energy code requirements we don't have many of the drawing tools needed to draw quickly the code required parts, pieces, items, etc! Another example of hardware/software.... following behind.......3D mouse ... http://www.3dconnexion.com/ if you haven't used one you really don't know what your missing......... it's an incredible drawing aid. If you guys in other area's aren't having to follow the energy code/ Green thing you will soon..... your codes departments just haven't caught up or your mortgage companies and your utility companies haven't started, or requested that you comply.......... but it's coming..... don't bury your head in the sand. As bad as all of this is and with the additional cost associated with the changes there is substantial gains to be had with the energy savings. We as designers, builders, Architects need to promote the energy savings as a benefit and use it as a sells tool........ Yes, Sprinklers for residential are required for various cities and counties in our area.... some adopt all the codes as is and some only adopt parts and pieces of the code. You want to see the changes required by 2012...... http://shop.iccsafe.org/significant-changes-to-the-international-building-code-2012-edition.html Leave you with one final thought..... with all the natural disasters happening you can bet that seismic/wind/mud-slide code rule changes aren't going to be far behind. Don't you want a software that is trying to offer tools that make your life a little easier........ Let's beg, plead, prod that our favorite software becomes current with real world demands. Blessings, Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRAWZILLA Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 Here in California I've been doing energy calc's for over 20 years now, but they have taken it too far. Starting in July almost everything has to be inspected by a different special inspector, not the regular inspector but a special one, I guess the regular inspector is too busy setting in his truck. That cost money. Doing the calc's have gotten very complicated and what I use to do for free will now cost money b/c of the time it will take to do them. On top of that Chief's export to rescheck will not work with it so it will have to be done the old way. Or maybe I won't do them at all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lbuttery Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 Kevin: ahhh, the tools ..... yes, CA should stay current and offer tools that allow for meeting code I suspect that would require $$$ and resources and CA may not have those to spare thus, we end up having to use workarounds Lew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyGump Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 Help me out here, specifically, what tool would you like to see that will help with the new codes? I almost never have to spec out any HVAC lines or even plumbing lines for that matter. No AHJ has ever asked about "Spring Closers" for garage doors, unless you mean the requirement for self-closing doors from house to garage. That just goes in as a note on my plans. So you really show the drip-edge on your roofs in 3D? Does any AHJ require this or want to see it? I guess if you don't like using the "pocket knife" go buy the laser for $6000.00. Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevinWaldron Posted April 12, 2014 Author Share Posted April 12, 2014 We've found an example of some of things that next versions of Chief must have..... The needed tools come from Revit MEP. The program has a demo file showing 3D duct work and light cover boxes etc...... MEP by the way stands for Mechanical, Electrical, and Plumbing......most all the tools offered in MEP are not available to us as Chief users...... many of these things are now required to meet the 2012 Codes......if your not doing the drafting/design someone has to provide this in area's that the require the information for permits under the 2012 and above code....... this is not going to go away! Andy, we as design / builders and try and use the material list.... if you only note the items on a schedule they want show up in the material list. Same thing goes for drip-dege on roofs if it's not there in the drawing it for sure want show-up on the material list as well as other required items. We probably will move programs if things that we need are not offered. Blessings, Kevin 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glennw Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 Same thing goes for drip-dege on roofs if it's not there in the drawing it for sure want show-up on the material list as well as other required items.. Blessings, Kevin Kevin, I think you will find that things like Drip Edges (Gable and Eave), Edge Flashings, Ridge Vents, Valley Flashings will be calculated in the materials list although they do not display in 3D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lbuttery Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 Kevin: MEP tools have been requested for over a decade I wouldn't count on seeing them anytime soon Lew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan_Son Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 I have a really hard time trying to get behind any suggestions like these. I would venture to guess that Chief Architect boasts perhaps the fastest plan producing designers and architects there are, and they don't have or need Revit's MEP tools (and I'm talking about guys who produce plans for some of the most stringent code requirements in the known universe...you guys know who your are). To say some of those tools might be nice is one thing, to say we need them is quite another. I don't need them, and I really don't want a program as monstrous and bogged down as Revit. Chief is absolutely a fantastic program. I'll take improvements to its simplistic design before I'd request "code compliance tools". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyGump Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 Well put Michael. Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lbuttery Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 There are many things in chief that I need and many I don't I think that could be said of anyone on this forum remember if you fight someone's wish list then they are probably fighting yours probably best to let each user create their own wish list and let CA sort them out concerning priority and feasibility etc Lew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan_Son Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 If I suggest an idea that others think is bad, then I should hope they would fight it. You've pointed to some critical flaws in our current society..."Don't fight for anything"..."Don't offend anyone"..."We can all have everything we want."..."There will be no unintended consequences."...and "It of course won't cost anything." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lbuttery Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 Michael: Yet, CA is the final judge Lew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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