johnny

Here is an example I am actually working on right now.  Past clients of mine had friends who were developing plans by a "designer" - and when these people shared the plans with my former clients, they were advised to have me look at the design and offer an opinion.  Its a slopping lot, but the clients wanted single-level living - however, the designer said it was impossible to get a 2-car garage on the main floor entry level, so he had to place the garages all in the basement (stairs).  These people are elderly, yet they assumed what their designer was saying is correct and so planned to walk up and down stairs each time they accessed the garage.  Further, this is a seaboard town and they wanted the house to look "beachy" (their word) - yet they didn't have the budget for full cedar shingles together with what they wanted inside.

Their "designer" permit approved these drawings:

Floor Plan

Elevations

Following their request, these were my concepts:

Floor Plan Concept

Elevation Concept

My example isn't a architect vs designer issue - since I feel many designers are awesome.  Its about people going down a path they dont know they dont know.  Had these clients not heard from their friends they should come talk with me, they would be building this other plan right now that didn't meet the objectives they wanted.

I've seen it both ways buddy

I've seen bad design by both architect and designer - no question.  Yet, even in something I felt was "bad design" (which is subjective), there tends to be organized thought (program) coming through an architects work that I simply dont see with "bad" design by a "designer".  Id rather have a good designer than a bad architect (again subjective)....but I would rather have a bad architect than a bad designer.

Hiring an architect does give you some quality threshold which a designer (good or bad) doesn't have to even have to consider.

You probably don't need an Architect unless you want one. I have been doing plans in the most regulated areas in the country for 40 years without being an architect. building design can be done by anyone including yourself. Architect's always try to scare everyone.

- "building design can be done by anyone"

- "Architect's always try to scare everyone"

Those are some interesting absolutes you state.  Needless to say, I fully disagree.  I'll state again, I have NEVER seen a DIY project I thought was well done and didn't look DIY.  I won't be as bold to state an absolute and say: "There are NO DIY homes that look good to ANYONE".

Thx JPC,  I did get the ADBLOCK,  and that is working now,  I did go through extensions and uninstall something,  I have a feeling I have something very invasive.  As of now,  I am okay,  we will see in the next week or so if I have issues.  It just seems like there are some POP UPS coming from somewhere that I cannot pinpoint how to eliminate.....  I am getting by so far,  thx.

Well, keep in mind that unlike Windows, there are very few "application" installations outside their dedicated "packages" - which means viruses are harder to get, and less invasive than Windows machines which have app components in the system folders.  Im not saying its impossible, but with Apple viruses have few places to "hide" where they aren't easy to find/delete.

Windows viruses are terrible due to the shortcomings of "VB scripts" and their effect.  Win 8 has been a big step forward to start to curb this, but Apple has never given an application that much control over system folders - so much less damage a virus/malware can do secretly.

Scott, there is something called AdBlock you can also manage your extensions safari to turn off.

Thru Apple.com  - https://extensions.apple.com/

What you have is probably an installed extension you didn't want - here is a video to uninstall extensions manually.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8oxD7jfnepw

If its not an extension, then its something much more invasive, but i've found most adware in Apple is simply installing an extension I dont want.

 

 

BTW, it is illegal in every state that I know of to offer "architectural design" without actually being a licensed architect.

This is true.

Also, Julie - I know a lot of people think you can DIY for residential design, but I've NEVER in my career seen a home done by DIY that didn't look DIY.  Its like proposing to Microsoft they allow you to handle their marketing campaign since you have MS Publisher.  The money you will spend on a professional to take your ideas and floor plan and put finishing touches everywhere is money well spent when you go to sell your home, not to mention livability factors.

Would you be willing to post your plan so far?

I think it is always open if you want to

Not the window I am talking about - since you have to click or press to activate which auto-closes the window each time.  Seeing this layer video I now better understand Doug's comment that Chief is going to be more able to be modeless in future releases.

Here  is my take on the sandwich board.

Same as Larry with some curves and artwork.

 

http://screencast.com/t/QAMUySH5n7BI

 

 

Johnny,

I think you are wrong.

 

 

Can it model a multi-layered wall with materials and framing, EASILY? 

AND have all the smarts that a Chief wall has?

I have to admit.... watching your video made it look easy.  However, I think you would have to admit [hyperbole] even by the response to this thread the solution wasn't as well known or understood as it should be.  In Vectorworks, the focus is first on making shapes - then turning shapes into useable and definable objects.  Therefore, finding the path to completing something like a simple A-Board is well known to nearly any regular Vectorworks user because the path is similar to other paths.  I still get confused about selecting what multifaceted linear path is needed for the creation of certain things in CA.  Though yusuf's suggestion to use ceiling planes was ingenious, its far from intuitively obvious.

