Thad58 Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 Ok, I was told I needed a new video card and I have to have a laptop. I have several offices I work out of and work out of town. I am relying on Chief and my IT guy to come up with best solution.(See Below) This comes in at $2,900.00 but if I wanted to max out the video card I can only go to 3080. It would be a Intel I9 for extra $1,600.00. The new 3090 is not available on a 17 inch screen I would appreciate your opinion of if this. Chief has already gave a Ok to it or if anyone think the I9 and 3080-card. Is worth the $1,600.00 What Chief did with this release was not right. I had a heads up this was going to happen so it wasn't a surprise to me. I cant imagine the surprise people are having out there. Alienware x17 R1 Gaming Laptop Processor 11th Gen Intel® Core™ i7 11800H (8-Core, 24MB L3 Cache, up to 4.6GHz with Turbo Boost Technology) Processor Branding 11th Generation Intel® Core™ i7 non-vPro Processor Label Operating System Windows 10 Pro English Video Card NVIDIA® GeForce RTX™ 3060 6GB GDDR6 LCD 17.3" FHD (1920 x 1080) 165Hz 3ms with ComfortView Plus Memory 64GB DDR4 XMP 3466MHz Hard Drive 2TB M.2 PCIe NVMe Solid State Drive Keyboard Alienware X-Series thin keyboard with per-key AlienFX lighting Power Supply Adapter 240W Wireless Killer™ Wi-Fi 6E (Pre-certified) AX1675 802.11ax 2x2 Wireless LAN and Bluetooth 5.2 Primary Battery Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kbird1 Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 Looks Ok to me , though I'd look at the price increase for a 3070 or 3070Ti instead as the mobile Cards are not as powerful as there Desktop Versions due to power Usage and heat etc. M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thad58 Posted July 9, 2021 Author Share Posted July 9, 2021 That is $226.00 more. Worth it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kbird1 Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 I would say yes , thinking in terms of it will hopefully last 3-4 yrs at least so $50 a yr...... 3070 with 8GB memory? Not sure if the 3060Ti is in laptops yet? it maybe another viable Option if the 3070ti is not. *** Just remember that X12 will work on your current machine and do almost all that X13 will ( --- no RT-PBR or CLAY ) so $3K may not "need" to be spent right now...... Mick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thad58 Posted July 9, 2021 Author Share Posted July 9, 2021 Thanks K-Bird Yeah but this is business and I always think about the fact that it is inevitable that i will run X13 I should go ahead and get it out the way and spend the money. I should just fork out the $4,900.00 and max out in hope to get to use it 4 years. I have only had this open 4 year but had to rebuild it twice for about $600 a rebuild so I am not to far off. Plus I am impatient. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kbird1 Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 13 minutes ago, Thad58 said: Thanks K-Bird Yeah but this is business and I always think about the fact that it is inevitable that i will run X13 I should go ahead and get it out the way and spend the money. I should just fork out the $4,900.00 and max out in hope to get to use it 4 years. I have only had this open 4 year but had to rebuild it twice for about $600 a rebuild so I am not to far off. Plus I am impatient. I understand , and if you have the budget why not ........ I just worry that some are spending on a feature that is not yet mature in Chief ( RT-PBR ) , ie I got a new desktop for the same reason ( 3080 ) and wonder why sometimes.... ( and desktops are more powerful than Laptops....) From Dermot ( Chief) just now :https://chieftalk.chiefarchitect.com/topic/31229-what-video-card-for-x13/?do=findComment&comment=246881 Mick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkMc Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 The only Ti card I would consider is a 3060, definitely not a 3070 or 80 Ti, especially in a laptop. I've not yet seen either of my cards use more than 60% of the video memory. The 3070 and 3080 Ti draw more power/heat, are not well regarded, and offer little performance increase in Chief. (even gamers are avoiding.) Similarly unless using some other programs an i( won't get you any better performance in X13 (and the 112th gen i( offers little) Personally I'd stick with 32GB ram as I've never been close to maxing that out and I run a lot of stuff at once. Same goes for the Killer card (now owned by INtel) I disabled that last one I had and won't be bothering again. OTOH I would look into having the machine tooled in particular getting cooling performance upgraded. I also like to get some sort of minimum backlight bleed on laptops-not perfect but better. Finally note that each maker may list a particular GPU but the actual power allowed for it varies from brand to brand so a 3070 in one is not the same as a 3070 in another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thad58 Posted July 9, 2021 Author Share Posted July 9, 2021 Mark, Are you running X13? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anne_CA Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 I'm also finding it frustrating that X13 requires me to get a new desktop and/or laptop in order to run. I didn't realize some of the render styles would not work correctly with an inadequate graphics card. My line drawings do not show the cabinet hardware, when I change vector views from color to b&w, the hardware also disappears, though we found a workaround. I had a call this morning with a local custom computer builder after sending him the X13 recommended specs. Apparently it is next to impossible to get the RTX 3080 cards unless you want to pay 2-4x retail because people are buying in large quantity and reselling at ridiculous markup. He sent me a quote for a system using an RTX 3090 because they are only marked up 50% from retail and available. The quote was very high, but I have no idea what a system with these specs should run. Both he and the CA tech support person suggested I look at ready-made systems by HP, Dell, and Lenovo. I only found one or two desktop systems using the RTX 3080 and most of the reviewers reported system crashes and overheating systems. They had to add extra after-market fans, which voided the warranty. This is what he came up with: Ryzen 9 5900X 12-core processor, dual-tower CPU air cooler, X570 motherboard with WiFi and Bluetooth 32GB RAM (upgradeable to 128GB), 500GB NVME SSD (Windows, programs), 1TB NVME SSD (active work) EVGA RTX 3090 24GB high-airflow case, 850W 80+ Gold power supply, Windows 10 Pro, full set of upgraded case fans (6) If I wanted to buy this now, the price would be over 6K including NC state tax. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dermot Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 Quote I'm also finding it frustrating that X13 requires me to get a new desktop and/or laptop in order to run. I didn't realize some of the render styles would not work correctly with an inadequate graphics card. My line drawings do not show the cabinet hardware, when I change vector views from color to b&w, the hardware also disappears, though we found a workaround... As long as your computer meets our minimum system requirements, you should not need a new computer or graphics card to run X13. Please see this other post I made that has some more detailed information: Regarding the missing lines for cabinet hardware, I believe that this is the result of a bug in X13. Upgrading your computer is very unlikely to have any affect on this. We are currently working on a fix for this and hope to have it available in the next update. For now, if you turn off color and then find you have some missing lines, they should come back if you use the Rebuild 3D tool. You should always report these kinds of problems to our technical support team if and when you run into them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anne_CA Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 Thank you! I just tried the Rebuild 3D tool and it worked. My original issue with the disappearing hardware was happening with elevations, so the tech support person I originally spoke with had me create a CAD Detail From View as a workaround. My comment was misleading... I know I can run X13 without the upgrades, and I am doing so. The last update to X13 fixed another rendering issue I was having, which was exported drawings not retaining the color shown in the rendered view. Thank you again. I have to remember to come to this forum more often. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kbird1 Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 2 hours ago, MarkMc said: The only Ti card I would consider is a 3060, definitely not a 3070 or 80 Ti, especially in a laptop. I've not yet seen either of my cards use more than 60% of the video memory. The 3070 and 3080 Ti draw more power/heat, are not well regarded, and offer little performance increase in Chief. (even gamers are avoiding.) Similarly unless using some other programs an i( won't get you any better performance in X13 (and the 112th gen i( offers little) Personally I'd stick with 32GB ram as I've never been close to maxing that out and I run a lot of stuff at once. Same goes for the Killer card (now owned by INtel) I disabled that last one I had and won't be bothering again. OTOH I would look into having the machine tooled in particular getting cooling performance upgraded. I also like to get some sort of minimum backlight bleed on laptops-not perfect but better. Finally note that each maker may list a particular GPU but the actual power allowed for it varies from brand to brand so a 3070 in one is not the same as a 3070 in another. Yes if system is only for Chief 32GB is enough , use the extra money elsewhere or save it Laptops with 3070 or 3080,s are fairly new and I don't follow the segment much now I have my Asus with a 2070Super , So I cannot comment on the overheating Issues Mark is referring too. The 3060Ti is a good choice I think , just know it will not compete with a 3060Ti Desktop edition due to Laptop Power Limiting. Even my Desktop 3080 is (artificially I believe) power limited but Runs X13 fine , though I am not happy with RT-PBR Views especially in Plans brought forward. Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kbird1 Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 1 hour ago, anne_CA said: Ryzen 9 5900X 12-core processor, dual-tower CPU air cooler, X570 motherboard with WiFi and Bluetooth 32GB RAM (upgradeable to 128GB), 500GB NVME SSD (Windows, programs), 1TB NVME SSD (active work) EVGA RTX 3090 24GB high-airflow case, 850W 80+ Gold power supply, Windows 10 Pro, full set of upgraded case fans (6) If I wanted to buy this now, the price would be over 6K including NC state tax. Get a 3060Ti , no need for a 3090 for Chief Still sounds like someone is overcharging though....... $6k? Check AVADirect...... it is where MarkMc recently got his new System, and Recommends them. I built my own...... M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkMc Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 1 hour ago, Thad58 said: Mark, Are you running X13? Yes for a while now, updated signature. I had also tested it on my older Sager 17" w/ 6700k, 980m w/8GB, 32 ram. Just no real time ray trace. I ordered the Evoc (for $2500 comparable same now with a 3070) end of summer to use on 13. That was before 3000 cards were avaialble on laptops. Eventually I decided that for the amount of RTRT I need to do a 3000 card was in order. I had that built by AVA beginning of March for 3K; talked with salesman to ensure availability of parts but had decided ahead of time on a 3070. I'm happy. Just helped a client order a somewhat similar system but a Z590, i5 11600K (matches my i7 in use), a different 3070 and slightly lesser MOBO but most of the rest the same for $2600. Either of us could have done comparable Ryzen machines. 13 minutes ago, Kbird1 said: The 3060Ti is a good choice I think I'd agree with that. If I were getting a lappie today I'd get that or a 3070. Unlike Mick I'm quite happy with RTRT but think I've worked with it more ?:-) Still an occasional quirk but overall pleased with it and with both machines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solution anne_CA Posted July 9, 2021 Solution Share Posted July 9, 2021 34 minutes ago, Kbird1 said: Get a 3060Ti , no need for a 3090 for Chief Still sounds like someone is overcharging though....... $6k? Check AVADirect...... it is where MarkMc recently got his new System, and Recommends them. I built my own...... M. The only reason I was considering the 3090 is because the 3080 cards are unavailable unless you want to pay price gougers. The recommended specs called out the RTX 3080 and past experience has shown me that if I don't get the recommended requirements, I have problems with future upgrades. I will have to do some research and see how the 3060Ti compares to the 3080. My desktop is from 2012 and no longer able to support CA so I've been using it on my laptop. If these workarounds can help me until I upgrade my desktop, that's great. Thank you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kbird1 Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 1 hour ago, anne_CA said: The only reason I was considering the 3090 is because the 3080 cards are unavailable unless you want to pay price gougers. The recommended specs called out the RTX 3080 and past experience has shown me that if I don't get the recommended requirements, I have problems with future upgrades. I will have to do some research and see how the 3060Ti compares to the 3080. My desktop is from 2012 and no longer able to support CA so I've been using it on my laptop. If these workarounds can help me until I upgrade my desktop, that's great. Thank you! In the other Thread you are in, Alastair got a new AMD Card for his Older Prebuilt ( your 645 does not have Shader 6) and JTCapa a 3060Ti I didn't pay double over Retail for my 3080 but I did pay a Large Premium approx 50%...... 3-4 months ago... and I had to buy other parts as well ( a bundle to get it ) ..... the longer you can wait the better but it may take so time to come down still. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thad58 Posted July 10, 2021 Author Share Posted July 10, 2021 Thanks KBird and Anne I can run CA but this computer drive me crazy. A Dell Alienware computer maxed out is $4,900.00 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thad58 Posted July 14, 2021 Author Share Posted July 14, 2021 Ok I just purchased it I hope this is my best option because being a laptop I am stuck with this for IO hope at less 4 years. Alienware x17 R1 11th Gen Intel(R) Core(TM) i7 11800H (8-Core, 24MB L3 Cache, up to 4.6GHz with Turbo Boost Windows 10 Pro English NVIDIA(R) GeForce RTX(TM) 3070 8GB GDDR6 17.3" FHD (1920 x 1080) 165Hz 3ms with ComfortView Plus 64GB DDR4 XMP 3466MHz 4TB (2x 2TB) M.2 PCIe NVMe SSD RAID0 $3,900.00 Thanks everyone for the input. I have a lot of things I stay up un so computers and hardware are not my thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Posted July 15, 2021 Share Posted July 15, 2021 I'm no computer geek. I need to upgrade my video card like most others here to run X13, & next years X-14. Priority is my PC because I use it for 95% of my design work. I've gone looking and came across a NVIDIA GF3060i. My issue is, I'm not sure if the