Convert an Imperial Template to Metric without loss of millimeter accuracy

[TheAlchemist]

I see plenty of answers that say you cannot accurately convert an existing imperial plan to metric without loss of accuracy....but I am trying to figure out if I can convert imperial plan templates and imperial layout templates (blank ones - which do not yet include a design) to metric without creating issues with the accuracy as the deisgn progresses.  

 

I have read that converting existing imperial plans (with walls and designs in them) into metric results in a loss of accuracy as CA rounds down to the nearest fraction of an inch which is less accurate than a millimeter.  I am working with European cabinetry and need millimeter accuracy.  I have access to some great imperial plan templates and layout templates that I could use (to save time from building my own from scratch) if converting them to metric before I start drawing will be accurate to the millimeter.  Otherwise, I need to build my own template from the out-of-the-box CA metric templates which will take time.

[DBCooper]

I don't think so.  A template is really just a plan and even though you have not drawn things like walls, windows, doors, and cabinets, you still have some already stored in the plan as defaults. 

 

The only thing I can think of doing would be to place the defaults you can into a plan, save them in the library, open a new plan in the units you want, place the library objects, and then use the set as default on them.  Might still do some rounding though.  

 

[TheAlchemist]

@DBCooper thank you.  To confirm, if millmeter accuracy is what I am needing, then the best plan is to start with a Metric template and customize it to make my own template? 

[JiAngelo]

I think you have this "loss of accuracy" reversed.  converting from inches to millimeters is accurate as follows

• 1" and 1/2" require 1 decimal place accuracy (25.4mm & 12.7mm specifically.)
• 1/4" requires 2 decimal accuracy, (6.35mm)
• 1/8" requires 3 decimal accuracy (3.175mm)
• 1/16" requires 4 decimal accuracy.  (1.5875mm)

Chief won't let you specify 1/32" accuracy.

 

This image has the red boxes drawn in inches.

 

Converting from millimeters to inches is where accuracy becomes a problem.

This image has the red boxes drawn to 0 decimal place millimeters.

. 

 

Notice the loss of accuracy compared to the first image.

• 25mm doesn't equal 1" -- 25.4mm does.
• 13mm doesn't equal 1/2" -- 12.7mm does.
• 7mm doesn't equal 1/4" -- 6.35mm does.
• 3mm doesn't equal 1/8" -- 3.175mm does.
• 2mm doesn't equal 1/16" -- 1.5875 does..

 

 

[TheAlchemist]

@JiAngelo I just wanted to say thank you for taking your time to reply.  These were helpful illustrations.  I've been reviewing this topic here and elsewhere and it just appears to me as though you cannot really accurately take an "empty" Imperial template and draw in it by setting the units to Metric because, as you illustrate, if I enter in 25mm, I believe that CA will draw it as 1" and this is not accurate. 

 

I love that you shared the decimal accuracy chart - I have never seen that or heard about that. Thank you!

[Joe_Carrick]

You can't change an Imperial Template to Metric.  That means that Chief will recognize input as "Inches" in an Imperial Template.  The only way to get Metric input is with a Metric Template.

 

However, You can specify the dimensional units for both Primary and/or Secondary to whatever units you would like.  You can:

• Set to either to display as Imperial ( 35'-6 1/8" )
• Set to either to display as Metric ( 10,824 mm" ) ---- rounding to nearest mm

The above are only examples of formatting possibilities  I don't normally use Metric but if I need Metric I set the Secondary to display mm with 0 decimal places.  You could use more decimal places but a fraction of a mm is to small for anything other than machining.

 

[Renerabbitt]

All of these answers missing one very crucial bit of info. If you have something set as 5" in your imperial plan defaults, it will be 5mm in your metric plan. Chief just sees these as numbers not dimensions so its a 1:1 translation.
I know this because i've been working for countless hours trying to recreate my templates in metric

[CAmichael240114]

41 minutes ago, Renerabbitt said:

All of these answers missing one very crucial bit of info. If you have something set as 5" in your imperial plan defaults, it will be 5mm in your metric plan. Chief just sees these as numbers not dimensions so its a 1:1 translation.
I know this because i've been working for countless hours trying to recreate my templates in metric

 

Not sure if this comment fits in with what you are saying of how Chief handles or converts units, this is what I find.

We are metric only so my template is metric.

For example;

I download a plan or symbol say from this site which is in imperial units.

