kwhitt
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Posts posted by kwhitt
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Here are a couple more comparisons between X12 and X13 from the same project.
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19 minutes ago, Chopsaw said:
Those are excellent examples to send in Kevin. Also don't forget to mention the auto generated light fixture beside the doorway.
Digital shadows ? What is up with that ?
Hey Chop - not sure what's going on with the shadows. I could always get quick, decent results with the standard renderer - now not the case. I suspect the ambient occlusion is not working. That would go a long way to improving the images. I'm tempted to stick with X12 for now, but there are so many cool new features in X13. I am blown away by the control I have over cabinet door and drawer reveals, but I much prefer the results I was getting from X12. We do a lot of cabinetry!
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I forgot to mention that the ambient occlusion is maxed out at 100%. It's as if there is no ambient occlusion at all.
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I realize there will be differences between X12 and X13 when it comes to the rendering engine; however, the standard renderer in X13 looks awful compared to the results I got in X12.
The new standard render looks completely washed out even when I decrease material brightness. I've also played around with ambient settings. It appears the shadows aren't dark enough and I don't see where I have any control over the darkness/brightness of shadows. There's also something strange happening with the cast shadows in the image below. The first image is X12 and the second is X13.
Are there plans to improve this or is the focus solely only PBR with real-time raytracing? If so, that's unfortunate as the standard renderer was great at turning out a quick image.
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5 hours ago, Alaskan_Son said:
You should absolutely report it yourself if you want to see it fixed.
It would be redundant as Dermot has already stated they are working on it. From Dermot in response to the original poster:
"Regarding the missing lines for cabinet hardware, I believe that this is the result of a bug in X13. Upgrading your computer is very unlikely to have any affect on this. We are currently working on a fix for this and hope to have it available in the next update. For now, if you turn off color and then find you have some missing lines, they should come back if you use the Rebuild 3D tool. You should always report these kinds of problems to our technical support team if and when you run into them."
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2 hours ago, Kbird1 said:
Someone Mentioned doing a Cad Detail from View and Copying it back into the Elevation , until it is fixed.....
*found it finaly but doesn't say much more....
Thanks Mick. I tried several different searches all to no avail.
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1 hour ago, Alaskan_Son said:
What did Technical Support tell you?
Tech support told me nothing. I read it somewhere on this forum. It is my understanding from the thread that it has been reported. I am not the one who found the bug.
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I know this has been reported, but I can't find the post with the solution. Would someone mind commenting or pointing me to the correct thread? Thanks, Kevin
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3 hours ago, Kbird1 said:
www.pugetsystems.com
I believe
MarkMc just got a new Desktop from AXADirect - contact Kyle he told me he and recommends them, but I built my Own.
M.
You are correct!
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4 hours ago, Designer1 said:
Speaking of computer specs.... Im still driving around in my Model T Alienware waiting till Black Friday/Cyber Monday for wheels and deals on computers since everyone is saying the prices are bloated right now. Ive been getting recommendations on several custom pc builders and the first thing I do is call tech support and see how long the wait time is and how the company handles customers. 75% of the places I called have HORRIBLE tech support/ customer service and Id never buy from them.
Does anyone recommend any good places (price and good customer service) to get a pc ($3000 +/- ) desktop for X13? I still have a few months before upgrading the computer so Im still kicking tires.
I already bought X13 but cant use it because the Model T doesnt run the new stuff.
Chad - I've been dealing with pugentsystems.com. They are currently 4 weeks out, but the customer service is great. Their prices are in line when I've compared. Geno is my contact there.
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10 hours ago, Kbird1 said:
You can see the Chevron wallpaper I used on the Wall, reflected on the Glass wall Camera side
Yep, it's here this morning...
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47 minutes ago, HannahKucerova said:
Did a quick browse/search and don't see where anyone else has posted about this.
Has anyone run into imported materials not stretching properly (or as they previously did in X12 and backwards) in the new X13? I import a lot of custom countertops materials and previously when the material was set to stretch to fit, it would spread out nicely and create a fairly realistic interpretation of the material. In X13, the same material now has multiple directional face lines when on a surface that has a hole in it (i.e. a countertop with sink, etc.). I do remember seeing this same phenomenon in prior versions when I would use a custom tile material on a floor (for like a shower, but I always would undo the stretch to fit option because in those instances I *wanted* the repeating pattern.), but never on a countertop.
