Snapping in Elevation view

[TommyJ]

I'm attempting to dimension the height of a exposed ceiling beam in a elevation view. (Roof beam is perpendicular to the view.) I can't for the life of me get anything to snap to it. Tried the elevation height marker, all the dimensions, drawing a line, etc. Surely there is a way to do this, right? In the previous CAD programs I have used, this is a 5 second task. These are the types of things that waste so much time....

 

Sorry for the rant. It feels like I design for 10% of the time, and google how to do things 90% of the time.

[TommyJ]

I watched a view videos this morning, and the instructor did a similar thing. She used point to point, and zoomed it to get it "close". Surely that's not the way? That gives some unknown amount of error, and the bigger issue is that if you change the beam height, the dimension doesn't change with it later.

[Alaskan_Son]

To get otherwise inaccessible snaps, I use CAD Detail From View.  Copy a line from that newly created CAD Detail and then Paste Hold Position back into your Elevation View.

[TommyJ]

14 minutes ago, Alaskan_Son said:

To get otherwise inaccessible snaps, I use CAD Detail From View.  Copy a line from that newly created CAD Detail and then Paste Hold Position back into your Elevation View.

I tried that, but I could not snap the line to the top of the beam. I can get it "close" but not exact.

[Alaskan_Son]

3 minutes ago, TommyJ said:

I tried that, but I could not snap the line to the top of the beam. I can get it "close" but not exact.

 

You're probably doing something wrong then.  If you can SEE the top of your beam and if that line is drawn in the CAD Detail From View, you should surely be able to snap to the line in your CAD Detail From View.  Either copy that line directly, or snap another CAD object to it and then Cut/Copy and PASTE HOLD POSITION (Edit>Paste>Paste Hold Position or Control+Alt+V) your snap reference line back into your elevation view. 

[TommyJ]

6 hours ago, Alaskan_Son said:

 

You're probably doing something wrong then.  If you can SEE the top of your beam and if that line is drawn in the CAD Detail From View, you should surely be able to snap to the line in your CAD Detail From View.  Either copy that line directly, or snap another CAD object to it and then Cut/Copy and PASTE HOLD POSITION (Edit>Paste>Paste Hold Position or Control+Alt+V) your snap reference line back into your elevation view. 

 

 I get what you're saying to copy and paste the top of the beam back into the elevation. But, if I make any changes, I have to redo the whole elevation. It's a quite a work around, but I guess that gets me limping for now. Thanks for the help.

[glennw]

This can be done without going the cad detail route.

You can dimension to cross section lines.

Unlock the Cross Section Lines layer and make it red and thick so that you can see them.

Use the Backclipped Cross Section camera.

The trick is to locate the camera so that it is within the beam (you can do this by temporarily making the beam really thick so that the camera is inside the beam, or, locating the camera inside the beam) - this can be a temporary location so as just to get the dimension to snap to the  beam - you can then move the camera and the dimensions will stay.

If you use the End To End dimension, it will place point markers to locate the dimension points.

So, if you want to move the beam, make sure you select the marker and the beam and the dimension will move and update as you move the beam.

Not perfect, but does work and is a lot quicker to do than it sounds.

This pic shows a roof beam parallel to the camera and another perpendicular to the camera.

The one parallel to the camera doesn't need any attention because the camera is within the beam. 

[Alaskan_Son]

17 hours ago, glennw said:

This can be done without going the cad detail route.

You can dimension to cross section lines.

Unlock the Cross Section Lines layer and make it red and thick so that you can see them.

Use the Backclipped Cross Section camera.

The trick is to locate the camera so that it is within the beam (you can do this by temporarily making the beam really thick so that the camera is inside the beam, or, locating the camera inside the beam) - this can be a temporary location so as just to get the dimension to snap to the  beam - you can then move the camera and the dimensions will stay.

If you use the End To End dimension, it will place point markers to locate the dimension points.

So, if you want to move the beam, make sure you select the marker and the beam and the dimension will move and update as you move the beam.

Not perfect, but does work and is a lot quicker to do than it sounds.

This pic shows a roof beam parallel to the camera and another perpendicular to the camera.

The one parallel to the camera doesn't need any attention because the camera is within the beam. 

 

I don't see how this is any faster than simply creating a quick CAD Detail From View.  If you have no snaps to start with it means you weren't cutting the object with your camera meaning you would be required to reposition a camera at least twice and you would still be dimensioning to a dumb CAD object (i.e. there would be no functional difference from stealing snaps from the CAD Detail). For the camera cutting the beam you would already have snaps and we wouldn't be having the conversation in the first place. 

