Lighthouse

terrain modeling expert

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Hi,

I've got a new project that has a very tough site plan to model, steep hill with various retaining walls.  I have the surveryor's CAD drawing with lots of detail.  My goal is to have someone deliver the site model to me before I begin design of the house.  The site has two existing structures whose foundations I will be using, so those level pads should be in the model as well.  I need someone who is waaay better than me to model this because it must be accurate.  I don't plan to alter the site plan at all (since I'm using the existing foundations, so it would probably be ok if the site was modeled in a different program, if that was easier, and imported in CA.  Anyone interested?  Needs to happen within the next 7-10 days at the latest. I've attached the site plan, I will probably take a bunch of photos on the weekend to make it easier to visualize.    thx

Lunenburg-Sunset Lane-Tousignant.dwg

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I would recommend doing each building in a separate plan 

then create a 3D symbol of the building and store each in the library

then add each building symbol to the master terrain plan

 

this method gives total freedom to adjust the terrain or the buildings without affecting the others

 

while all buildings and the terrain can all be in the same plan

it takes a master chiefer to control them while making changes to any of them

 

Lew

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50 minutes ago, lbuttery said:

I would recommend doing each building in a separate plan 

then create a 3D symbol of the building and store each in the library

then add each building symbol to the master terrain plan

 

this method gives total freedom to adjust the terrain or the buildings without affecting the others

 

while all buildings and the terrain can all be in the same plan

it takes a master chiefer to control them while making changes to any of them

 

Lew

Thanks Lew, that's an interesting method.  Makes sense, since the terrain doesn't know what floor level to relate to.  I've never made a whole house into a symbol, but I will test that out.  I just wonder if CA is the best program to model terrain in.  It seems to want to do it's own thing a lot, ideally it would just do what you told it to.  But I'm sure I'm using it wrong.  For simple stuff I can get it to work, but on complicated plans there is always something that goes haywire and I waste lots of time trying to figure it out.  This isn't something I could hire you to do, is it?

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12 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

Thanks Lew, that's an interesting method.  Makes sense, since the terrain doesn't know what floor level to relate to.  I've never made a whole house into a symbol, but I will test that out.  I just wonder if CA is the best program to model terrain in.  It seems to want to do it's own thing a lot, ideally it would just do what you told it to.  But I'm sure I'm using it wrong.  For simple stuff I can get it to work, but on complicated plans there is always something that goes haywire and I waste lots of time trying to figure it out.  This isn't something I could hire you to do, is it?

Ill take a look tomrrow and let you know . CHeers

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1 hour ago, lbuttery said:

I would recommend doing each building in a separate plan 

then create a 3D symbol of the building and store each in the library 

 

Lew

That is the method I use.   


Here is one where I combined GIS data, an actual site survey, and then house placement.

 

 

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11 hours ago, VisualDandD said:

That is the method I use.   


Here is one where I combined GIS data, an actual site survey, and then house placement.

 

 

 

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David:

 

sorry, but I am retired and never understood terrain myself

 

my partner did all out terrain work

 

he is semi-retired and is only doing 3D renders and rays these days

 

Lew

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19 hours ago, Lighthouse said:

Hi,

I've got a new project that has a very tough site plan to model, steep hill with various retaining walls.  I have the surveryor's CAD drawing with lots of detail.  My goal is to have someone deliver the site model to me before I begin design of the house.  The site has two existing structures whose foundations I will be using, so those level pads should be in the model as well.  I need someone who is waaay better than me to model this because it must be accurate.  I don't plan to alter the site plan at all (since I'm using the existing foundations, so it would probably be ok if the site was modeled in a different program, if that was easier, and imported in CA.  Anyone interested?  Needs to happen within the next 7-10 days at the latest. I've attached the site plan, I will probably take a bunch of photos on the weekend to make it easier to visualize.    thx

