E SIZE PLANS

[winterdd]

Hey guys, Architecture 101 here and wanted to get input on how you remedy this. When a home won't fit on D size sheets @ 1/4"=1'-0" normal orientation or rotated to fit, do you go to an E size sheet? Or do you add a note on each plan/elevation view saying "1/4"=1'-0" available upon request"? Do framers absolutely despise 3/16"=1'-0" when 1/8"=1'-0" is too small? Thoughts?

 

I typically can rotate the floor plan 90 degrees and it fits but this current monster of a home won't fit at all. Happens very rarely with me.

[winterdd]

I also ask because I have heard E size sheets can be a pain on site if it is windy. Those sheets are the size of a blanket almost lol

[JKEdmo]

33 minutes ago, winterdd said:

I also ask because I have heard E size sheets can be a pain on site if it is windy. Those sheets are the size of a blanket almost lol

Rob,

 

Arch E (36" x 48") is pretty big.  Can you make Arch E1 (30" x 42") work?  That's quite common and I do this if 24"x36" does not work.

 

3/16" scale in my opinion is unconventional.  Although 1/8" is common for commercial.

 

Another alternative is do match lines.

 

That said, my opinion is "paper is cheap" and in the end I'm more inclined to go with a larger sheet size w/ standard scale than try to rework stuff to fit the smaller sheet.

 

Jim

 

 

 

[Alaskan_Son]

I've framed houses for over 20 years, and I honestly wouldn't really care if the plans were 3/16" scale.  I could also deal with 1/8" honestly.  I would just need to remember my reading glasses.  I think your idea of offering 1/4" on request is completely reasonable.  I think the easiest and most reasonable option though is to draw at 1/4" scale for Arch E but just print most sets at 1/2 scale on smaller sheets unless requested otherwise.  

Edited Sunday at 10:11 PM by Alaskan_Son

[JKEdmo]

Another thought I'd add is many building departments prefer 1/4" residential (1/8" commercial) standard scales in my experience.

 

Jim

[winterdd]

Thanks guys, I need to set up E size in my templates for this purpose. I know a lot of the builders out here so If they want it to 1/4" bad enough they won't hesitate to ask. I look at my architectural scale and feel I could build by it but I am no pro. What do they scale the drawings for anyway if the dimensions are right in front of them?

[Alaskan_Son]

4 minutes ago, winterdd said:

Thanks guys, I need to set up E size in my templates for this purpose. I know a lot of the builders out here so If they want it to 1/4" bad enough they won't hesitate to ask. I look at my architectural scale and feel I could build by it but I am no pro. What do they scale the drawings for anyway if the dimensions are right in front of them?

in my experience, it’s mostly just to find missing dimensions. I almost never scale anything.

[winterdd]

18 minutes ago, Alaskan_Son said:

in my experience, it’s mostly just to find missing dimensions. I almost never scale anything.

Yeah, I was thinking plumbers scale it to place the pipe inside the fdn forms before pouring the slab too.

[HetrickDesign]

One method is to clip the portion that doesn't fit and show on the next page.  Use a match line with a call-out reference on each page. This way you can continue using the same paper size and scale. If you do this, it's wise to include a smaller scale overall view somewhere in the drawing set.

 

Concerning the 3/16" scale, I've been told that those in the field may use a tape measure to scale from the drawing. So keep that in mind. 

Edited April 15 by HetrickDesign

[CharlesVolz]

For Residential Design:

1. Use Arch D if at all possible.
2. Use match lines before using a larger sheet size when practical.
3. Always keep 1/4" scale for floor plans. (Elevation can be 3/16" scale as necessary.)
4. Give plumbers dimensions from edge of foundation to plumbing wall main layer on plumbing side (from 2 foundation edges that are 90° to each other).

Edited Sunday at 11:36 PM by CharlesVolz

[winterdd]

16 hours ago, CharlesVolz said:

For Residential Design:

1. Use Arch D if at all possible.
2. Use match lines.
3. Always keep 1/4" scale.
4. Give plumbers dimensions from edge of foundation to plumbing wall main layer on plumbing side (from 2 foundation edges that are 90° to each other).

What does the match lines do?

[JKEdmo]

43 minutes ago, winterdd said:

What does the match lines do?

 

If a plan, section, etc. is too big to fit a sheet at a certain scale, you divide the plan into separate parts across separate sheets.  Usually two parts across two sheets.

 

The match line is just the graphical symbol that shows the reader where the two halves were divided.  Here's a common symbol used for it below.

 

It's similar to a double section arrow but with no arrows.  On the side of the circle where the other half of the plan would be if you had enough paper you simply list the sheet number where it resides in the set.

 

 

 

 

This site has a pretty good explanation:

 

https://www.07sketches.co/post/mastering-architecture-graphic-symbols-a-beginner-s-guide-to-reading-architectural-drawings

 

 

[HetrickDesign]

Here is an example of my match line call out in Chief. It's placed on the layout, not in the plan view itself. Then you place another match line on the next page containing the remainder of the plan view. You just need to ensure that they reference the correct sheet numbers.

 

It would be nice if Chief could automate the sheet reference like Revit does.

Edited Friday at 02:23 AM by HetrickDesign

[jorgearaya]

@winterdd We have no issue using size E on our plans when needed.

In some cases, if the house is too big, we do one of the following: Dedicate a D sheet for the dimensioned floor plan only if it fits.

Dedicate a D sheet for the dimensioned floor plan only at 3/16" scale and for both we simply keep the normal sheet with the notes and make a reference to it.

What we see in the field is that the supers always print the plans to 1/2 scale. Hope that helps. 

[ComputerMaster86]

Some of my projects have been 3/16" scale.  Sometimes for me that's the best option since I can't print Arch E or ANSI E.

[RobDesLLC]

I have several current projects where I've printed them on E sheets due to footprint size. I would rather print on a larger sheet at 1/4" scale than try to fit a plan on a D sheet at 3/16" scale. I have been involved in projects where plans were at 3/16" scale, and multiple subs got bids wrong and construction wrong due to overlooking the scale. I don't want that sort of disaster happening on my projects. 

[Joe_Carrick]

I have Layout Templates for:

• Letter   -   8.5x11
• Arch B  -  12x18
• Arch C  -  18x24
• Arch D  -  24x36
• Arch D2 - 24x42
• Arch E   - 36x48
• Arch E1 - 30x42
• Arch E2 - 30x48

Some of those are my own custom sizes.  I keep them all up to date with my layout macros and borders.  They all use the same Default Sets and Layer Sets.

In addition, I use similar sized Plan sizes with a (Sheet Boundary & identical rectangle) and a Drawing Area rectangle.  This allow me to send to layout so that all floor plans are in the same location on each page of my Layout.  This is just my way of keeping everything organized the way I like it.

Edited Saturday at 03:24 AM by Joe_Carrick

[winterdd]

Good feedback guys, I usually do 3:16 with the front elevation at bottom of D size sheet and 1/4" rotated on D size sheet when it fits so they have both but will take into consideration all these suggestions. I will be honest I have never used match lines and interested in learning more now.