Steve_Matlaga Posted October 14 Share Posted October 14 Hi, X17 user. I'm part of a small team that services accounts for designers/dealers across the USA. I've spend years working with Chief and as I've come along the way, I've embraced custom tool sets as my go to. WELL, in 2026, to find out that the CHIEF DEV team implements a lame limit on custom Icons is INSANE bordering time to rethink Chief. Buttons are the biggest time saver in Chief for me!!!! To think I'm limited to some arbitrary number (not very high either) of custom 'Place Library Object' buttons really ticks me off. PLEASE tell me, this clever Dev team has lifted such a silly limit hard coded in the x18 version? We don't want to switch to x18 until bug reports are done and more positive feed back is seen. If THIS SINGLE limit has been addressed, we'll update today! AND YES,, I have tried to copy a tool set , delete most all of the tool bars, in hopes it would free space for another set of Place Library item icons. NOPE. No go. CHIEF!!!! WHAT ARE YOU DOING? No inherent way to copy tool bars from one set to another. Now I find out that an advance high end super cad package has a limit on something stupid like an icon that simply references a file item in my library? Don't you think this deserves major attention as it's one of the top features being able to customize the GUI to our needs? Tell me I'm missing the obvious so I can delete this post and share the solution with others! I'm just beside myself upset right now. It's like a major punch in the gut when I finally felt somewhat of a confidence level with Chief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joshuanyambisa Posted October 14 Share Posted October 14 I agree that customization is essential for an efficient workflow. Hopefully, Chief Architect will address this limitation in a future update. Regards! Josh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_Matlaga Posted October 14 Author Share Posted October 14 9 minutes ago, joshuanyambisa said: I agree that customization is essential for an efficient workflow. Hopefully, Chief Architect will address this limitation in a future update. Regards! Josh I doubt it. They are so focused on other improvements. They are all about forcing Cloud based storage and organizing. We still have errors with random forced end panels being added to tall cabinets when they aren't there! Basic errors never to be addressed. We saw zero real improvements to cabinet wizards since when??? Style Pallet tool still can't define interior accessories vs. face frame vs shelf config etc.. All grouped as 'front configuration???? At least we got the ability to add cabinet sides as a separate call out! I get tired of 'work arounds' vs. just fix it! Welcome 2020 Design. Exactly, how they do things. Improve something obvious to sell more subscriptions, ignore past issues and hope they go away. Force the cloud, while deleting almost all end user's abilities to customize catalog/ per cabinet tweaks! We pay more for less and less IMHO. Sorry devs, you got me on a very bad day. I bragged on you to so many, and help sell so many subscriptions to my clients too ! I feel very let down that the feature I loved the most has such trivial limitations. If I have maybe 150 custom place library icons, I'd be exaggerating! Should be ZERO limits. Makes ZERO sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joshuanyambisa Posted October 14 Share Posted October 14 I can understand your frustration, especially after years of using the software. It’s tough when something you rely on daily doesn’t work the way you need it to. Sorry about that, Steve. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_Matlaga Posted October 14 Author Share Posted October 14 1 minute ago, joshuanyambisa said: I can understand your frustration, especially after years of using the software. It’s tough when something you rely on daily doesn’t work the way you need it to. Sorry about that, Steve. Hey, thanks. Based on seeing other peeps having SO many custom icon items, maybe it's just me, or maybe they get some sort of special treatment and this is unlocked for them as a sales point? LOL. Rabbit has like hundreds of custom icons!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joshuanyambisa Posted October 14 Share Posted October 14 You’re welcome, Steve! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renerabbitt Posted October 15 Share Posted October 15 The cap is 400. Quite a lot. Possible that you may be overlooking some old custom objects buried in an unused toolbar config? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_Matlaga Posted October 15 Author Share Posted October 15 2 hours ago, Renerabbitt said: The cap is 400. Quite a lot. Possible that you may be overlooking some old custom objects buried in an unused toolbar config? It's very unlikely I have 400 custom library objects. However, if you start really utilize custom tool bars , 400 is not near as many as it sounds. You could have around, what? 40-50 per bar line across a 2k screen That's only 10 rows of full custom bars max, across ALL your potential custom TOOL SETS. IT's not 400 per set. It's a cap across the entire software structure. This needs to be addressed by Dev team IMHO. I'm really stuck at this point though. Now that I am slammed, I needed far more ease of access custom library buttons. I really dislike tags/folders and menu diving. Mainly, it's a screen limitation and my eyes aren't what they were. The custom assignable icon system to library objects really is a god save. The LIbrary Browser is very old school and time consuming. Icon tool bar groups create a reflex response to exactly what is where. You'll memorize the aprox location of 400 items in no time if you are doing this daily. Menu diving, time consuming! Even with tags, you are turning tags off and on over and over to make find something easier. That's just not efficient. Just that one row of commonly used 'tags' as I call them, with Rich Text or even plain text icons saves me countless hours over the course of a week/month! At this point, my system is more or less LOCKED and I'm stuck with what i have. I deleted bars, and still won't let me add anything. Boooo. Oh, also to note. That 400 cap? It's WAY too low if you consider that is TOTAL CAP. Meaning, if you have just a few tool bar sets, YOU ARE DONE and at the limit. 400 PER set? YES. 400 TOTAL system wide? Please explain how that is a good thing? I work with four cabinet lines, and each has it's own set of object icons. If I want 10 or 100 lines, that seems like an obvious ask for something like a high end design cadd program. (even if generic, one for inset, one for full overlay framed, one for full overlay frameless) GUI really should be the top priority of the user experience. You of all people know how valuable that single aspect of chief is! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarrieS Posted October 15 Share Posted October 15 Perhaps when you are "deleting" the tools you're not actually deleting them but just hiding them in some way? It is pretty rare for users to reach the cap even before we increased it's cap in X15 to 398. For example if you have the Customize Toolbars dialog closed and you pull off the toolbar and X to close it out, it is not deleting the toolbar only turning it off. You have to have the Customize Toolbars dialog open to delete a tool from a toolbar. If you are reaching the limit and need more it is best to contact our Support team or write in to Suggestions@chiefarchitect.com so we can track the feature request. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renerabbitt Posted October 15 Share Posted October 15 1 hour ago, Steve_Matlaga said: This needs to be addressed by Dev team IMHO 1 hour ago, CarrieS said: 398 I was told that we are never going to get more than this amount as it hits a new set of criteria in the coding that is challenging to circumvent 1 hour ago, Steve_Matlaga said: (even if generic, one for inset, one for full overlay framed, one for full overlay frameless) I would change your approach. Instead of storing an object for every object type, create style pallets that can be combined to build those cabinets, and build your labels to match the object nomenclature based on the face configuration as well as the supplier field. Its very inefficient to store cabinets as opposed to face configurations that can build cabinets on the fly in a few clicks or swipes. 1 hour ago, Steve_Matlaga said: I deleted bars, and still won't let me add anything You must have more objects in some other toolbar configs that have populated library objects. This is why i prefer to code my toolbars outside of the program. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_Matlaga Posted October 16 Author Share Posted October 16 19 hours ago, Renerabbitt said: I was told that we are never going to get more than this amount as it hits a new set of criteria in the coding that is challenging to circumvent I would change your approach. Instead of storing an object for every object type, create style pallets that can be combined to build those cabinets, and build your labels to match the object nomenclature based on the face configuration as well as the supplier field. Its very inefficient to store cabinets as opposed to face configurations that can build cabinets on the fly in a few clicks or swipes. You must have more objects in some other toolbar configs that have populated library objects. This is why i prefer to code my toolbars outside of the program. Not that I can find. And, yes, working on Stream Deck icon set perhaps, and figuring a simple way to replace Chief's Icon system limits using the unlimited resources of stream deck. I need to explore 'best methods' first, but the answer has been sitting on my desk the whole time. LOL. Simpler alternative will just be a custom API that has unlimited icons and put that on a separate screen. I've actually been doing a few things for several versions. I store a cabinet set of boxes into a single library set. Drop them on the project, and set them as default. However, as I've been experiencing much larger projects with up to 30 rooms, each project need two or three cabinet lines and overlays. Much easier to switch my tool bar set that references style pallet cabinet