Where is the rollouts in cabinet components?

[dskogg]

Wow that is a lot of info.. my brain hurts.. but I wanted to utilize the attributes of say cabinets to automatically price them in the material list.

 

Mark have you managed to do this?

 

i was thinking that for say a base cabinet wxhxd one could calculate plywood for carcass and wxh would give me edge tape on front. Once you have this you could assign labour to assemble carcass and labour to install.. also maybe total number of cabinets in job one could assign a delivery charge per cabinet.

Then each drawer wxhxl one could determine plywood for drawer.. wxd would give you edge tape for top of drawer.. then one could again assign labour to build drawer and labour to install on site to add drawer front and align.. drawer front wxh would give one area for material and then cost to finish and cost to paint could be determined..

 

once all this is saved once any size cabinet would produce a fairly accurate cost.

 

i mostly do renovations and cabinetry is such a large part of cost. We use cabinet vision to manufacture cabs but it doesn’t have the presentation or speed that ca has along with all the other architectural materials.

 

we also use Buildertrend ( cloud based project management software) that can import ca material right into the proposal for pricing.. it would be so automated once design in ca was done all the budgets would be 90% done.

 

 

[dskogg]

Marc.. being the cab ninja .. is there a way to have rollouts or drawers narrower than inside of cabinet carcass?

 

or is this just hard wired into chief?

 

we build all our cabs with refinished birtch plywood.. it would be nice to show the drawer box in birtch with drawer face attached.

 

also since we manufacture carcass with plywood we don’t have integrated side panels.. we use adjustable feet attached to base and attach plant on gables to cab sides where required and kicks are just pinned to front legs.

 

 

[MarkMc]

2 hours ago, dskogg said:

is there a way to have rollouts or drawers narrower than inside of cabinet carcass?

Aside from the CL/ML macros, which I don't have a handle on, the others are consistent. Read in the manual or tutorial the difference in the types of evaluated macros. a non evaluated macro works in a text box and reads what you wrote only,

a referenced evaluated macro will read the results of the macro into a text box from another object so long as an arrow is connected between the text box and the object

an Owner Object evaluated macro will read the results of the macro into a field in the object it is placed in AS LONG AS that object has the NVP's used in the macro (check the object properties macro-copy them and paste somewhere) Note that Collections behave differently than other NVPs

2 hours ago, dskogg said:

. is there a way to have rollouts or drawers narrower than inside of cabinet carcass? 

Plan attached- open the symbols and look at stretch planes and origins. The width of the bounding box for the RO symbol was set to 1" wider than the symbol was so it will resize 1" smaller than Chief thinks it should be. I included two versions of finished interior one as a door symbol inserted into the back (CA turns that into a peninsula cabinet in description though) the other as a symbol used as a shelf. The shelf symbols are more of a PIA since you need more sizes of them-more stuff posted a year or more ago in symbols or tips section.

 

3 hours ago, dskogg said:

Wow that is a lot of info.. my brain hurts.. but I wanted to utilize the attributes of say cabinets to automatically price them in the material list.

 

Mark have you managed to do this?

I've gotten information I can use to price cabinets from manufacturers info from schedules then pasting into a spreadsheet. That requires some looking up and filling in OR using a cabinet mfg on line ordering system. Been doing that for about 6 years now. Last year worked out a way to do that faster. Then figured out it could look up prices, started working on that in August in between real work (I don't need this any more so it's a charity job) Had to learn more about Ruby for that. Almost got there when they gave us the ability to access the OIP fields in macros in X11. Started to rework the macros. Then yesterday figured out that the ML should be easier so going that way.

What I am doing will read from a CSV file. It's possible to do what you are asking but I don't think that cabinet mfg even go to that fine a grain. I would not go quite that way. I'd figure out a way to group pricing, (base in size range, add in for number of drawers, upcharge for wood species, charge per door ...),  you don't need to count pennies for materials. Doors, drawers, finish and labor are all the most expensive parts. Labor always costs more than materials. Look at how mfg price, there are a couple of methods and look at the object properties in the TMM to see what you can access. Keep it as simple as possible IMO. If you generate a CSV file with pricing then you may be able to adapt, or have someone else adapt what I do for the current project. Call Michael.

cab RO.plan

[dskogg]

1 hour ago, MarkMc said:

Aside from the CL/ML macros, which I don't have a handle on, the others are consistent. Read in the manual or tutorial the difference in the types of evaluated macros. a non evaluated macro works in a text box and reads what you wrote only,

a referenced evaluated macro will read the results of the macro into a text box from another object so long as an arrow is connected between the text box and the object

an Owner Object evaluated macro will read the results of the macro into a field in the object it is placed in AS LONG AS that object has the NVP's used in the macro (check the object properties macro-copy them and paste somewhere) Note that Collections behave differently than other NVPs

Plan attached- open the symbols and look at stretch planes and origins. The width of the bounding box for the RO symbol was set to 1" wider than the symbol was so it will resize 1" smaller than Chief thinks it should be. I included two versions of finished interior one as a door symbol inserted into the back (CA turns that into a peninsula cabinet in description though) the other as a symbol used as a shelf. The shelf symbols are more of a PIA since you need more sizes of them-more stuff posted a year or more ago in symbols or tips section.

