This Is Big News In The Future Of Bim/cad As We Know It.

[4hotshoez]

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/trimble-and-nemetschek-group-partner-to-expand-adoption-of-building-information-modeling-across-building-design-construction-and-operation-2015-05-04

 

Nemetschek now owns Archicad, VectorWorks, AllPlan and many other Architectural apps. Trimble is also a power house that now owns Sketchup. Both have agreed to collaborate and join forces in development of something better for architectural users that helps develop a BIM standard that is sharable.

 

I know this seems like nothing in the small world of Chief Architect users, but it will mostly effect Revit users at first. And if they are successful in developing a smarter product, all Chief users will be taking a second look shortly after.

[lbuttery]

Todd:

 

given the resistance I've received  over the last decade whenever the BIM issue

was raised by CA and many of the users on this forum I seriously doubt

if this will have any effect on the Chief community

 

Lew

[Alaskan_Son]

Todd:

 

given the resistance I've received  over the last decade whenever the BIM issue

was raised by CA and many of the users on this forum I seriously doubt

if this will have any effect on the Chief community

 

Lew

I for one hope it doesn't.  Stay the course Chief.  You have something special and I think it will become even more so as the "Big Dogs" continue to "progress".  Just improve what you already do so well and continue to add new features without selling out.  Just my thoughts. 

[RodCole]

It is about content and file formats for leveraging assets ASAP in the workflow in my book as far as BIM is concerned.  Chief is great on content and medium to low on file compatibility.  Close in many ways, but still too difficult to work with in the sense of having to jump though hoops repeatedly to get even basic file exchanges done.

 

Looks like the momentum is building for BIM. I see it on the commercial construction side as well.  Once it takes hold there will be no looking back, and my bet is it will be sooner rather than later.

 

Lew, it pobably won't end up as we may see it now.  Probably better. 

[Nicinus]

This means that IFC support will be adopted faster in the industry, so something for Chief to keep an eye on long term. For now I would personally benefit more from FBX.

[Joe_Carrick]

Common Data and File Formats have been a goal for over 30 years.  Back in the early 1980's there was an initiative to create a standard for 2D CAD called the GIS (Graphic Interchange Standard) which never really became a reality.  As much as companies say they want a common standard for interoperability - they tend in the long run to resist actually doing it.  Perhaps Trimble and Nemetschek will follow thru with a standard that works with their products.

 

The chance that they would assist Chief or SoftPlan or other 3D CAD Software in this effort is IMO not very good.  These big companies are not really interested in helping the smaller companies - unless they can swallow them.

[Nicinus]

No need to. IFC is an open standard that is now ISO and required for bidding by many governments in Europe on public projects. Autodesk was originally involved in development if I remember correctly and although they have been a bit slow on it in the last decade (probably due to having such a grip in the US with their own formats) they now seems more active and Revit is getting better and better support with each version. 

 

Again, probably not critical for Chief in the next couple of years but definitely crucial that they are aware so that it may be implemented down the line.

[4hotshoez]

My thought was the horsepower behind the effort will likely make the project a success in addition with access to the user via the internet which was not available 30 years ago. Most Chief users do not need to share data to the extent that is done in commercial architecture, so the incentive to get on board with a universal standard is not so strong. Plus, CA development does not have such horsepower to implement most user suggestions let alone a new standard.

 

The developers within Trimble and Nemetschek have resources and good ideas and a strong user base around the world. I have no doubt that in the next five years architectural modeling and documentation will work very well together in a very user friendly way. Even more than we have now. Any companies that stand still will be left in the past. Including CA.

 

I would think this will be making Autodesk very nervous or at least they should be.

 

Keep your eye on Sketchup as that may become the new core technology as a result of this collaborative, and *.SKP will become the new *.DWG as a file sharing format.

 

These are my personal predictions, for what it is worth.

[Joe_Carrick]

Todd,

 

DWG is already archaic.  It's very little more than 2D vector graphics (lines, arcs and text with linestyles, colors, layers, & fonts).

 

IMO 3DS is better than SKP but it's almost impossible to come up with any standard that's going to encompass everything.  CA probably has something in their database that no-one else has - and that's probably true for every system.  It would be the same for every other 3D Architectural CAD system - some little nuance of the database has no corollary in any other system. 

 

This means that unless every one of those can be added to the "Standard" then it will always be less than perfect.

[4hotshoez]

Joe,

People still ask for DWG all the time.

 

I don't disagree. It is likely that one app, like AutoCAD did years ago, will not dominate the market and become the "standard" format for file sharing. It is more likely that many 3D/BIM/CAD programs will be able to write to a standardized file format that no one software company owns or natively saves to like *.plan.

 

The only reason I suggested *.SKP is because so many people own it and use it. It is well beyond Autocad ever hoped to be in terms of number of users.

[jcaffee]

I was reading an article in the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette a year or so ago.  The article was describing a solprop architect who was in the process of going "digital".  It was a very funny article as, at least from my perspective, it seemed to be more germane to 1995 rather than 2015. 

 

However, one of the tidbits presented by the author was an anecdotal "statistic" from the county zoning and code department that approximately 60% of the residential plans they review are HAND. DRAWN. ON. PAPER. 

 

So, while the CMA (and that's what this is, a Cooperative Marketing Agreement) between Nemetschek and Trimble is interesting from the 60,000' view, it has little meaning in the narrower view of residential design and construction.  For real?  How are you going to get technical interop for collision detection with trades/architects/designers who still take pen to paper?  Are your customers really going to choke down the costs associated with fully detailed MEP plans when the local residential code authority doesn't require them?

 

The more power to Trimble and Nemetschek in their pursuit of market share, but I doubt the technical trickle-down will have much effect on residential design.

 

For my own selfishness, I'd love to see clean IO with DAE, IFC, FBX with application specific export to...  But hey, that would require CA to modernize the codebase.  Feedback panel, are you getting this?  Modernize the codebase.

 

jon

[Joe_Carrick]

Jon,

I can assure you that the Feedback Panel doesn't have that sort of power. OTOH, I'm also sure CA really wants to modernize and simplify the codebase, if for no other reason than to make it much easier to maintain the Application. No software company likes spaghetti.

[Nicinus]

Are your customers really going to choke down the costs associated with fully detailed MEP plans when the local residential code authority doesn't require them?

 

I would love to see a residential level ductwork tool so that I can give the HVAC guys my view before they start to build soffits everywhere. I wouldn't mind if it could do basic Manual J calculations either. And while I'm at it it would be great to have simple load/span tables as well. 

 

I hope Chief continues to focus on making their program the most versatile residential tool on the market, it will take them a long way for the foreseeable future. The commercial race is over. If I was in marketing at Chief I would interview as many of their architect clients as possible to find out what they really need in terms of the occasional restaurant/store, and see if that can be accommodated (curtain walls I would assume) and then leave it at that. 

[jcaffee]

Joe, I think you underestimate the purpose of the Feedback Panel (or I wildly overestimate).  It's my belief that they don't so much fly, as plummet from tree to tree... oops, wrong opinion.  My view on the Feedback Panel is that it is a means to help staff set priorities going forward.  At least, in my experience as a product manager, this is one role of such focus groups.

 

As CA staff has hinted here, there is internal discussion regarding the modernization issue, but to date the status quo side is winning the battle.  Perhaps if the rabble can be roused; when at the end of your session, the question is asked, "Is there anything else?"  That, in unison, the Panel exclaims, "Modernize the codebase!"  Perhaps then the status quo guys can be shamed out of their lazy ways and agree to open the CA universe to some superhappyfuntime innovation-tastic priorities. 

 

jon