I dont want to beat a dead horse on this matter, as i know i've made my opinion known - I 100% agree your video showed creation of the A-Board was simple to do in Chief.  In fact, your video was VERY helpful thank you.

As to if Vectorworks has high control on walls - YES.  Here is a video on that subject:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZecfP1DUnrg

here is a good foundation framing video (you will be impressed with level of detail) in VW: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvQSopJJBfU

For those curious, here is a cool video showing power of walls/glass in Vectorworks (commercial use primarily):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wCkcnQ3bmN4

One neat thing handy about Vectorworks (and lots of other apps) is that if you needed to model like this, you can import into Chief easily.  I do find good power between the 2 tools. 

OK, now this is what I am talking about....way to go Chief!

Would love to see the info DBX in this area as well always open...but a step in the right direction for sure.

Johnny,

 

I guess it's my woodworking and building experience that tends to make using Chief for this so easy.  I tend to think in terms of the small components being put together into larger constructs.  I just build my symbols the same way I would in real life.  I've also grown quite comfortable with adding and subtracting 3D shapes using the boolean operations [add, subtract, union] in order to create more complex forms.

Im not sure I fully understand the primitive tool-set in CA.  The name of these tools doesn't inspire confidence...lol.

There are quick things I can do in Vectorworks to add to this A-board like chamfer the edges slightly and add brackets to the top edges at the existing slop angle....which to me seems next to impossible in Chief.  I am curious about this, and whether or not its just my lack of knowledge of this app.  Even just creating shapes that say include a rounded inside corner to the legs seem a task...but maybe i am wrong.

Very Nice, but not seeing anything I can't do in TurboCAD Pro Platinum so far.  Didn't see any sectioning of Solids, at least not in that clip.  Can you convert Chief surfaces into Solids in VW? U3D?

 

Nice though.  Thanks for taking the time to show that.

Yes, there is no question other apps can do similar things - but how many specific Architectural apps can do this?  I guess its the variety of what can be done, with powerful specific tools for architecture and landscape architecture.  That said, Vectorworks doesn't have the residential specific tools anywhere on the scale what Chief has....which is why I use CA as well.  If I specialized in modern homes I might use Vectorworks exclusively, but for transitional styles of homes i've not found anything like Chief.

What I really wish is if CA would get simple 3D tools at the same level of Sketchup at least.

Not sure if I understand what you mean by "cover Chief surfaces into solids"....  meaning export from Chief into Vectorworks with data?

Johnny

 

 A bit off topic, but hopefully the OP would be interested in other options as well.

 

How good of a job does Vectorworks do on complex objects such as SSTBs with and without threads, and the associated Simpson hardware in 3D?  Hidden lines as dashed?  Detailed section views of same?

 

Not being contradictory, I would really like to know if or how Vectorworks handels these types of situations.

If you've mainly been used to modeling objects in CA, then what Vectorworks can do in this regard would probably blow your mind.

Vectorworks is designed to be able to model ANYTHING.  Some people use Vectorworks for Mechanical 3D work as well.  Here is a quick video showing all these interactive tools for nearly anything you can think of. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2XBcaVBmb0

Not only that, but there is something call "smart objects" where you can custom create objects and parameters that change....so virtually limitless options. 

Honestly, if you mostly do residential Chief is your best bet - no matter what issues you are having with the rendering.  I own Archicad (an older version), Vectorworks (new), and Chief.  Even though Chief can be frustrating at times, and has limitations for basic modeling, i've yet to find something that comes close to its "tool-sets".  I wish badly that Vectorworks could do more of what Chief does for residential....and I wish Chief would do more what Vectorworks/Archicad does in general modeling and BIM data/docs....not to mention concept work.

In the end I find that Chief edges out the others for what I do most, but I also end up using Vectorworks for lots of concept and small modeling - so you will need another 3D app (Sketchup works too).  My draftsmen don't like Chief due to the fact they haven't mastered its LARGE learning curve.  Clients though LOVE the presentations I create on Chief though.

Its a mixed bag, but if you do a lot of large-scale Commercial then Chief isn't the best solution.

If you make one board (vertical) and convert that to a symbol, you can then place that Symbol and rotate it in any direction using the symbol dbx.  Put 2 of those together to form the "A-Frame" and convert that to a Symbol.

