HumbleChief

I shut Chief down and re-booted my computer and everything is back to normal. Just one of those weirds I guess. Thanks for the replies

Thanks Eric, but what happened? And why should one have to do that? I can always just replace the slab which is essentially what you suggesting but why? There's a couple of buggy things I've encountered with this new release but that doesn't lessen my appreciation for your help and time. thanks again.

Not sure what's happening here but I can't delete certain items and now I can't select a hole in a slab in order to delete it. If I insert a new hole I can select and delete it but not the other hole. I can replace the slab easily enough but am just wondering what I'm missing? Anyone else experiencing this? Attached plan. hole_in_slab.plan

Nothing locked, just can't delete them - weird.

Seems like I can turn off the display of the elevation and section cameras then delete items, turn the display back on then use the elevation camera I need to create my symbol. Did Chief always work this way? Could have sworn I could simply delete every thing, including cameras with a simple warning that could be ignored.

When creating a new symbol I open my template plan, create an elevation to build the symbol, then delete all the other items to save my new symbol. This morning I created my symbol went to delete all other items and I can't delete the elevation/section cameras and can't group select anything if the cameras are included. Something simple? Weird, seems as though I've done this a thousand times. Something with my Layer Sets? Nothing is locked. Weird. As long as I group select items WITHOUT including the elevation/section cameras they will delete but instead of a previous warning about deleting the camera views they simply will not delete. Gotta be something simple. Any help GREATLY appreciated. My template plan is below. TEMPLATE_4_26_17_AS_BUILT.plan

Thanks again for some clarification Glenn. It's a great help.

Had no idea that feature was there - thanks Eric.

I'm sure this has been suggested before but I found this tip from Glenn Woodward to somehow make sense to me suddenly. I hope it helps others and any tips regarding same MUCH appreciated.

Yeah I'm seeing some great possibilities with this technique. I tried it on a test plan and was amazed to see how Chief actually works - graphically - nice tip. Maybe post that in the tips and techniques section? I think it is worthy and thanks again. I'm posting a vid in the Tips and Techniques section. If anyone wants to elaborate or correct my interpretation - more than welcome.

Good to know, thanks as always.

Helpful, Thanks Glenn

That's a great tip Glenn. BTW it doesn't work with a back clipped cross section but the visual is very helpful.

Yusuf, your posts and your attitude on this forum are very refreshing and I appreciate them and your great energy very much. Having said that the fact that you just posted 3 or 4 paragraphs on how to think of Chief and the way it works 'logically' more than makes my point. There's a logic to Chief no doubt, but one that does not come to hand immediately - it has to be learned which may make it 'logical' to some and crazy making to others. I am firmly in the latter camp. I always built from the bottom up and took that 'logic' to Chief and was thoroughly trounced by Chief's alternative 'logic'. I thought the 'logic' that the ceiling structure of floor 1 would have an effect on the ceiling framing of floor one on a 2 story building and was once again trounced by Chief's 'logic'. So is Chief's version of creating structures 'logical'? Of course it is - to the designers of the software. But that may or may not translate to the user or the user interface and in Chief's case I think they missed the UI boat in many cases. Remember these are the same folks who gave us a new feature of poly line area labels that resolved to 7 decimal places - making it completely useless - as a new feature no less (remains the same to this day BTW). Perhaps that same 'logic' is placed in too many places in Chief's UI or I just don't get Chief's version of logic. Had another thought. If the way you've explained Chief's paradigm is indeed 'correct', knowing 'correct' is quite a subjective term, then where is this clear explanation of how Chief's structure dialog box should be viewed in Chief's literature and or training videos? Or even the structure dbx itself? There are many users who don't understand it and many that do but the 'logic' you present is not part of Chief's training or instruction - and should be IMO.

Do you think there's 'real' way to look at anything in Chief? I think Chief's floor structure paradigm is, in general, quite confusing as the posts in this thread attest. And yes the ceiling above and the floor below are the same thing but build a 2 story structure and spec a ceiling structure for floor 1, and a different floor structure for floor 2. The ceiling structure of floor 1 is completely ignored and the framing is based entirely on the floor structure of floor (level) 2. Logical? Maybe. Why is the ceiling structure of floor 1 ignored? I dunno but if you don't learn that simple but obscure method within Chief then you'll waist a lot of time trying to get both structures the same when it's not needed..

I know you are trying to be helpful as always Yusuf but that's hilarious. Chief does not work logically but I think you might have meant to say try and think like the programmers at Chief think. The (logical?) paradigm Chief uses is to set lower floor ceiling heights by setting the floor heights of the room above. If you want to raise those lower floor ceiling heights, do not try and change those ceiling heights, which might seem logical but not the way Chief works, instead go upstairs and raise the floors of the rooms above. The plan will help of course but that might help you a bit.

AND the newly created layers cannot be deleted like they could before the update.

The new update breaks the ALDO's function like Chop's video and your (Michael) experience shows. I can duplicate the bad behavior with the new update.

No...hmmm wonder if that's the problem? I don't use that feature much from the ALDO so it if stops working with the new update no great loss for me. I'll download when I get a chance and test it.

Pretty sure that check box has no effect anymore and 'Modify All Layers' is set by default - I think - as Dermot stated above - "If you create a new layer in one layer set, it should show up in every other layer set, always."

Curious as to why it worked on my computer as the videos above show? Why was i not able to easily reproduce this behavior? Did I miss something?

Hey Chop, I can see the confusion that happens when adding layers to the ALDO but as I remember the ALDO has always worked (badly) this way. I remember copying a layer and there was nothing that showed up in the ALDO but when checking the Layer Display Options dbx, there it was. I stopped using the ALDO to manage/add/delete Layers for this very reason. I think it should behave as you are expecting it to but it simply does not. I always use the Layer Option dbx to add and manage all my layers because the ALDO was not (for some strange reason) designed to do so efficiently. BTW, I remember X8 not even showing the new layer in the ALDO, especially if copying a layer. One would have to go to the Layer Management dbx to see any new Layer. Very confusing then and confusing now. EDIT: I wonder if something changed over the versions of X8 because it seems to work OK now. Oh well, now I'm confused EDIT AGAIN: Just tried the technique you show and it works as Dermot suggests it should. I bet you have a setting that needs changing?

Jerry try turning all your layers on and see if the lines show. If they do you can then turn on just that layer for your plan view..

I think this is actually one of the great illusions and conundrums regarding Chief today. Of course you need as much CPU etc. that you can afford but the new video cards are little to no better than last generation's cards as far as 3D rendering is concerned. I bought a brand new GTX1080 but wouldn't buy it tomorrow as there was little to no discernable difference between that and my older 780. Waste of money? Probably not but goes counter to what one expects with newer technology. As for getting as much CPU as you can afford again it's not that simple. Some perform better at different tasks in Chief. Do you want to RayTrace? You might need more cores. Do you just want fast performance in everyday tasks? That's might be a combination of cores, Ghz speed, disk and memory performance. Again just not as simple as buying the fastest, best, or whatever adjective you choose. Chief is a complicated beast and behaves in mysterious ways and it doesn't always respond in a logical fashion to better faster, more cores in a CPU or GPU.

Not sure about too much of the technicals but in general the dual setup is great for some tasks like Chief's CPU dependent RayTracing but really not that fast for every day Chief tasks. When I first set it up maximizing RT's was the goal 6 - 8 years ago and it shines in that department but it's complex (2 of everything) power hungry and just plain outdated by today's standards. Don't get me wrong it is VERY serviceable but I really need the fastest stuff out there for larger models and will upgrade as soon as the high end desktop market shows itself a little clearer.