configs. Hence, the custom library count goes up fast. I realize everyone looks at a GUI differently. THat is the beauty of Chief. We get to config our GUI exactly as we want. We can mimic our thinking/logic and set up tools/library objects any way we wish. Putting a cap on that really doesn't make sense on a global scale. Putting a cap on it PER tool bar set, makes lots of since. Yes, I and my associate will call Chief next week to discuss. In the meanwhile, I feel that looking for a solution outside of chief will be more productive as I can take immediate action on creating that/those tools. I will freely share such to assure others can enjoy the results. I can see it being a game changer to create endless toolsets where the induvial groupings and be shared easily between those custom sets. Also, will free up the main screen for larger drawing area, and only key tools being on hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_Matlaga Posted October 16 Author Share Posted October 16 (edited) 21 hours ago, CarrieS said: Perhaps when you are "deleting" the tools you're not actually deleting them but just hiding them in some way? It is pretty rare for users to reach the cap even before we increased it's cap in X15 to 398. For example if you have the Customize Toolbars dialog closed and you pull off the toolbar and X to close it out, it is not deleting the toolbar only turning it off. You have to have the Customize Toolbars dialog open to delete a tool from a toolbar. If you are reaching the limit and need more it is best to contact our Support team or write in to Suggestions@chiefarchitect.com so we can track the feature request. I deleted them in the actual tool set tools. To help others, please understand how the limit works. 398 icon custom library objects is the TOTAL max across ALL tool sets. In my case, I created all tool sets in the Masterset. No matter what, once I hit the limit, there's no way around that. I could have 50 Toolbar configurations, but it's all limited by the same program wide max! Let's say you are in a toolbar set called 'Tags Only' If you make a new custom placement object tool bar, and populate that with 30 icons of library objects, that is part of your total 398. Even though, that toolbar is only in that config set, it still counts against the global total. This means, you are pretty limited in the number of actual 'custom' sets of tools you can build across all custom configurations. I'm hoping to build something simple, like a screen of icons separate from Chief, that simply fill out the item name in library browser, and click so it's ready to drop on the plan. That replaces all limites. We'll see if that is even possible. Worse case, I rethink what is really important to have on hand. The most time consuming thing to be has been adding text markups to my drawings. Hence, why I'm talking about this to start with. Think about how much time is saved by a click of a mouse, vs editing your text each time!!! Think how much time is saved by those text items being RIGHT THere vs digging into folders and/or tags. Using tags require many mouse clicks to get to the actual sub menu of tagged items. EXAMPLE: Vs ONE click when they are always RIGHT on top in a tool bar. HINT: If you have UNUSED place holders for future library objects in various tool configs, those are counting against that 398 even though they aren't linked yet. As I'm sure I'm not the first to hit the frustrating limits... I'm going to share what I can while I'm digging into this subject. GO THROUGH ALL YOU TOOBAR CONFIGS and remove/delete ALL unused Library Object icons! A counter would be helpful so we know how many we have left! The above really was the main issue for me. I think I'm back to around 100 or more free spaces now. Appreciate the feedback as it led me to dig more. COME ON CHIEF!!! Let's get creative! Edited October 16 by Steve_Matlaga Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MollyNDG Posted October 16 Share Posted October 16 20 hours ago, Renerabbitt said: I would change your approach. Instead of storing an object for every object type, create style pallets that can be combined to build those cabinets, and build your labels to match the object nomenclature based on the face configuration as well as the supplier field. Its very inefficient to store cabinets as opposed to face configurations that can build cabinets on the fly in a few clicks or swipes. This - setting up your custom "tools" using style palettes is a game changer. I inherited a library of custom cabinets when I started my current position several years ago and thanks to watching several Rabbitt videos learned the efficiency of combing several cabinets into one style palette to easily go between frameless full overlay to inset to modern channel cabinets along with many, many other specifics made all the difference. It makes it a lot easier on the eyes to, to have fewer icons to look at when looking for custom tools on the toolbar. It definitely takes a bit of time to set up, but the time saved in the long run is worth it IMO. It also makes any future alterations to the configurations easier as everything is stored in one style palette instead of across objects. As someone who does a ton of custom cabinetry, this has been the way to go. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_Matlaga Posted October 16 Author Share Posted October 16 SOLVED Well, I ended that issue fast! In fact, mind blown. The solution outside of Chief is amazing, unlimited, and cheap/free. My complaining turned into turn my Chief experience into a true modern GUI that has complete freedom to do exactly what I want. It's not hidden behind a pay wall or such. For now, I'm going to just tell you, you can use hot keys, and direct any third party software to produce key strokes that will direct chief to place a custom library object. I think half a day of work, I can recreate all the existing chief tool bars, my own tool bars, and shut off all chief tool bars to gain a full screen for design work. I'm getting far more than I hoped all over finding a silly limit by the devs. This might not make sense yet, but a preview is the transparent menu right on my chief screen ready to go to work! Hover over it, to simply click and place whatever you like. In my case, it's all able labeling my floor plans quickly. However, these tool bars can literally be anything and most everything you already use in Chief, including the same icons. It's going to take work, but in the end, I have a tool that does anything I need the way I want it to work. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renerabbitt Posted October 16 Share Posted October 16 4 hours ago, Steve_Matlaga said: set called 'Tags Only' Just curious, what is your tags toolbar all about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_Matlaga Posted October 16 Author Share Posted October 16 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Renerabbitt said: Just curious, what is your tags toolbar all about? They are simply labels/call outs I use for my floor plans. If I have a base 36, with roll outs, I want a clean text note 'Roll outs'. I don't use cabinet labels, just call out numbers. So, I need to clearly label appliances, points of interest, and other such floor plan/elevation notes. Say, I'm making counter top drawings. I drop the text where I need it. Takes seconds.; I use a lot of rich text, or standard text saved as a library object to save me countless time. Commonly used Keys, Notes etc. In fact, I pretty much try to make all commonly used actions a click ! Can't imagine digging through Chief's browser folders or using this 'tag' system they came up with (or maybe you came up with, lol) Edited October 16 by Steve_Matlaga Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renerabbitt Posted October 16 Share Posted October 16 7 minutes ago, Steve_Matlaga said: Commonly used Keys, Notes etc 261016.mp4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_Matlaga Posted October 16 Author Share Posted October 16 (edited) 3 hours ago, Renerabbitt said: 261016.mp4 9.4 MB · 0 downloads HI, THIS? I love the concept, and what a great way to set up your cabinet attributes/custom fields. I'll give it some thought. Appreciate you taking the time to post the video and explaining a great option though. Gears are turning for sure... Comes down to , create custom fields, create macros, make a new tool or two to pull from the new fields as my annotation. Opps, and also need to mention, what you set up requires far more advance skills to create conditional scripts. That's not something average users can do. (me being an average user). I do have a friend though who can take care of the conditional stuff and macro programming. I'd love to learn, but I can't stop to do that any time soon. Vs. what has worked thus far.... Vs. today's discovery. Cut and paste the existing library text objects into the new icon/button system I'm using. (about 10 seconds or less per new button). Obviously, as a long term solution, what you have been doing is better. The bigger picture though, I'm now in a situation I have an advance tool bar system with virtually no limitations on any features I want. I'm sure a combination of both is in order Thank you so much for the suggestions. Edited October 17 by Steve_Matlaga Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smn842 Posted October 17 Share Posted October 17 15 hours ago, Steve_Matlaga said: I'm getting far more than I hoped all over finding a silly limit by the devs. Having worked for decades in software development and despite having my own grumbles about CA's development and project management approach over the years, I would like to comment as very few limits are silly or only decided by developers: Many limits in software come from historical decisions to avoid excessive RAM/storage use and what at the time seemed a logical limit. Years on and some limits can be an issue and in some cases its simply extending a field during a migration release with very low risk of bugs. However in other cases it can be that the limit reflects internal data types or structures that means to extend would require significant changes throughout a lot of code with the risks of bugs being introduced. In that event the product management team