Doug_N

Members
 View Profile  See their activity

  • Posts

    1499

  • Joined

  • Last visited

 Content Type 

Posts posted by Doug_N

    Fire Shutter

    in General Q & A

    Posted

    23 hours ago, robdyck said:

    Thanks for your reply Doug! This is where our codes differ. The ABC does not (yet) have this statement. You were able to provide a much better explanation than the local building official I talked with. And to reiterate, I wasn't challenging the use of the closure but rather I wanted documentation to support the use.

     

    I just read that portion of the ABC and I was amazed at the differences.  Seeing as they both are based on the NBC I would have thought they would be more aligned. 

    Fire Shutter

    in General Q & A

    Posted

    On 10/11/2023 at 6:46 PM, robdyck said:

    I'm curious about the use of this Doug. I ran into a similar issue on a recent project where the building inspector asked for fire shutters on bedroom windows. The inspector indicated that because the house was a certain distance from the property line, he wanted fire shutters installed to protect our house from a potential fire at the adjacent property. 

     

    I challenged him on this. The building code clearly indicates that in residential applications, our responsibility when building within a certain proximity to the property line is to limit the spread of fire from OUR HOUSE to other properties, not the other way around. 

     

    SO, if our proposed house is on fire, how does the fire shutter with a fusible link know the difference between fire from outside or fire from inside? 

    Especially in the case of a bedroom! Couldn't a fire shutter trap an occupant in the bedroom by closing off the only available means of egress due to a fire from inside?

     

    Currently I'm not aware of any product literature that addresses this but if you have some information to pass on I'd appreciate it!

    The fusible link is on the outside of the exterior wall.  If the link melts, the shutter closes.  

     

    There are two cases for the shutter working as designed.

    1) There is a fire in the neighboring house.   The radiation from that fire is sufficient to trip the shutter, and it closes.  The heat that is required for that would prevent a person from exiting from that window anyhow. so the occupant is protected and should find another exit from the building.  

    2) There is a fire inside the building, and the radiation from the fire is such that the heat over the exterior of the window is great enough to melt the link and the shutter closes.  There is already enough heat in the room adjacent to the shutter that the occupant of the room if still in there is already dead.  The shutter closes, and protects the adjacent building and the wall above the window for the duration of the fire rating time.  

     

    Your assertion about the building code is right, The code speaks of protecting buildings next to the subject building.

     

    Ontario Building Code - Volume 1, O. Reg. 332/12, Article 9.10.13.1. of Division B
    9.10.13.1. Closures
    (1) Except as provided in Article 9.10.13.2. , openings in required fire separations shall be protected with a closure conforming to Table 9.10.13.1. and shall be installed in conformance with NFPA 80, “Fire Doors and Other Opening Protectives”, unless otherwise specified in this Part.
    Table 9.10.13.1.
    Fire-Protection Ratings for Closures
    Forming Part of Sentence 9.10.13.1.(1)
    Item
    Column 1
    Required Fire-Resistance Rating of Fire Separation
    Column 2
    Required Fire-Protection Rating of Closure
    1.
    30 or 45 min
    20 min (1)
    2.
    1 h
    45 min (1)
    3.
    1.5 h
    1 h
    4.
    2 h
    1.5 h
    5.
    3 h
    2 h
    6.
    4 h
    3 h

     

    For Part 3 Buildings:

    The limiting distance calculations are used to protect adjacent buildings. The Ontario Building Code - Volume 1, O. Reg. 332/12, Section 3.1.10.6. states that the requirements of Article 3.2.3.14. shall apply to the external walls of two buildings that meet at a firewall at an angle less than 135°. The limiting distance is the distance from the building face to the property line or to an adjacent building face. The area of unprotected openings in an exposing building face for the applicable limiting distance shall be not more than the value determined in accordance with Table 3.2.3.1.B., Table 3.2.3.1.C., Table 3.2.3.1.D. or Table 3.2.3.1.E. for an exposing building face conforming to Article 3.2.3.2. of a building or fire compartment that is not sprinklered.

