Need help to improve Ray Trace

[CBuserIndia]

Hello Everyone

 

I need Help/Suggestions/Pointers to make this Ray Trace (Render) better.

 

Attached are following files :

 

1) Project calibz with all materials zip
2) Settings zip (screenshots of all settings used):

3) ray-traced output of a sample Kitchen. I have done 15 Passes in X10 Interior version.

 

My Machine config:

Amd Ryzen 5 1600 Cpu  
Asus B 350 F Strix Gamning MB
Corsair 8gb ddr4  2666 Lpx Ram
Zotac GTX 1050 Ti 4gb Card
Kingston A 400 120gb SSD
1 TB WD Sata HDD Blue
Corsair VS 650w Smps

Thank you for help

 

Backup File Material With Calibz.zip

Raytrace-settings.zip

[DavidJPotter]

Ray Tracing has been discussed here many times in the past. Much useful advice has been posted already. I suggest you do a "Search" of the forum using "Ray Trace" as the search term and carefully read the results to then apply to your plan file yourself.

 

You also need to state what version of Chief Architect Premier you are using, so others who may want to help you can do so using the same version that you have. For instance, Version X9 and X10 are programmed to handle Ray Tracing differently-they have different Material Properties settings from each other.

 

This forum is for helping you, help yourself as opposed for us doing all the work at no cost to you, keep that in mind.

 

DJP

[CBuserIndia]

Last time I was at this forum, it felt like motivating & supporting place. What happened to that ???

 

Anyways...

 

I am using x10 Interior (already mentioned in original question)

 

I & my partners - we have been using CA since X7 & always found ray tracing challenging. We have spent time in understanding some of the older/previous discussions.

 

With this particular project ( Kitchen ), I am struggling since last couple of days. I wanted to run through people here & find out if I am missing something important.

 

I would never ever think of "doing all the work at no cost" .. OHH BOY..

 

The only reason I shared all details ( setting screenshots, plan, machine config & my render result) was to get best possible suggestion / tips.

 

I am requesting once again to community if someone can check this room/project & let me know if I am missing something crucial in settings , anything that can improve results.

Please help

 

Thank you.

[Gawdzira]

"When you got a bunch of clowns, you're gonna have a circus."

Wes (my friend from High School)

 

About that Ray Trace, I looked through your settings and nothing jumped out at me that seemed out of place. I was going to send you a doc that would have directed you to use those (or really close to) settings. How many lights do you have active? How big is the full file? (I did not open up your file). Sometimes if you turn off any lights in other rooms that are not being used you can dedicate the computer resources better. More than about 8 active lights can choke the machine. How long did 15 passes take to complete?

[HumbleChief]

8 hours ago, CBuserIndia said:

Last time I was at this forum, it felt like motivating & supporting place. What happened to that ???

It still is in general but there are a few who feel like a lecture is as important as offering genuine help. Stick around, there are still others who are more than willing to help -  without the scolding.

 

As far as RayTracing help the subject can be very deep and complex and there are no real short cuts to getting them 'right' in your eyes and to your liking. David's advice about doing a general search is very good but it will still come down to much trial and error with lighting and different settings to get what you want.

 

There are a few users who are perfecting the Physical Based Rendering or PBR and are using it instead of RT. Still a lot of homework either way. Does interiors have the PBR option?

[Gawdzira]

I tried a few passes with your file. I am using X10 Premier and I am not sure if the RT engine is different in your version. I am not getting good results either. There are a lot of active lights so you might try turning off the small cans around the cabinets or using a linear type light for your undercabinet lighting so you could have fewer lights. I think there may be one material that is causing the noise to appear. Is there some object or material you imported from Sketchup?

[HumbleChief]

I'm far from an expert but I find that the 3D lights added from the 3D>lighting>Add Lights dialog box instead of relying on the recessed can light etc. to light the scene are much more effective in getting the lighting correct. I add lights that have Custom Lumens settings and move them both vertically and horizontally through the scene until the lighting looks OK.

 

 

PBR LIGHTING.plan

[rlackore]

I'm on X10 Premier, so I don't know if Interiors is going to give different results, but here is what I did:

 

1. Changed the aluminum and stainless steel materials from Material Class>Pre-defined Metal to Material Class>Shiny Metal. I've found this improves rendering speed and quality, and gives reasonable results.