remainder of my system might not need upgrading as well. I live on a small coastal town with one computer store, which is closed because of...well, you know what it is. So I'm needing some help. Existing PC Windows 10 Home 1.0 TB Hard drive Processor: Intel(R) Core(TM) i5-4590 CPU @ 3.30GHz 3.30 GHz RAM: 16.0 GB Graphics Card NVIDIA GeForce GT-720 64-bit operating system, x64-based processor I'm most concerned with cooling, as in ensuring the rest of the system doesn't melt down because I upgraded the graphics card. Any of your computer minded folks see an issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kbird1 Posted July 15, 2021 Share Posted July 15, 2021 15 minutes ago, Canuck said: I'm no computer geek. I need to upgrade my video card like most others here to run X13, & next years X-14. Priority is my PC because I use it for 95% of my design work. I've gone looking and came across a NVIDIA GF3060i. My issue is, I'm not sure if the remainder of my system might not need upgrading as well. I live on a small coastal town with one computer store, which is closed because of...well, you know what it is. So I'm needing some help. Existing PC Windows 10 Home 1.0 TB Hard drive Processor: Intel(R) Core(TM) i5-4590 CPU @ 3.30GHz 3.30 GHz RAM: 16.0 GB Graphics Card NVIDIA GeForce GT-720 64-bit operating system, x64-based processor I'm most concerned with cooling, as in ensuring the rest of the system doesn't melt down because I upgraded the graphics card. Any of your computer minded folks see an issue? If you don't NEED the new PBR-RT View you can get a cheaper graphics card and it will essentially be like using X12 , the new Views are the only reason you need an RTX card ( 2000 or 3000 Series ). But not really as you list doesn't give any specs on the mobo, ram etc etc but at the moment getting a pre-built is still the most reasonable cost way to get a 3000 series in most cases especially if you are due to get a new system anyway. eg Dell has the Black Friday in July Sale on right now..... in CDN at least https://deals.dell.com/en-ca/productdetail/9ovl I'd go 32GB ram and a 512GB NVME and 2TB Data drive though..... M. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwhitt Posted September 8, 2021 Share Posted September 8, 2021 On 7/9/2021 at 3:13 PM, Dermot said: As long as your computer meets our minimum system requirements, you should not need a new computer or graphics card to run X13. Please see this other post I made that has some more detailed information: Regarding the missing lines for cabinet hardware, I believe that this is the result of a bug in X13. Upgrading your computer is very unlikely to have any affect on this. We are currently working on a fix for this and hope to have it available in the next update. For now, if you turn off color and then find you have some missing lines, they should come back if you use the Rebuild 3D tool. You should always report these kinds of problems to our technical support team if and when you run into them. Any update on this bug? Dermot said it would hopefully be fixed in the next update. It is not! Creating a CAD detail from view for every elevation is too much work (do lots of kitchens and baths). Please advise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kbird1 Posted September 8, 2021 Share Posted September 8, 2021 13 minutes ago, kwhitt said: Dermot said it would hopefully be fixed in the next update. It is not! Not sure if we've had another update ?, only been 1 so far..... If doesn't seem to happen on every Kitchen/bath for me though..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwhitt Posted September 8, 2021 Share Posted September 8, 2021 6 minutes ago, Kbird1 said: Not sure if we've had another update ?, only been 1 so far..... If doesn't seem to happen on every Kitchen/bath for me though..... There was an update a few days ago and the first one since this post started. I can confirm that it does not happen on every job. It happens with all my custom hardware symbols though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dermot Posted September 8, 2021 Share Posted September 8, 2021 I believe the problems that were reported to us regarding curved surfaces, such as with cabinet hardware, where they were missing some edge lines in vector views were corrected in the 23.2.0.55 update. If you have not downloaded and installed the 23.2 update, you should do this as soon as you are able. If you are still experiencing any problems that are similar to this, then you need to report those problems to our technical support team. You need to include a plan that demonstrates the problem along with clear instructions for how to reproduce the problem, preferably something like a saved camera view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kbird1 Posted September 8, 2021 Share Posted September 8, 2021 16 minutes ago, kwhitt said: There was an update a few days ago and the first one since this post started Personally I did not get an update this week, last one was Aug 16th I think? IIRC? you sure you were on the latest? ie : 0.55 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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