The attached pictures are the same custom countertop size, sink, faucet and material...just one is x12 and one is X13. Both are using the Custom Countertop tool. I'm pretty sure this has to do with some of the new rendering coding, so maybe it is proper for X13, but I am hoping there is a way to get around it as it does not look good in presentations. Am I missing something easy?
I have run into that, but it usually clears up when I make it one large custom countertop. It is happening to me when the cabinet countertops are segmented. You might try ticking "global mapping" under the texture tab in the materials dialog box.
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21 minutes ago, Kbird1 said:
You can see the Chevron wallpaper I used on the Wall, reflected on the Glass wall Camera side
Mick - I don't see your uploaded images, but thanks for confirming. Now that I've spent the whole day on this, what does it mean? Nothing really as I've spent hours trying to put what I've learned into practical use in my bathroom scene. I've removed the wall and substituted for p-solids as the shower glass, drawn the p-solids in positive and negative directions in case the normals got flipped, removed the windows, changed my camera view to outside the shower tile volume, made the shower part of a larger room, tried various material adjustments, turned the p-solids into surfaces, etc., etc.... I can't recreate this simple setup into a practical application for a real scene. Aside from all of this, I am excited to see the direction taken by Chief as pertains to their rendering engine.
I'm finished! I think I'll pass on the new computer and turn off refraction for now. It's still much better than anyone else is able to do in this market and the customer just won't notice there's no refraction. Thanks for all the help today. Hope I didn't wear you out! Kevin
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13 minutes ago, Kbird1 said:
Nope , I just didn't see any red in the Mirror , so swapped it back to Default and it went "grey" not beige as expected..... maybe I had wrong plan ? you have posted a few , I'll try again with Glass02.....
Nope I don't have the Damask texture apparently let me try something else.
Mick.
It's definitely showing up. Here's a shot of a cylinder reflected in the mirror on the camera side of the refractive glass. I'd be curious to see what you get. I posted the file again in my latest post so as not to confuse with the others.
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40 minutes ago, Kbird1 said:
For some reason the Wall behind the Camera is RED ? hence the "tint" in the Pics .....
Changing it back to default I still do not see a reflection as such ...of the Room like a Mirror ...... in fact
the Mirror goes "gray" like in your bathroom once the Wall is the default material again - cam moved to
side incase I was missing the room reflection
with Refraction OFF in the RTRT technique DBX there is a reflection.....
Mick - I think you misunderstood my method. The wall is red intentionally, so that it unmistakably shows up in the mirror reflection. Here is the same scene with a funky damask wallpaper and the pattern shows up in the reflection through reflective glass on the left mirror which is the shiny metal material hack. The right mirror is the standard material set to mirror under properties and shows no reflection. This cannot be mistaken for an aberrant red hue. The engine, it seems, is capable of showing reflections through glass under certain circumstances. Now only to find out what those circumstances might be... Attached is the file for confirmation.
I think Chief's new engine is robust, but it now needs physically correct materials to complete it.
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1 hour ago, Christina_Girerd said:
Oops - you're right. Got distracted. Here is a similar view (didn't save the other one) in a PBR export, again no materials or lighting changed. This took a little longer, maybe over one minute, but I had video playing in another window which might have impacted it.
Thanks Christina for confirming the export works fine on your machine.
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28 minutes ago, MarkMc said:
@kwhittI tried stripping down a plan from the one I posted the image of earlier and ran into the same issue you had-no reflections. I used edit area, copy and pasted to a new plan. Both plans use the same materials and same camera/render settings so I don't know what is up with that.
OTOH- @Renerabbitt suggestion to use a transparent material works just fine keeping refraction on for both 04 and 07
Which would do it for me as a solution, ez. I also messed around making one side of the glass wall opening no material on the stripped down plan mentioned earlier (and on this one just for grins)-that works fine on the wall even with tempered glass but it doesn't work on the door.
Aside, I found out that the export issue I was having was due to using all 3 monitors. After both you and Christine brought mentioned short export times I did some testing with an overhead.
Thanks again Mark. I've decided to render the whole thing without refraction and call it done. I will most likely not be buying the new machine if it provides no advantage. I just don't understand how it is working as I would it expect it to in the last scene file I posted while not at all in others.
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15 minutes ago, Christina_Girerd said:
FYI, the cam4 view thru the glass shower door shot doesn't have reflections with a 3090 card either. This was a PBR exported image, screen size. Took less than a minute. Someone made a comment about the mirror material being odd from a top view, but the second image is a floor overview shot, PBR exported basically instantaneous, and all looks good to me. I did not change any materials or settings.