Open the imperial plan, add items to my library.

Open my metric template, the imperial items inported into my library are now in equivelant metric units, a length of 12 in is now shown as 304.8 mm

[Renerabbitt]

2 minutes ago, CAmichael240114 said:

 

Not sure if this comment fits in with what you are saying of how Chief handles or converts units, this is what I find.

We are metric only so my template is metric.

For example;

I download a plan or symbol say from this site which is in imperial units.

Open the imperial plan, add items to my library.

Open my metric template, the imperial items inported into my library are now in equivelant metric units, a length of 12 in is now shown as 304.8 mm

Bo that is a separate function. Take a text box that is 4 inches with size 4 font and copy it from imperial to metric and it will resize as a 1:1 number to number context. It does not convert the dimensions

[JiAngelo]

Cut and paste between mixed unit plans wasn't the topic of discussion. 

 

Rene,  if you open and convert the imperial plan to metric (4 decimal mm accuracy) then cut and paste from that plan to your other metric plan. Does this work?

 

Then convert your previous plan back to Imperial, or simply close it without saving.

 

I'm on vacation this week, so I can't test this.

[Joe_Carrick]

Just to expand on what John said - at least that's what I think he was saying.

1. Open your Imperial Layout Template to page 0 and create a box matching your sheet boundary.
2. Turn off the drawing sheet display
3. Copy everything  ( Ctrl_C )
4. Open a Metric Layout Template
5. Paste Hold Position ( Ctrl_Alt_V )
6. Resize by 2.54 with the copy still selected.
7. Find a matching metric sheet size (create a new one if necessary) and center in both directions.  Metric sheets are not an exact match to Imperial sheets so some fussing is necessary.
8. Save as your new Metric Template - whatever name you want.

That will have saved all your Imperial Borders, Title Blocks, etc.

[Renerabbitt]

1 hour ago, JiAngelo said:

Cut and paste between mixed unit plans wasn't the topic of discussion. 

This was to illustrate the point of the dimensionless 1:1 conversion and why you can't simply "convert" imperial to metric.
 

 

1 hour ago, JiAngelo said:

convert the imperial plan to metric

There is no tool for this, what are you suggesting?

Chief does a unitless import of defaults, which means all of your text style dimensions will be wrong for instance
 

[Joe_Carrick]

2 minutes ago, Renerabbitt said:

This was to illustrate the point of the dimensionless 1:1 conversion and why you can't simply "convert" imperial to metric.

Rene,

The reason for making a metric version is to create a Layout Template with the same borders, title blocks, text, indexes, etc.

Offhand I can't think of any reason to attempt the same thing for Plan Templates since I would simply create the model in the appropriate Metric Template.

Of course an Imperial Plan can be sent to a Metric Layout at the scale.

[Renerabbitt]

3 minutes ago, Joe_Carrick said:

Rene,

The reason for making a metric version is to create a Layout Template with the same borders, title blocks, text, indexes, etc.

Offhand I can't think of any reason to attempt the same thing for Plan Templates since I would simply create the model in the appropriate Metric Template.

Of course an Imperial Plan can be sent to a Metric Layout at the scale.

I literally want to convert my plan template from imperial to metric. I have put it off for 2 years now because of how much work it is. I want to convert all of my CAD details to a system that works in metric, I want to run all of my same macros without having to re-script for different inputs and formatters, and I want to transfer defaults and cad blocks and text styles and wall types etc. 
There is NO easy way to do this, it is a lot of work

[Joe_Carrick]

3 hours ago, Renerabbitt said:

I literally want to convert my plan template from imperial to metric. I have put it off for 2 years now because of how much work it is. I want to convert all of my CAD details to a system that works in metric, I want to run all of my same macros without having to re-script for different inputs and formatters, and I want to transfer defaults and cad blocks and text styles and wall types etc. 
There is NO easy way to do this, it is a lot of work

I haven't looked at all of what you're asking.  However, for at least the dimensioning aspects you can use the secondary formatting.  Defaults I'm pretty sure would need to be unique to the metric system.  Macros could fairly easily be conditional for metric vs imperial.  For many of my macros I wrote them for that initially - and - when the measurement class was introduce I had to deal with that as well.  One way to deal with the formatting is to have a set of $Globals for the formatters.  It's then really easy to switch depending on Metric vs Imperial.

 

If you need assistance with the macro conditional processing based on units - let me know.

 

Maybe this will help