Lunenburg-Sunset Lane-Tousignant.dwg

This is your terrain model imported..the data provided is fine for some parts but otherwise not very useful, typical for flat data. This is a decent amount of work with not a very big timeline. Not sure I could get it done in that time with other jobs ongoing. Maybe you can change the timeline or find someone with no ongoing work.
image.thumb.png.7b5b8457f7edce14bb500d6153fd70a4.png

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On 9/15/2020 at 3:42 PM, lbuttery said:

I would recommend doing each building in a separate plan 

then create a 3D symbol of the building and store each in the library

then add each building symbol to the master terrain plan

 

this method gives total freedom to adjust the terrain or the buildings without affecting the others

 

while all buildings and the terrain can all be in the same plan

it takes a master chiefer to control them while making changes to any of them

 

Lew

 

So if I understand you correctly, you can make a 3D symbol for the ENTIRE house and save it to the library.  Then open your terrain plan and import it like any other 3D symbol and rotate / position the house exactly where you want?  Then you have a new plan with both terrain and house combined, fully editable in CA?

 

If so, how exactly do you create this house 3D symbol?

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29 minutes ago, mgianzero said:

If so, how exactly do you create this house 3D symbol?

 

Just like any other symbol -- don't overthink it :)

 

ct1.thumb.png.db2f50e123dfe8a2e57bf858d80d635c.png

 

810868031_ModelWithFraming.thumb.jpg.227b3126ef57b35e6c8358e1bbd8ff18.jpg

 

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16 hours ago, solver said:

 

Just like any other symbol -- don't overthink it :)

 

ct1.thumb.png.db2f50e123dfe8a2e57bf858d80d635c.png

 

810868031_ModelWithFraming.thumb.jpg.227b3126ef57b35e6c8358e1bbd8ff18.jpg

 

 

Eric,

 

I appreciate your wanting to help.  But submitting an answer such as this does nothing for anyone here.  If I knew how to create an entire 3D symbol of my house, then I wouldn't have asked the question. 

 

I know how to take a house that is in its own separate plan and copy it and paste it to another plan.  That I do by making sure my "Edit Areas" option is selected for all floors and then I cut it and open my other plan and paste it - done.  But there doesn't appear to be an option anywhere on the lower panel to convert this object to a symbol.  It's easy to select a few architectural objects and select the "convert selected objects to a symbol" option on the base panel.  My problem has to do with "how to you select the ENTIRE house and make it a 3D symbol.

 

A more detailed answer with perhaps an example would be best to clarify the steps here.

 

Marc

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4 hours ago, solver said:

ct1.thumb.png.724f348d7595d15e613a6e92002949fa.png

 

ct1.thumb.png.8172091bc8648ca23d75e038a3dd8b26.png

 

Okay, this tells me a little more information that helps.  Thank you.

 

I was trying to create a 3D symbol for my detached garage (part of a larger plan with the main house) and I selected the building in plan view since it's much easier to select just the garage in plan view.  Then I copied it to clipboard (making sure my edit area included all floors).  But then the "Convert to Symbol" option was greyed out in a 2D view.  I didn't realize that, despite the object being copied, you cannot save it as a symbol unless you then switch to a 3D view.  

 

But now that I have my 3D symbol that I now can select from the library, it's difficult to move it to EXACTLY where I want to paste it.  It seems difficult to rotate or drag your new symbol to a specific placement where you want it before it becomes a permanent addition once you click your mouse to confirm your location.

 

The one procedure that I think works better is that I create my building (garage, house, shed - whatever it may be) and then I save it as a separate file.  Then I open my terrain plan and building model as two separate plans.  I make sure the edit area (all floors) is selected and I capture and copy this same building again.  Then in the terrain model I want to add my model, I select paste and click roughly where I want my building.  Then, before I finalize the paste, I can rotate and drag my building to exactly where I want it.

 

I know this method doesn't use any layer sets to do this.  What are the downsides towards doing it this way?

 

Marc

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4 hours ago, Kbird1 said:

Mick,

 

Thanks for the reference. 