    For Part 9 Buildings:

    Ontario Building Code - Volume 1, O. Reg. 332/12, Article 9.10.15.4. of Division B
    9.10.15.4. Glazed Openings in Exposing Building FaceA-9.10.15.4.(2) Staggered or Skewed Exposing Building Faces of Houses.
    (1) Except as provided in Sentences (3) to (5), the maximum area of glazed openings in an exposing building face shall,
    (a) conform to Table 9.10.15.4. ,
    (b) conform to Subsection 3.2.3 . as if the glazed openings were unprotected openings , or
    (c) where the limiting distance is not less than 1.2 m , be equal to or less than the limiting distance squared.
    Table 9.10.15.4.
    Maximum Area of Glazed Openings in Exterior Walls of Houses
    Forming Part of Sentences 9.10.15.4.(1) and (2)
    Item
    Column 1
    2
    3
    4
    5
    6
    7
    8
    9
    10
    11
    12
    13
    14
    15
     
     
     
    Maximum Total Area of Exposing Building Face , m²
    Maximum Aggregate Area of Glazed Openings, % of Exposing Building Face Area
    Limiting Distance , m
    Less than 1.2
    1.2
    1.5
    2
    2.5
    3
    4
    6
    8
    10
    12
    16
    20
    25
    1.
    10
    0
    8
    12
    21
    33
    55
    96
    100
    —
    —
    —
    —
    —
    —
    2.
    15
    0
    8
    10
    17
    25
    37
    67
    100
    —
    —
    —
    —
    —
    —
    3.
    20
    0
    8
    10
    15
    21
    30
    53
    100
    —
    —
    —
    —
    —
    —
    4.
    25
    0
    8
    9
    13
    19
    26
    45
    100
    —
    —
    —
    —
    —
    —
    5.
    30
    0
    7
    9
    12
    17
    23
    39
    88
    100
    —
    —
    —
    —
    —
    6.
    40
    0
    7
    8
    11
    15
    20
    32
    69
    100
    —
    —
    —
    —
    —
    7.
    50
    0
    7
    8
    10
    14
    18
    28
    57
    100
    —
    —
    —
    —
    —
    8.
    100
    0
    7
    8
    9
    11
    13
    18
    34
    56
    84
    100
    —
    —
    —
    9.
    Over 100
    0
    7
    7
    8
    9
    10
    12
    19
    28
    40
    55
    92
    100
    —
    (2) Where the limits on the area of glazed openings are determined for individual portions of the exterior wall, as described in Subclause 9.10.15.2.(1)(b)(iii) , the maximum aggregate area of glazed openings for any portion shall not exceed the values in the row of Table 9.10.15.4. for the total area of the entire exposing building face based on the limiting distance of the individual portion.
    (3) The limits on the area of glazed openings shall not apply to the exposing building face of a house facing a detached garage or accessory building , where,
    (a) the detached garage or accessory building serves the house or an individual dwelling unit in the house ,
    (b) the detached garage or accessory building is located on the same property as the house , and
    (c) the house is the only major occupancy on the property.
    (4) Except as provided in Sentence (5), openings in a wall having a limiting distance of less than 1.2 m shall be protected by closures , of other than wired glass or glass block, whose fire-protection rating is in conformance with the fire-resistance rating required for the wall.
    (5) An opening in an exposing building face not more than 130 cm 2 shall not be considered an unprotected opening .
    • Like 1

    Fire Shutter

    in General Q & A

    Posted

    17 hours ago, DeLayDesign said:

    I found one Google's 3D warehouse.  I imported it as millwork so I could apply it "above the window" and set it as such - unfortunately there isn't a way to 'lock' the position of the pc above the window as a window element so when you change the height the main component stays put.  I also tried to use it as a 'shutter' and it technically works but there are some additional sizing steps you'd have to take for it to look correct.

    The easiest way would be to simply add it to your model an an individual component and then place it above the window as an object.  You can stretch the unit down to show it closed if you'd like.  It will stretch evenly leaving the top untouched.

    Fire Shutter.calibz 203.99 kB · 0 downloads

    Thanks for the symbol.  It is pretty good; I can add the tracks to this as well to get the type appearance of a fire shutter.  

    Fire Shutter

    in General Q & A

    Posted

    Just wondering if anyone has modelled an external fire shutter.  When a wall is closer to the lot line than 4' a fire shutter is required.  I made a very crude one, but it would be great if someone had modelled one that is better than my really bad model.

     

    image.thumb.png.4b6f9865eba4af65f896c3f7d14cc040.png

     

    For example it would be illustrative to be able to have the shutter in an open position (like my model) or in a closed or partially closed positing.  There is a rollup door in the catalogue but that model is either open, or closed all the way, and it is an internal shutter.  Not what I am looking for at all.

    Garage Slab Lines in 3D / Elevation ??

    in General Q & A

    Posted

    Here is a garage with the room specified as a garage and a generated slab foundation,  

     

    image.thumb.png.8bd034e13f0c80a14ecfd69691bbf0b7.png

    Here is the same garage with stem walls and frost footings.