 

I've gotten information I can use to price cabinets from manufacturers info from schedules then pasting into a spreadsheet. That requires some looking up and filling in OR using a cabinet mfg on line ordering system. Been doing that for about 6 years now. Last year worked out a way to do that faster. Then figured out it could look up prices, started working on that in August in between real work (I don't need this any more so it's a charity job) Had to learn more about Ruby for that. Almost got there when they gave us the ability to access the OIP fields in macros in X11. Started to rework the macros. Then yesterday figured out that the ML should be easier so going that way.

What I am doing will read from a CSV file. It's possible to do what you are asking but I don't think that cabinet mfg even go to that fine a grain. I would not go quite that way. I'd figure out a way to group pricing, (base in size range, add in for number of drawers, upcharge for wood species, charge per door ...),  you don't need to count pennies for materials. Doors, drawers, finish and labor are all the most expensive parts. Labor always costs more than materials. Look at how mfg price, there are a couple of methods and look at the object properties in the TMM to see what you can access. Keep it as simple as possible IMO. If you generate a CSV file with pricing then you may be able to adapt, or have someone else adapt what I do for the current project. Call Michael.

cab RO.plan

Thanks Mark for your reply, I work for a custom cabinetry shop and renovation company, I do the Reno design , sales presentation, budget and project manage. Because we are custom and everything we do is cut on a cnc machine we don’t have a standard price list... when we load everything into cabinet vision it will spit out a price per job.. but it is not done unless we build the cabs and does not present half as well as chief.. so having a price come out of ca that is based off of ca I’d useful, I just need to learn some programming.. 

[Kbird1]

6 minutes ago, dskogg said:

I just need to learn some programming..

 

That maybe the understatement  of the Year   either that or you are Part programmer/Part Designer , which I am not , not yet anyway , though I see they actually updated the X11 Ref. Manual with more info now and I have installed Ruby 2.4.5 instead of 2.5.4 to play with, since CA is using 2.4 apparently.

 

https://rubyinstaller.org/downloads/

http://www.ruby-lang.org/en/documentation/quickstart/

 

If the Company is paying David , it would likely be worthwhile having Joe or Michael look at it for you...

 

M.

 

 

[Kbird1]

1 hour ago, MarkMc said:

Read in the manual or tutorial the difference in the types of evaluated macros. a non evaluated macro works in a text box and reads what you wrote only,

a referenced evaluated macro will read the results of the macro into a text box from another object so long as an arrow is connected between the text box and the object

an Owner Object evaluated macro will read the results of the macro into a field in the object it is placed in AS LONG AS that object has the NVP's used in the macro (check the object properties macro-copy them and paste somewhere) Note that Collections behave differently than other NVPs

 

Just been looking at the new Ref.Manual which i hadn't realised they had finally update for Ruby , and downgraded the Ruby I had so I can play a bit in 2.4 as I have time.... THANKS.

 

M.

 

[MarkMc]

25 minutes ago, dskogg said:

Because we are custom and everything we do is cut on a cnc machine we don’t have a standard price list... when we load everything into cabinet vision it will spit out a price per job

Most of the cabinet brands I worked with over the last few years were manufactured FULL custom- (even more  custom than what you describe)-they use CabinetVision and have price lists based on what I described. I have no doubt that I could not take 95% of the cabinets you may have specified in the last year and just plug in to one of their price lists. The only time we needed custom quotes were for things completely outside the bock-like say a cabinet with a custom door style, reclaimed wood, with custom turnings, silicone bronze hardware-usually it was because the labor needed to be estimated outside the norm though. Point is one can be put together.

9 minutes ago, Kbird1 said:

, and downgraded the Ruby I had so I can play a bit in 2.4 as I have time

Mick, your better off playing with ruby in the Chief Ruby console than in an installed version. Among other things ruby in chief never uses "puts" which you need all the time with an installed version. Ruby installed on your machine can't tell if you can access the data built into an object in Chief, the console can. Other than that it works the same way as the console installed with Ruby to your OS.