with input from the development team have to weigh up the risks, time required and scope of impact. In this case it appears you've hit a limit that few people will encounter so the risk and time required may simply be not worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_Matlaga Posted October 17 Author Share Posted October 17 4 hours ago, Smn842 said: Having worked for decades in software development and despite having my own grumbles about CA's development and project management approach over the years, I would like to comment as very few limits are silly or only decided by developers: Many limits in software come from historical decisions to avoid excessive RAM/storage use and what at the time seemed a logical limit. Years on and some limits can be an issue and in some cases its simply extending a field during a migration release with very low risk of bugs. However in other cases it can be that the limit reflects internal data types or structures that means to extend would require significant changes throughout a lot of code with the risks of bugs being introduced. In that event the product management team with input from the development team have to weigh up the risks, time required and scope of impact. In this case it appears you've hit a limit that few people will encounter so the risk and time required may simply be not worth it. Completely can understand that there are cases where things are limited for a solid reason. Many things have brought Chief to a turtle's pace that you wouldn't expect. Usually, there's ways to optimise a situation to work around those events. I honestly have very few gripes about Chief overall or I would have moved on long ago. I promote it as the #1 tool for kitchen designers who value detail and customization. That all said, to the end user, me in this case, having a limit on custom library icons that pretty much have a very trivial task, is frustrating. They're pretty much hyperlinks triggered by an icon. As they are static objects and are not running any code of significance, I couldn't come up with any reason there would be a limit on modern versions. As mentioned, and you mention as well, perhaps the limit relates to older core programming that if changed could open a massive can of works. I'm extremely satisfied with the simple work around of a third party app to handle those re-direct/linked button tasks. I'll thank Chief Devs for allowing most everything to have a hot key! That feature allows creative interfacing to the software and pretty much made my original point a non issue. Rabbit pointing out another alternative is interesting as well, except one would think connecting additional data sets to a library object might be far for taxing on Chief, vs. just dropping a bit of text as needed. 'KISS'. Push a button, it drops the text label onto the plan, I move on. No programming, no redo's of my catalogs. No complex error chasing via conditional macros. Appreciate you chiming in along with others. I do hope this conversation is helpful to others in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_Matlaga Posted October 19 Author Share Posted October 19 Sample : Change Item to a Different Room for Schedule Organizing. All Button menus will be on a separate screen just under the main screen Again, for anyone interested, I'm using Virtual Scream Deck, but you can use this on Ipad, Android, Mac, Windows... Or get a Stream Deck! Many other apps are out there to do this, and I still believe this is by far the most useful way to work in Chief. It runs completely separate from Chief and has nearly zero affect on the speed your system runs with infinite buttons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renerabbitt Posted October 19 Share Posted October 19 5 hours ago, Steve_Matlaga said: Virtual Scream Deck FYI i think radial menus are far more efficient than buttons as when you swipe past the bounds of the slice it triggers the button, and the radial menu appears wherever your mouse is. Its far easier to have muscle memory of the swipe be remembered vs the location of a button and the precision it requires to hit the button. Regarding your setup. for different cabinet lines it can just be a conditional statement switch. For example a condition where if supplier is crystal cabinets then print option 3, where acessories is option 1; option 2; option 3 Then you make a style palette tool that only applies "supplier" so that you can quickly change your supplier, and so on and so forth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