     

    image.thumb.png.252eed7be9541019b4745ef4d8fa518a.png

     

    And here is the same building with an unspecified room definition, and a floor finish specified as concrete.  

     

    image.thumb.png.10e01204f290cf22fbd9dc0ef376e976.png

    Is that what you are seeing?

    Area Macros

    in General Q & A

    Posted

    29 minutes ago, Joe_Carrick said:

     

    There are a few more things to consider:

    • volume(cu ft)/area(sq ft) = linear (inches)
    • volume(cu ft)*area(sq ft) = derived (nonsense)
    • volume(cu ft)/linear(inches) = area (sq ft)
    • volume(cu ft)/volume(cu ft) = ratio (unitless)
    •  
    • area(sq ft)/linear(inches) = linear (inches)
    • area(sq ft)*linear(inches) = volume (cu ft)
    • area(sq ft)/area(sq ft) = ratio (unitless)
    • area(sq ft)/volume(cu ft) = derived (nonsense)
    •  
    • area+/-linear = error, not allowed
    • area+/-volume = error, not allowed
    • volume+/-linear = error, not allowed
    •  
    • linear(inches)/area(sq ft) = derived (nonsense)
    • linear(inches)/volume(cu ft) = derived (nonsense)
    • There are probably a few more

    Generally it's best to know what the units are and, if necessary convert to floating point values before the calculations.

    Joe,

     

    Have you considered doing a class on the use of Ruby in CA?   I bet lots of us would sign up for it.

    • Like 1
    • Upvote 2

    Area Macros

    in General Q & A

    Posted

    Joe makes a good observation in his comment about variable types.  You can't divide an integer or floating value by a length or by an area.  But you can divide a length or area by any of the following: an area, a length, an integer or a floating point variable.

    • Like 1

    Area Macros

    in General Q & A

    Posted

    Area = % $testarea = area %

    Area = % $testarea = area/2 %

     

    image.thumb.png.712402284a2d3b1aa71e9329031127be.png

     

    image.png.5e9143d3fc485cef44999afd39cecc37.png

     

    This seems to work for a area bound by a rectangular polygon.  

     

    Please post the ruby macro that you are trying to use?  This could be a formatting issue.

    • Like 1

    What Do You Use When Measuring a House?

    in General Q & A

    Posted

    On 9/8/2023 at 12:30 PM, jtcapa1 said:

    Looks like laser devices are getting better and better.  One device called VH-80A, has auto calibration, level, angle, volume and being a Bilateral laser distance meter, you can quickly get wall to wall, and ceiling heights without bending down to the floor! Anybody try a device like this?

     

    I haven't but I would in a heartbeat.  Unfortunately, they won't ship to Canada!  

    Is Chief Interiors no longer available?

    in Sales Related Questions

    Posted

    On 2/21/2023 at 3:00 PM, Alaskan_Son said:

     

    Haven’t you ever given a customer a special discount or done a little something extra for them?  I assume you probably have.  If so, did you then reach out to all your other Customers and offer them the same discount or do something extra for all of them as well?  

    I not only do that, but if I charge a customer more than previous clients, then I go back to all the ones that paid less and charge them more as well.  So far I am up a lot.  lol. Isn't logic amazing?  Now if I can stop laughing and get back to work that would be good. 

    • Like 1

    Schedule Numbering

    in General Q & A

    Posted

    I know this is probably a beginner question, but it has me really perplexed.  How can I force a schedule to keep the numbers and only add a new number if an item is added?  For example, when adding a window as a revision to an already issued set of drawings.  Sometimes the whole schedule will be renumbered with the newer window appearing somewhere in the middle of the schedule.

    Deck Skirting

    in General Q & A

    Posted

    I'm assuming that the skirt boards will be fastened to the deck posts.  The boards can be created as individual boards using 3d solids.  Then you can multi copy the boards vertically or horizontally as required, trimming individual boards as required for the grade.

    How to pull off this cottage detail in CA?

    in General Q & A

    Posted

    The feature in the picture is called "corbelling" and is a way for masonry to change the cross-section of a wythe of brick or stone.  Most building codes restrict corbels to an offset of 1/3 brick, more or less, unless certified by a structural engineer or architect.  Before designing such a structure, my advice is to check what the building code is in your area.  This can be done in CA as mentioned, by modelling a 3d solid and then mirroring to match the opposite side. 

    • Upvote 1