STORY POLE DIMS

[Kbird1]

2 hours ago, DzinEye said:

That setting changes the terrain height in relation to the subfloor, (which he had apparently done), but it doesn't change how the story pole dimension shows grade.   It seems to me that it should... but for some reason it doesn't work that way.  This is what was confounding the OP.

 

Like most things in Chief , by default the Story Pole references the Top of the Subfloor ( or slab), which is always 0"   (absolute in some DBX's elevation reference dropdown)  , which I guess makes sense , at least when the Plan is 1st opened as how would Chief reference the Terrain when one has not been built yet?....and for some Users may never be built, eg Kitchen and Bath designers doing a bathroom only etc.

 

there is more Info in this Post , in a thread about Sea Level References and a couple of Test Plans with Notes if you have more interest.

 

https://chieftalk.chiefarchitect.com/topic/17786-story-pole-relocating-the-grade-elevation/?page=2&tab=comments#comment-149858

 

Mick.

 

 

[winterdd]

5 hours ago, DzinEye said:

That setting changes the terrain height in relation to the subfloor, (which he had apparently done), but it doesn't change how the story pole dimension shows grade.   It seems to me that it should... but for some reason it doesn't work that way.  This is what was confounding the OP.

my thoughts EXACTLY!

[DzinEye]

4 hours ago, Alaskan_Son said:

I think it was set up to work that way to give us options.  A couple quick examples:

-  Say you imported all your elevation data for a house in the mountains using sea level datum.  You don’t want to have to change all the elevation data just to get your Story Pole working correctly.  
 

-  Say your building department decides that they want to see heights referenced from flood plane but you originally drew it up as heights from grade.  

I'm all for options, and you give good examples, which make perfect sense if one has set the plan to reference heights from grade, but if we've already selected to reference the 1st floor subfloor as our zero, then it seems the program could discern that and then correctly show grade for what we've set it at below floor level?  Anyway, it's a minor thing, but I just can't seem to be able to manually move the story pole grade marker where I want it to go, which varies  on a sloped property.  Any tricks for that?  I've tried placing points, when I drag to the point the dimension just disappears.

[rgardner]

8 minutes ago, DzinEye said:

I'm all for options, and you give good examples, which make perfect sense if one has set the plan to reference heights from grade, but if we've already selected to reference the 1st floor subfloor as our zero, then it seems the program could discern that and then correctly show grade for what we've set it at below floor level?  Anyway, it's a minor thing, but I just can't seem to be able to manually move the story pole grade marker where I want it to go, which varies  on a sloped property.  Any tricks for that?  I've tried placing points, when I drag to the point the dimension just disappears.

I believe this is what I did when I was struggling with this.  I am traveling right now so don't have chief available at the moment.  But you can turn off getting the grade height and set another height off of a point and change the label of it to grade.  This assuming that you are using the SF as your 0 point.

[Kbird1]

2 hours ago, DzinEye said:

Anyway, it's a minor thing, but I just can't seem to be able to manually move the story pole grade marker where I want it to go, which varies  on a sloped property.  Any tricks for that?  I've tried placing points, when I drag to the point the dimension just disappears.

 

The Points (diamonds) only seem to locate Items on Chief's List of "available Items" on the Locate Elevations or the Located Objects Tabs for the Used Dimension default of the Story Pole but you can easily figure out the "Point"  (datum) Height if needed with a few CAD lines and set the Height in the Locate Elevations Tab, then all Dims on the Storey Pole will refer to the Datum Height. Below I used the edge of the Property but it could be anywhere, though I'd have thought that Info, was available without the CAD Lines assuming working from a Topo Survey which usually shows the Datum Height along with the other Elevation Data, at least locally there is usually a metal pin in the Curb that is used for that.

 

Mick.

 

[Alaskan_Son]

5 hours ago, DzinEye said:

Anyway, it's a minor thing, but I just can't seem to be able to manually move the story pole grade marker where I want it to go, which varies  on a sloped property.  Any tricks for that? 

Yes.  Don’t use the Auto Story Pole tool.    Just use a normal dimension tool, click on the Extensions/Markers tab, and select Draw Elevation Marker.  You can then drag out Elevation Markers wherever you want including at custom locations and label them as desired.  

[DzinEye]

9 hours ago, Alaskan_Son said:

Yes.  Don’t use the Auto Story Pole tool.    Just use a normal dimension tool, click on the Extensions/Markers tab, and select Draw Elevation Marker.  You can then drag out Elevation Markers wherever you want including at custom locations and label them as desired.

Thank you.  I swear, I use that extensions/markers tab to mark center lines all the time, I never even noticed there was an 'elevation marker' selection.  My solution until now has always been to paste in my own home-made elevation marker.  I figured there had to be a better way.

[DzinEye]

13 hours ago, Kbird1 said:

The Points (diamonds) only seem to locate Items on Chief's List of "available Items" on the Locate Elevations or the Located Objects Tabs for the Used Dimension default of the Story Pole but you can easily figure out the "Point"  (datum) Height if needed with a few CAD lines and set the Height in the Locate Elevations Tab, then all Dims on the Storey Pole will refer to the Datum Height. Below I used the edge of the Property but it could be anywhere, though I'd have thought that Info, was available without the CAD Lines assuming working from a Topo Survey which usually shows the Datum Height along with the other Elevation Data, at least locally there is usually a metal pin in the Curb that is used for that.