para-CAD Posted October 19 Share Posted October 19 (edited) Steve I labeled every chief hotkey starting at the number 5000 and going up into the 6000 range, and then I started analyzing my workflow to see where I wanted things I too use stream deck. specifically the + XL I have the pie option using a Logitech mouse, but I don’t find it as easy as configuring my stream deck to put the buttons I use most close together in the lower left area for precedence. My system has evolved to where hot keys that manipulate something are on my primary screen, and then I use folders with auto snapback to go into doors, windows, objects, and other things. The nice thing is Stream Deck works with any application, so as soon as I open up sketch up, all my tool buttons reflect sketch up hot keys. I like that you’ve shared your process because that inspires me to constantly improve Edited October 20 by para-CAD 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renerabbitt Posted October 19 Share Posted October 19 34 minutes ago, para-CAD said: but I don’t find it as easy as configuring my stream deck have you considered using an agentic ai like codex to code your buttons instead of doing it yourself? I personally find a stream deck to be a far cry from being ergonomic and I plan on doing this work well into my 80's which is the main reason I havent jumped on board with it. Food for thought I guess. Radial menus keep your hands where they are in their optimal positions. Keep your wrists healthy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_Matlaga Posted Monday at 03:35 PM Author Share Posted Monday at 03:35 PM On 10/19/2026 at 3:15 PM, para-CAD said: Steve I labeled every chief hotkey starting at the number 5000 and going up into the 6000 range, and then I started analyzing my workflow to see where I wanted things I too use stream deck. specifically the + XL I have the pie option using a Logitech mouse, but I don’t find it as easy as configuring my stream deck to put the buttons I use most close together in the lower left area for precedence. My system has evolved to where hot keys that manipulate something are on my primary screen, and then I use folders with auto snapback to go into doors, windows, objects, and other things. The nice thing is Stream Deck works with any application, so as soon as I open up sketch up, all my tool buttons reflect sketch up hot keys. I like that you’ve shared your process because that inspires me to constantly improve Hey, Cool! I'm having a great time with Stream deck, 32 button version is nice, but I ended up going all virtual buttons. Very little digging through radial menu, sub menus, or otherwise. The virtual button set can be up to 64 at a glance per set! I have a 32" monitor laying at a 15-20 degree angle from the main chief screen. It's AMAZING and changes everything. I have a major vision issue that gets treated once a year. So, finding the flexibility of a third party button tool gives me hope to keep doing what I love. I can see that damn buttons and what they are. Even better, I don't need to waste time anymore making custom icons for user objects. I can quickly name the buttons and I'm done. Custom icons are know just screen capture, paste into icon field, done. I can go on and on. Yes, using this on all the common apps also means I've made a plethora of 'quick' text buttons for tasks I normally have to type over and over. It's like a visual clip board in that way. On 10/19/2026 at 3:52 PM, Renerabbitt said: have you considered using an agentic ai like codex to code your buttons instead of doing it yourself? I personally find a stream deck to be a far cry from being ergonomic and I plan on doing this work well into my 80's which is the main reason I havent jumped on board with it. Food for thought I guess. Radial menus keep your hands where they are in their optimal positions. Keep your wrists healthy! Hi, I/we have been messing with a few ideas. My eyes are a bigger issue than wrist! Also, I'm sure if I recorded the actual movement using a radial menu vs. the screen just below with all my buttons, it's about the same. I'd have to get an actual 3d radial mouse to make it make any sense to use a radial menu. Eye targeting is a nature way our minds sync our mouse actions. You look at the word you want, the arrow almost goes automatic to what we are looking at. (in fact, that tech is on my radar soon as well). That will be the ultimate goal of buttons. Look down, click, look back up, click. The tech is here and pretty cheap. That means almost zero wrist wear, LOL. I always admire and respect your ideas! I just happen to like mine better on this point. There are things Chief greatly lags considering the focus of interior design/cabinetry. Sadly, addressing those shortcomings require some 'out of the box' solutions. Macros are limited to text fields and library objects are limited to folder structures. Chief needs common solutions for common modifications and there appropriate SKU's. They have only part of the solution with custom object fields. However, they lack a solution on how to quickly populate that information. Even the new Styles Pallet tools failed to address custom mods, and was limited to a very general 'copy face' with zero improvements as to 'copy what part of the face'. Soon as I figure out some solid alternatives, I'm going to put some videos together to share so others can add to the conversations and hopefully enjoy a few different community options from other's view points. Not about one way being 'better' as this is opinion. (and in my case, a legit visual limitation that needs to be solved). Necessity the mother of invention. LOL. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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