[DRAWZILLA]

3 minutes ago, Alaskan_Son said:

 

I don't see how this is any faster than simply creating a quick CAD Detail From View.  If you have no snaps to start with it means you weren't cutting the object with your camera meaning you would be required to reposition a camera at least twice and you would still be dimensioning to a dumb CAD object (i.e. there would be no functional difference from stealing snaps from the CAD Detail). For the camera cutting the beam you would already have snaps and we wouldn't be having the conversation in the first place. 

Some of us just don't want to use cad from view b/c it's not updatable  I never use any cad within the plan. For me only details are cad.

[Alaskan_Son]

11 minutes ago, DRAWZILLA said:

Some of us just don't want to use cad from view b/c it's not updatable  I never use any cad within the plan. For me only details are cad.

 

I wasn't suggesting using the CAD Detail itslef.  Only stealing a snap from the CAD Detail in the form of a line or point.  If you dimension to a Cross Section Line you're doing the exact same thing.  Cross Section Lines are nothing more than a temporary CAD objects and don't remain tied to the model either.  Glenn knows this which is why is he said...

 

17 hours ago, glennw said:

So, if you want to move the beam, make sure you select the marker and the beam and the dimension will move and update as you move the beam.

 

Both methods require dimensioning to CAD.  The question is this.... Is it faster to created a CAD Detail From View and then copy/paste from there or is it faster to move your camera twice. 

 

P.S.  There are also TONS of situations where cross section lines aren't even going to be an option and where a CAD Detail From View is the only viable method for accurate snap points.

[TriDiWorx]

I know it is an old topic, but I hope developers are at least reading some of the posts in this forum.

I have used Chief for about half a year now. Not full time, but still.

This issue with snap points is the MOST annoying of them all. It is stupid that these workarounds have to be used with this basic task. It is modelling and drafting software and snapping is a basic function. And with so many versions of Chief it still is not included properly it is even worse in my opinion. It is not free software you know. There are issues in Chief, but snapping and tracing is the one that I really, really hate. The worst that I have ever used in any drafting or modelling software.

Snapping is not bad only in elevations but in plans also. Not all layers snap on plans for example.

 

In elevations I started to use a different method (if I do not need many elevation markers). I use point tools and point marker. Then use it as elevation marker and place a text macro for height in it. For example I know heights of windows floor to top and I manually type in the height I need the marker to be. Sometimes I create a section and dimension the height to type in to elevation marker. Then I copy all markers and paste in place to another elevation. Horizontally move them in place and leave the height alone. Those that I need to change I change and those which are in a proper place I leave. It is not fast, mostly not updatable either, but I personally like it more.

[Michael_Gia]

3 hours ago, TriDiWorx said:

I know it is an old topic, but I hope developers are at least reading some of the posts in this forum.

They don’t apparently.  They want you to submit a request separately. Then they won’t look at it either…lol. 
 

All of the ranting in this post will fall on deaf ears. 
Chief really struggles with this sort of “accurate” drawing features that are non trivial in all other software of this type.  
However, try drawing a roof ridge on a shingle roof in Revit and you’ll pull your hair out. 
I’m always debating which is more important, the pretty cabinets and trimming in Chief of the no-nonsense precise and efficient structural drawing in Revit. Especially when the purchase price of Revit Lt is the same price as SSA in Chief without the upfront purchase. 
 

I already spent the money so I’ll stick to Chief, is always what I settle on but it’s frustrating since Chief is so close to what I need but just far enough to make it painful on a daily basis. 
 

I wish I could just draw without the fuss. 

[Michael_Gia]

Ooh, I was downvoted. Gee, I wonder who that could be?…

[TriDiWorx]

19 hours ago, Michael_Gia said:

All of the ranting in this post will fall on deaf ears. 

 

Yes ranting in forums mostly does not accomplish anything :). But still maybe someone, somewhere, something :).

 

I personally do not like Autodesk products much. And they are expensive. Look at how much different stuff every program installs separately on your computer  (libraries and so on). Maybe AutoCAD is the one that's ok, but I do not like Revit. And LT is too stripped down. Chief has more stuff in it with the same yearly price of SSA. And I do not like family system in Revit. Chiefs editable objects is better for residential design. Revit is better with more complex designs and it needs much more time to get efficiently started. Revit is very powerful, but you have to invest a lot of time in it and then consider does your job really need you to invest this time in Revit or better to invest it in something else.

I like Chief. And all software have problems it is inevitable. If Chief would get basic things (like snapping) right then I could live with everything else. Maybe a bit less crashing also.

 

For example this elevation snapping. Maybe some automated system which does this cad detail overlay automatically? When you create an elevation Chief creates in the background cad from view places those lines over your elevation on a specific separate layer and when you update your view it will update cad overlay also. And maybe a tick mark in settings to enable/disable this behaviour. In my mind kind of an easy workaround fix. The functionality is basically already there.

And if I am already throwing around my ideas in an old forum that no-one will read then ifc export/import would be another very important thing to include. 3D is now and in the future and ifc is a must.