SH_Canada

Just now, solver said:

 

I changed my interior wall defaults to new layer -- Walls, Interior. This changes a few things about how the program works. 

 

Mostly done so I could easily select only interior walls, or only exterior walls.

I can see why that is a very good idea. I have a few things I want to setup. texting by layer/view, dimension by layer/view. right now I change the text layers manually (or copy from previous plans) and I'm not liking my lack of organization

result as I wanted

Thanks, I think that answers the question of whether people use a pony wall to model it (answer is no, use an interior wall and set the attribute to "foundation wall")

But I notice I have no such wall layer (walls interior) that he has. My interior walls are defaulted to layer "walls normal" for normal walls, and when I click the "foundation wall" attribute, the layer switched to "walls foundation". so back to the same problem

...but this is better option because I can just change this wall to the "walls normal" and everything looks great. i.e. these types of walls are certainly drawn a lot less than foundation walls, so I like this option to change only this wall to a different layer

merci!

Hi all,

For houses with basements there is a need sometimes to have a footing beneath a framed wall within the basement, as it would be a load bearing wall (for instance instead of posts).

I used a pony wall to model this and everything looks good, except that the foundation plan shows the framed wall. This isn't a deal breaker, but it also shows the doors entrances which will be in the framed wall. It looks a bit odd to me as the cribber does not care that there is a framed wall there with two door entries. I tried all of the different display options for the pony wall, but to no avail.

I noticed joey shows his foundation plan this way(with the door openings) in the post:

https://chieftalk.chiefarchitect.com/topic/5291-foundations-plans-and-floors/?tab=comments#comment-46068

Ideally I would like to show the foundation plan "for the cribbers" (which is the footings and exterior concrete walls) without showing framed walls (as these are not done by the cribbers). The only way I can think to do this is to put the normal outside foundation wall on a different layer, lets call it "pure foundation wall layer", and dont show the normal foundation wall layer in my foundation plan. I would then put in my foundation layer set this "pure foundation wall layer". This should then show the outside basement walls (as they have to be cribbed) but it would not show the interior framed wall, but would still show the footing.

My question is, is this what people do(framed wall in a basement on a different layer than the outside foundation wall), or do they do as joey shows, or something else? Are people using pony walls for this setup?

below is what I initially did with the pony wall and looks similar to joey's setup. Both walls are on the same layer. Notice the two door breaks in the wall

Thanks

Jason

On 12/26/2019 at 3:12 PM, Joe_Carrick said:

When a Header is created by Chief it generally will be according to the size required by the opening width.  However, if the wall is too short to provide the required depth between the top plates and the top of the opening then Chief reduces the Header depth. 

 

IMO the software should instead do one of the following:

1. Show an error condition so that the user could take appropriate action (Preferred Option)
2. Lower the "Top of the Opening" by whatever distance is needed to provide the correct header depth.

Either of the above would be IMO preferable to just reducing the Header depth.

 

What do you think should be done by the software?

Back at the original request, I think they could add a header check to the Tools-Check->Plan check

Right now I go into the wall detail, check the size of the header and compare to the schedule (After I go look up the label to remember which one it was). Not the most efficient

1 hour ago, Chrisb222 said:

Not me. We always use 7/16" sheathing and plans are dimensioned as the exterior wall being 4" or 6"

I like this solution as then there is only 1/4" actual difference, and that will get absorbed somewhere. even if it was the bathroom and the framer framed at 59-3/4", I think the tubs here are 59 3/4, so it would just fit. 

We have a min R value requirement up here for roofs. I think its up to around R50 now. So the heel can get quite tall. If someone was building their own and wanted to do fiberglass batt, R50 would be about 15" plus air gap, so at least 16" tall. so for a 5:12 roof with 18" eave and 2x6 fascia, it would only come down around 13" (of course one could cheat the Rvalue above the top plate as it had been done for decades) So trusses would need to be shortened to be inside the sheathing. Plus for ridge beam plus half trusses, the height is typically at least 16"

5 minutes ago, LevisL said:

 

The one thing I found you have to watch for... the truss designers will sometimes assume the sheathing will be flush and they subtract 3/4" from the truss span...

yes when I did an outbuilding on my own property, the truss guys asked that very question. Is it flush to the stud or flush to the sheathing and what is that dimension. I said to him, wouldn't everyone want it flush to the stud so when they sheath the heel (heels here are high in order to get more insulation in) it would be flush with the wall. He said no some want it to the sheathing, but he did not no why. I'm now guessing the interpretation of the plans he gets are the same problem as this post. He does not know where the actual stud is landing.

...But at least he asked.

23 minutes ago, robdyck said:

This is best to note near the beginning of a plan set in your general notes. In Medicine Hat for example, no one frames to the sheathing, but go an hour north, and no one seems to have ever heard of measuring to the stud. So, when I know the regional preference, I make sure to note this in my General Notes.

I assume then you are dimensioning to the stud for both,   and the stud dimensions equal the foundation, so that the dimensions are cleaner, then in your general notes you indicate it is to the stud? I'm curious do you also note that if they are aligning the sheathing to the foundation, that the framer should take it out of any room but the bathroom?

Or do you actually change your dimensioning and general notes between the two scenarios?