 

Note.  If you carefully create the first board (including a face) you can assign a material to the face so that you have an advertisement.  Building symbols this way out of primitives and other symbols is important because you have much more control of materials and orientation.

In Vectorworks I can set a "Working Plane" to match any angle/plane I want on the fly (or even save those plane views) to then place graphics or text (or anything else, including continuing modeling from that plane) in a snap.    Here is a quick example.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXtZ6mUN5DM

Im not trying to sell people on Vectorworks, but just trying to show how behind CA is in these types of tools IMO.

Here is a video of how fast this is in Vectorworks...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yGCkzr7oiQE

This topic is a good example of why Chief needs updated tool-sets to do basic shape 3D work.

Is it the bay window?  I saw (i think Bill?) do a great video on bay window roofs a while back.  Chief doesn't auto them well since the pitches have to be slightly diff., and you need to add a ridge.  

I will try to find it.

They are correct this is a low res - but you can up-res if you really needed.   Here is a mod for texture...

(added)

I did a basic up-res for this...let me know if this works.

Here in Arizona, my plans go in on 8.5x11 paper. Code enforcement is happy they are not in crayon.

 

No Architect stamps, no seismic issues, no engineering unless there is something way out of the ordinary. 

 

Guess I have it easy.

Really???....  you submit a plan set on letter size paper?  At what scale?  That is amazing to me.

Being able to create working drawings really has nothing to do with "ability" to design your own home/remodel.  The value created in the difference of having a professional (architect or VERY good designer) influence the design, in combination with your goals, pays off greatly in livability and when you go to sell your home. 

Id highly encourage you to NOT simply look for someone that can mechanically create drawings for you, but rather someone to take what you have in mind for a remodel and blend with your existing structure.  Start with that point, and then move to "working drawings" - which may require an engineer.   

All the best.

there is a $95 fee if you let your SSA expire

 

Lew

If upgrades are your only reason to buy SSA (as it is with me now), then however many months past my expiration a new version comes out - compared with my cost per month of SSA - determines if I worry about this fee in relation to keeping "current". 

Ive used both in the past and found the iMacs (top config versions) to be wholly sufficient.  The small increase in performance the Mac Pro gave me didn't seem worthwhile for a 3x price diff.  I do think there are some software apps which make the dual GPU more appreciated, and its highly dependent on the type of jobs you do.  

If you are doing full city blocks or mammoth commercial projects I do think the performance increase by % terms could add up to be worthwhile spending the extra money.   If you are doing single family homes I just dont see a compelling reason to need more than a top end iMac.  In fact, I found the mobility of the iMac very helpful when meeting with clients....as I would bring the whole system with me for presentations.

http://casecruzer.com/apple-imac27/index.html

Now-a-days I use a Lenovo 27" tablet for my presentations with touchscreen (i7 and NVidia card).  Whereas I like the touchscreen of the Lenovo, and the fact it has a battery so if I am at Starbucks or something I dont need to plug-in, I greatly preferred the iMac performance.  

Johnny:

 

for many years the HD product line was sold under the Better Homes and Gardens label

 

then around X1 or X2, CA parted ways and re-labled the HD line as Chief Architect also

 

so someone surfing the internet could easily confuse the HD product line for Chief Premiere

and wonder why someone would recommend it for Professionals

 

Lew

This is exactly correct.  I wonder why the folks at CA don't realize their own brand management issue?  Chief Architect is a great product name, but when they used it for their company name as well - and produced many DIY products and stuck the CA name/logo on it - so there is little understood distinction between the products.

The main reason I overlooked CA for YEARS was the fact I thought this app was the Home-Garden version designed for DIY groups.  I couldn't identify CA brand as a professional one, and the clearly antiquated UI only helped reinforce my pre-conceptions.  CA suffers from an identify crisis (branding management) with professionals.  The best thing CA could do for itself is to re-brand the pro-version app - almost a re-launch to professionals.   ...but yeah, if they want to keep small and unknown and let us benefit from its functionality in residential design....great for us.  The VERY first time I considered CA was when I ran into one of Scotts videos on youtube when i was looking for Sketchup help.  It was on a fairly complex subject, and I was shocked CA was in that league.  However, it took me some time to dispel myself of the pre-conception i had of this product.

To those who compare Revit and other apps to CA - yes, CA is the best overall product for residential.  BUT, if you specialize in commercial its a whole different ball-game. Just because CA has better functionality for residential design doesn't mean CA should stay in the early 90's for its GUI.

I haven't been able to find the viewer app for this.

They call it their "free" version - which does about the same as the CA viewer.  http://lumion3d.com/free/