Thanks Mick.  That IS a way to get it to work, but what bunch of monkeying around.  It seems that 'grade' in so far as Chief goes is simply a fixed point to reference, either a finished pad height or some other user defined height.  Would be nice if storypole could pick up the 'adjacent grade' from the terrain, but then it would have to make an assumption of where it's picking that grade, and it'll probably be wrong half the time or more.  The ability to pull out an elevation marker from a normal dimension is great, so frustrating to find I was blind to something right in front of my eyes when I was not looking for it.

[Kbird1]

45 minutes ago, DzinEye said:

Thanks Mick.  That IS a way to get it to work, but what bunch of monkeying around.  It seems that 'grade' in so far as Chief goes is simply a fixed point to reference, either a finished pad height or some other user defined height.  Would be nice if storypole could pick up the 'adjacent grade' from the terrain, but then it would have to make an assumption of where it's picking that grade, and it'll probably be wrong half the time or more.  The ability to pull out an elevation marker from a normal dimension is great, so frustrating to find I was blind to something right in front of my eyes when I was not looking for it.

 

It really isn't as hard as I may have made it sound ? then again I don't think it would normally be needed to be done, but I thought for some reason you needed too? Using a point on Chief's "Terrain" would not be that accurate as it interpolates ( educated guesses ) the Terrain between Elevation Lines etc so you'd never really now what you were using as an Elev. Point in that case.

 

Mick.

[DzinEye]

10 minutes ago, Kbird1 said:

It really isn't as hard as I may have made it sound ? then again I don't think it would normally be needed to be done, but I thought for some reason you needed too?

Didn't mean it to sound like I was trashing your idea!  It's a good creative work-around.  It's just a lot to do in comparison to my wishful hope of it being something automatic and it would have to be adjusted for each different elevation where I need to show a different adjacent grade.  I always appreciate your suggestions.

[Kbird1]

3 hours ago, DzinEye said:

Didn't mean it to sound like I was trashing your idea!  I

 

No problem , I didn't think that ,,,just that you thought it was more work than you should have to do .....and you maybe right 

I , like you, think there should be an Auto (w/Option) setting once a TP is added to a plan

[Alaskan_Son]

34 minutes ago, Kbird1 said:

I, like you, think there should be an Auto (Option) setting once a TP is added to a plan

What exactly would this Auto setting use if...

 

1.  Your lot is sloped

2.  You are referencing sea level

or some other elevation reference with your terrain elevation data.

 

Are you suggesting that it would just automatically match the Subfloor Height Above Terrain Setting?  If so, I suppose I would have no objection.  It would be handy for simple flat lot drawings for sure.  

 

[Alaskan_Son]

 

3 hours ago, DzinEye said:

Thank you.  I swear, I use that extensions/markers tab to mark center lines all the time, I never even noticed there was an 'elevation marker' selection.  My solution until now has always been to paste in my own home-made elevation marker.  I figured there had to be a better way.

You should be able to simply use the auto generated Story Pole dimension and drag off a new segment using the diamond handle too BTW.  There does however seem to be a bug preventing this behavior when the original Story Pole being edited was automatically created with only 2 markers that have no height disparity.  When that happens, that particular string will never behave properly.  It only allows segments to be added that are higher than the original.  Any attempt to add lower segments just pushes the whole string up by the distance you are attempting to go down.  In addition, the dialing box acts as if though it’s a standard dimension string and some of the options are missing (Marker options in particular).

[winterdd]

I, for one, did a cartwheel when i finally found out about story pole dims. When i first got chief a year ago, i thought those were manually drawn in from the examples i saw on the chief homepage lol.

[Kbird1]

1 hour ago, Alaskan_Son said:

Are you suggesting that it would just automatically match the Subfloor Height Above Terrain Setting?  If so, I suppose I would have no objection.  It would be handy for simple flat lot drawings for sure.  

 

Yes as an initial "Auto Setting" if Grade is the Reference Height , but it's also why I said (Option) so it could also set Sea Level or any height we may need as you mentioned ie we could accept the default of Height Subfloor is above Terrian or we could set any number we like.

 

M.

[DzinEye]

23 hours ago, Alaskan_Son said:

You should be able to simply use the auto generated Story Pole dimension and drag off a new segment using the diamond handle too BTW.  There does however seem to be a bug preventing this behavior when the original Story Pole being edited was automatically created with only 2 markers that have no height disparity.  When that happens, that particular string will never behave properly.  It only allows segments to be added that are higher than the original.  Any attempt to add lower segments just pushes the whole string up by the distance you are attempting to go down.  In addition, the dialing box acts as if though it’s a standard dimension string and some of the options are missing (Marker options in particular).

Yeah, I can always easily pull off a new segment anywhere on a story pole except for at the bottom.  Hmm... maybe I experienced this bug you mention.  I have always had some kind of annoying restriction with that bottom marker I want to set at something other than the specified 'grade' setting. Either I can't get it to stick to where I want it to go, or I can't get the marker to line up with the others, or it just keeps disappearing. At some point a while back I just gave up and started using my own elevation symbol to paste in place. It's been a while, I'll revisit.  Appreciate the input.