 

I am aware of the help sites / knowledge base for self-teaching.  But, please realize that it's sometimes difficult to navigate this way if you don't know exactly the terminology or what to describe what you are looking for.  But "modeling a subdivision or lot with multiple structures" makes sense once you pointed it out to me.

 

Still trying to understand how creating a unique layer set for this purpose is necessary for what I'm doing here.  But again, I'm new to the layer sets concept in CA as I've only used Home Designer Pro for years.

 

Just learning here.

 

Marc

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47 minutes ago, mgianzero said:

Still trying to understand how creating a unique layer set for this purpose is necessary for what I'm doing here

 

It is so you can turn off the display of everything in the model not strictly needed for the "House" model, eg Appliances, Fixtures, furniture, even interior Walls if on an unique layer, which allows the 3D model of the house to be as small as possible (megabyte-wise) before saving it to your Library ......

 

.....  and of course check the things you need like Exterior Walls ( incl.foundation) and roof planes etc are ON...

 

M.

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32 minutes ago, mgianzero said:

It seems difficult to rotate or drag your new symbol to a specific placement where you want it before it becomes a permanent addition once you click your mouse to confirm your location.

 

It doesn't become permanent, it may be selected and moved. The problem is moving precisely. 

 

Try dropping it outside the terrain. Select it and make an Architectural Block. You then have snap points on the corners.

 

Place a point on the terrain where you want a corner, use Point-to-Point to move it, then if needed, Transform/Replicate to move and or rotate about current point.

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15 minutes ago, solver said:

 

It doesn't become permanent, it may be selected and moved. The problem is moving precisely. 

 

 

Oh yes!  Now I see.  That makes more sense.

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2 hours ago, Kbird1 said:

 

It is so you can turn off the display of everything in the model not strictly needed for the "House" model, eg Appliances, Fixtures, furniture, even interior Walls if on an unique layer, which allows the 3D model of the house to be as small as possible (megabyte-wise) before saving it to your Library ......

 

.....  and of course check the things you need like Exterior Walls ( incl.foundation) and roof planes etc are ON...

 

M.

 

Okay.  I was trying to understand this comment in the scenario you referred to in "Modeling a Subdivision or Lot with Multiple Structures" article.

 

So let me then explain what I am doing and see if this all makes sense. ...

 

As opposed to modeling an entire subdivision I was going to use that approach with this property which has a house, teahouse (as built), tool shed (as built), a detached garage (new construction) and pool shed (new construction).  Each building will be exported out of CA as a 3D symbol and later imported into the terrain plan, all on the same property.  However, not only is it easier to tweak areas of the terrain, house, and other buildings when I have separate files for each, but if I wanted to share these building designs (and even solicit some help with them) I can simple send these smaller files - easier to send / edit this way.  Also, sometimes, when I'm tweaking the terrain, it's nice to remove the house because it blocks certain 3D (and 2D) views for editing.  Lastly, having a 3D symbol allows me to position these buildings differently on the property as different options, no?

 

Am I approaching this correctly or should I be using layer sets for this?  I don't know.  It's all new to me.

 

But then you said that when creating a 3D architectural symbol of my house (from another plan) to import to this terrain, I should exclude layer sets such as appliances, fixtures, furniture.  But don't I want all the details of the house model so that I am not losing information in my plan?  Or do I still refer to that separate plan of the house (or other building structure) when I want to see all the details?  I'm not sure.

 

Marc

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18 minutes ago, mgianzero said:

But then you said that when creating a 3D architectural symbol of my house (from another plan) to import to this terrain, I should exclude layer sets such as appliances, fixtures, furniture.  But don't I want all the details of the house model so that I am not losing information in my plan?  Or do I still refer to that separate plan of the house (or other building structure) when I want to see all the details?  I'm not sure.

 

Once it is a symbol , you can NOT explode it again into a Full 3D Model , so the aforementioned Items are of no use in the SYMBOL,

the 3D Model of the House is nothing but a hollow Shell once made into a Symbol  , so furniture cabinets etc etc are not needed.

 

M.

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Marc:

 

try holding the ctrl key while moving the symbol around

 

Lew

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