2. Reduced Ambient Occlusion from 5.0 to 3.0.

3. Reduced the resolution from 2000 to 72 dpi. 2000 is extremely high - most high-resolution printers do just fine with 300 to 600 dpi.

4. Increased the number of passes to 30.

 

 

 

By the way, if you can tell us exactly what you don't like about your original rendering, it would help us zero in on fixing any specific issue.

[DavidJPotter]

The attached document was created by one of the World's best rendering persons: Jintu Montego. These have been posted here several times in the past.

 

Ray Tracing is a process of balancing lighting and material properties to get an aesthetic result. It is an Art as opposed to a Science due to the infinite variables involved including your PC hardware and operating system. You work it making adjustments until you obtain an acceptable result.

 

Asking you to do a search here was and is good advice as the first step to a solution after you read the applicable Reference Manual sections on the problem, watch applicable video tutorials that address in this case "Ray Tracing" to be found at the Chief Architect website. After that it is a matter of trial and error practice creating an acceptable result which then brings you personal competence. I do wish you success.

 

DJP

Raytrace Settings-Forum Notes.pdf

[HumbleChief]

29 minutes ago, DavidJPotter said:

The attached document was created by one of the World's best rendering persons: Jintu Montego. These have been posted here several times in the past.

 

Ray Tracing is a process of balancing lighting and material properties to get an aesthetic result. It is an Art as opposed to a Science due to the infinite variables involved including your PC hardware and operating system. You work it making adjustments until you obtain an acceptable result.

 

Asking you to do a search here was and is good advice as the first step to a solution after you read the applicable Reference Manual sections on the problem, watch applicable video tutorials that address in this case "Ray Tracing" to be found at the Chief Architect website. After that it is a matter of trial and error practice creating an acceptable result which then brings you personal competence. I do wish you success.

Thanks David, Saved in my template files.

[HumbleChief]

55 minutes ago, rlackore said:

I'm on X10 Premier, so I don't know if Interiors is going to give different results, but here is what I did:

 

1. Changed the aluminum and stainless steel materials from Material Class>Pre-defined Metal to Material Class>Shiny Metal. I've found this improves rendering speed and quality, and gives reasonable results.

2. Reduced Ambient Occlusion from 5.0 to 3.0.

3. Reduced the resolution from 2000 to 72 dpi. 2000 is extremely high - most high-resolution printers do just fine with 300 to 600 dpi.

4. Increased the number of passes to 30.

 

 

 

By the way, if you can tell us exactly what you don't like about your original rendering, it would help us zero in on fixing any specific issue.

Robert did you add lights? Or just use the recessed cans? I can never get them to look OK by themselves.

[CBuserIndia]

Thank you, these are lot of useful suggestion. I am going to work on these and share my results soon. Thank you

 

@Gawdzira

I have 4 main lights. Projects I work always require indirect lights. For creating indirect light effect, I came up with this work-around. I am using almost 15 lights near cabinets. I have changed angle of these lights to create indirect light effect. I have a feeling that this is not best solution though.

 

Do you have suggestion on how to create this indirect light effect ?

 

15 passes took about 10 minutes of time.

 

I am going to try to turn off these extra lights & give a try.

 

This project does not have any sketchup, but all materials applied are taken from outside for manufacturers website. Very likely they are not fine-tuned for rendering.

 

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@HumbleChief

PBR is available in CA X10 Interior. I have also started looking in to this option.

Video help created by you was an eye-opener, I will have to spend next 2-3 days to work on your suggestions given in video. Thank you so much.

This was of GREAT help.

I am also goign through PBR.plan provided by you.

 

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@rlackore

Thank you so much for all suggestions. I will apply them & share my result soon. Thank you

 

"What I dont like about my image ?"

1) Almost all surfaces have white spots. Ceiling vertical walls all over there are white tiny spots, you can see them if you zoom the image. Those spots are missing in the image rendered by you. Can you tell me what could be the reason ?

2) any suggestion how to handle indirect light effect ?

 

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@DavidJPotter

Thank you David for PDF. I will try Interior settings provided and share result soon.

 

 

[rlackore]

On 7/20/2018 at 10:53 AM, HumbleChief said:

Robert did you add lights? Or just use the recessed cans? I can never get them to look OK by themselves.

 

I used the lights already in the OP's plan - nothing extra. I agree that lighting is half the battle (material definitions being the other half), and supplemental lighting is often needed to achieve acceptable results.