33 minutes ago, kMoquin said:

The convention here (northeast US) is to align framing and foundation with the sheathing and siding overhanging.

that from what I can tell is the cleanest solution. I actually went around and checked here, and was surprised to see they were not overlapping. Which is why I started thinking about it. Not that I have seen a lot of other plans, but I've never seen dimensions on plans to the eight for the first or last wall in the room that I can remember. So I'm pretty sure the framer "just knows" to take it off "a" room, just not a bathroom

9 minutes ago, GeneDavis said:

Where is finished grade?  

finished grade is typically at least one foot below the bottom of the 2x6.

The basement top of concrete wall is typically then at least 17" above grade. The reason is snow here. We try and keep snow away form the wood.

So if you are doing some math, we typically always have at least three risers here for front steps

sill plate "gasket" for moisture:

https://www.rona.ca/en/sill-plate-gasket-5-1-2-x-75-white-35475079

11 minutes ago, GeneDavis said:

Is this the "ladder," i.e. embedded pressure treated 2x6s?  Lotta lumber.

close instead of side by side one is inside, one is outside. 5" of concrete in the middle

Its also not pressure treated, just regular 2x6. Which is interesting when you think about it. Apparently it is an "Alberta" thing. A cribber from Ontario told me they dont do it like that there.

but it does make for a nice even finish when the cribbers are done

15 minutes ago, parkwest said:

Can you post that wall detail, please?

here is a picture of my garage wall looking down, where I have about 15" of the concrete wall coming out of the ground. you can see the 2x6 on edge

As well here they put a membrane beneath the sill plate for moisture

3 minutes ago, parkwest said:

How do you isolate your sheathing from being in contact with the concrete foundation?  What keeps the sheathing from absorbing moisture from the concrete and eventually rotting?

They run "ladders" below the bottom plate here. Rather ingenious idea to get a flat concrete wall

Ladders are comprised of 2x6 on edge which are put into the concrete forms for basement walls. for 8" concrete wall, actual concete for last 5.5" is only 5" wide. think of it as ICF as the last block, but wood

But in thinking about it, even if there were not ladders,  I think they keep the sheeting off the bottom so the 8' sheathing will cover more of the top top plate as typically here a 8' wall is studded to 97-1/8

Sosnestor:

Your two "Adjustment" rooms show as 7-5-1/8 and 4-5-1/8. 

I'm wondering, is this what everyone does on their plans?

Thanks

sorry getting used to the notification bell and messages up top.

This is X6

8 minutes ago, GeneDavis said:

Foundations built to eighths and sixteenths are never gonna happen.

 

The foundation is typically to the foot or inch here

It is the framer which would have to do the math when he frames if one gives stud to stud dimensions which matched the foundation wall. as he would have to take out the 3/8s for each side when he frames the wall, if he aligns the sheathing to the foundation

Joey has the explicit solution which lines up nicely because he is using 7/16 sheathing:

"I have one builder that does their slabs to the outside of the sheathing. My wall set up for them is 3-1/2" stud, 7/16" OSB. 1/16" Houswrap, set the foundation to build to the housewrap. Exterior of a 50'w home is 49'-11"

we use 3/8s here. I suppose I could put the housewrap at an eight instead of a 16th and that would get me to the 1" overall reduction

So my next question is, does everyone specify this detail in their comments or via a CAD detail. i.e. how does the framer know for a 50' foundation if the main floor sheathing is proud or not proud of the foundation? and if you do show a CAD detail with it in alignment, are your dimensions matching this detail?

And if you do have the plans  as proud of the foundation, do you know if it actually gets framed that way? I suppose in theory it should not matter to the designer as it would not be executing per design, but if everyone is framing with the sheathing in alignment, I would almost think at some point the drawing dimensions would change to follow the framing convention. or maybe no one want to see the eights or dimensions different from foundation so everyone just "knows"

I'm curious to know what framers/designers do in different areas

thanks, is that what everyone(i.e. yourselves) does? because if everyone did, then at lease one room dimension would be into the eights to account for it. take the simple case of wanting the first room to be 10' stud to stud (9'11") finished.

would your outside dimension to the first stud show 3/8+5-1/2+10', which is 10'5-7/8"?

hi,

I noticed that CA dimensions to the stud. In order to get the same dimensions for the foundation and the main floor CA offsets the sheathing such that it is proud of the foundation. (If you "build foundation" and then set the reference plan and zoom in you can see the sheathing is not on top of the foundation)

I realize it can also dimension to the finished wall, which would be the siding, but no one around here offsets the studs by both the sheathing and the siding

Framers around here align the sheathing to the outside of the foundation. So what this means is if the dimensions on the plan are stud to stud and match the foundation dimensions, then the framer has to "take out" 3/8" times 2 on an outside wall, and they need to take it from somewhere. I would assume they would take this out of the nearest room, or maybe at the end when they realize the dimensions do not match. This would be all fine and dandy as long as they did not take it out of a 5 by 8 bathroom, where the tub requires 60" to the framed wall. So is the framer knowledgeable enough to know, hey I need to take this 3/4" out of some other room?

Is this one of those things that no one actually states anywhere, but occurs everywhere, and framers are just cursing the designers, but not curse too much as they measure from the stud when they frame the wall? i.e. it would be easier for them to frame to whole inches for the most part, and simply leave the last room as it ends up being (assuming there is no bathroom problem)

I was thinking I have never seen plans where outside dimensions to the first inside wall are down to the 3/8". If people were to start dimensioning to the sheathing, it would then cause some pretty ugly dimensions

Thanks

did you find a way to do this.  I'm always changing bathroom and closet font sizes. I looked in defaults but there is only one. It would be nice if there was a default for each room

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