Hi Christina - thanks for running the test on the RTX3090. The second image looks to me like it is the standard render (not PBR) or did I misunderstand something? Kevin
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19 minutes ago, Kbird1 said:
I am not so sure about Shiny metal working ? I placed 2 normal mirror from my library either Side here
Normal Mirror in your mirror ---- not work Either in your Frame or my Mirrors
I made your Polyline Glass Wall material have Mirror Properties and look what happens...wasn't expecting that.....
I changed your Mirror back to mirror BTW not Shiny Metal.... but you can hardly see you "Glass Wall" now.
Any chance you have a really old Mirror Material of Chief's? there is one that doesn't work in PBR at all
or is you Mirror Material one of your Own too perhaps?
Thanks Mick. The mirror material I used was from the library and I altered the settings from mirror to shiny metal. It was a new material. Would you mind rendering my scene using the saved camera right out of the box with no changes? It works for me every time - just tested again...
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6 minutes ago, kwhitt said:
Yes, I am still trying to figure out if it works or not. The simple file I uploaded earlier (attached again) seems to work when the mirror is a shiny metal. The glass is refractive and refraction is ticked on in the PBR DBX. Mick - would you mind taking a look to confirm?
I know that the normal direction on the surface of the symbol in other render engines determines whether or not refraction will work within a volume. There doesn't seem to be a way in Chief to reverse the normals short of making a symbol out of your glass model and reserving within the symbol DBX. I thought this might account for when it sometimes works and sometimes it doesn't. I tried this experiment and it failed too.
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2 minutes ago, Kbird1 said:
That's what I did above last night and it didn't work ? which is why I was wonder what you did or didn't do....
M.
Yes, I am still trying to figure out if it works or not. The simple file I uploaded earlier (attached again) seems to work when the mirror is a shiny metal. The glass is refractive and refraction is ticked on in the PBR DBX. Mick - would you mind taking a look to confirm?
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20 minutes ago, MarkMc said:
@kwhitt Yes disabling refractions works about the same as changing the material from glass to just transparent.
However the original rendering sample I posted that was inside a shower, with glass door with refraction ON. There is a lot less light going on there and no symbol issues.
You're card will work, as Kbird pointed out it will behave similar to a 2070 -a 3000 series card will be 3 to 5 times as fast. (my 3070 is about 5xs as fast as the laptop 2070S which would about match a 2060 S Desktop)
Just curious here
Have you tried to export image of that rendering? How long is it taking? Do you know which resources are being used if it takes a realistic amount of time. On my desktop I forced close after 20+ minutes .
Mark - do you have the scene you posted earlier? I'd like to try rendering that on my RTX5000. If successful, I won't purchase the new machine. Kevin
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15 minutes ago, MarkMc said:
@kwhitt Yes disabling refractions works about the same as changing the material from glass to just transparent.
However the original rendering sample I posted that was inside a shower, with glass door with refraction ON. There is a lot less light going on there and no symbol issues.
You're card will work, as Kbird pointed out it will behave similar to a 2070 -a 3000 series card will be 3 to 5 times as fast. (my 3070 is about 5xs as fast as the laptop 2070S which would about match a 2060 S Desktop)
Just curious here
Have you tried to export image of that rendering? How long is it taking? Do you know which resources are being used if it takes a realistic amount of time. On my desktop I forced close after 20+ minutes .
Mark - thanks for the reply. It sounds like you are saying that Chief is capable of reflections through refractive glass. I tested your theory about the reflective objects inside a symbol and it didn't seem to make any difference. I deleted the tile shower symbol and moved the mirrors outside of the wall cabinet framing and the results were the same.
It takes about 35 seconds to export CAM04 on my machine. I've had no problem.
If it's true that Chief can do what I want, it sure would be nice if someone could render my scene on the recommended graphics card. That said, it looks as though Mick has already done that and got the same results as me...
Thanks again for the time, Kevin
Digital shadows ? What is up with that ?
STANDARD RENDER IN X13 VS. X12
in General Q & A
Posted
Hey Mick. Agreed. I opened a case with tech support. Will let everyone know what they say.
I just noticed something else that's really strange. It appears the ceiling gets lighter while the floor gets darker - exactly the opposite of what should happen with down lights at the ceiling. Notice that the "banding" around the vaulted ceiling is washed out in the 2nd image (X13) and the carpet under the sectional sofa is dark (can barely notice the pattern). This is the opposite of what I'd expect with a room illuminated by down lights.
Materials that contain image maps (textures) like the beaded board ceiling, art, etc. don't seem to vary between the two versions except for those closest to the floor.