mark2457

Hi All

Just starting with Pro 2020 

Drawn most of house with gable roof with gables at front and back. need to add 4 -season porch with "half gable" roof, not sure what correct name is, but it's perpendicular to other roof (see attached image).

Can't figure out how to do it.

I need to set the height of the porch walls (can;t figure that out either) and then need to root to intersect with the wall. 

Can anyone point me in the right direction?

My plan is attached.Plan1.plan

Thanks

Mark

Thanks Ray. I think that'll work

Hi All

Looking for a material like LP SmartSide

http://www.menards.com/main/building-materials/siding/ppg-prefinished-siding/ppg-prefinished-engineered-wood/lp-smartside-3-8-x-4-x-9-premium-prefinished-8-oc-groove-engineered-t/p-2238339.htm

Anyone know if there's anything similar available?

Thanks

mark

Mark:

 

I don't have that program so I am not sure if what you are asking is exactly the same as what X7 premier has in its' dbx.  I suspect that they may be the same or very similar.  Here's the two dbx's that are used in X7:

 

RoofTrussDbx.JPG     RoofFramingDbx.JPG

 

In X7, it appears to me that Chief will build with lookouts even if there is no reduced gable specified or no lookouts specified.  In the image below, this is what X7 generates with the lookouts box unchecked, max. lookout spacing set for 24" and with a standard gable truss.  Note that the "in plane" spacing of the non-lookout lookouts is 40".  Why Chief didn't just generate blocking between the truss and the barge rafter at 24" C.C. is beyond me ... and generate them on edge like I asked them to be.  [For the roof framing shown below, I did in fact uncheck "Lookouts" but Chief put them in (from the barge to the 1st inboard truss) but Chief built them anyway]

 

GableRoofFramingXSec.JPG

 

So, to summarize, there can be several improvements made to the way Chief X7 Premier does its roof framing IMO.  When I get time, I will submit my ideas on some improvements that I would like to see on the Suggestion forum.

Agreed. Certainly looks odd

Mark and Curt,

 

What is essentially being done in my suggestion is stick framing a dropped gable end (the notching being rather incidental). All of the loading on the lookouts will be on the rafter that is sistered to the inside of the truss (and carried to the wall plates), and to some extent on gable truss studding, which remains fully intact.

 

But good luck either way!

Thanks Mickey

Sounds OK, but I did manage to get a quote from a dropped gable (so I think I'm all set)

I don't believe truss top chords should be notched so never show that on the plans I prepare.  I know that some builders will notch gable truss top chords but I have never seen any gable trusses designed for this practice.  Maybe its OK ... ???   Maybe it's a carry-over from framed roofs where the gable rafter is notched for outriggers?  Maybe it is something that the building inspectors are missing or turning their heads on .... ???

 

If I have gable overhangs of 12" or less and there's no extreme snow loads to worry about, I do as Robert suggested ... just show blocking [on edge ... not 'flat'] between the gable truss top chord and the barge rafter as shown below.

 

CAGableFrmgStdGableTruss-Edited.JPG

 

In the above image, I had to edit the positions, dimensions and end locations of Chief generated "flat" lookouts.  I do this in both a back clipped section and in plan view.

 

If I am doing gable overhangs greater than 12", then I drop the gable truss tops the depth of the truss top chord, and then edit the Chief generated lookouts as needed similar to what I did above.  Like the trusses, I put the blocking or lookouts on 24" C.C.  Here's one with a 24" gable overhang, 2x4 lookouts 24" C.C. and with the reduced gable truss top chord edited to match the bottoms of the 2x4 lookouts. 

 

CAGableFrmgReducedGableTruss-Edited.JPG

 

The typical Chief generated lookouts and reduced gable is shown unedited on the opposite end (right side).  I wish Chief would build these darn things according to the way we plug the dimensions into the roof framing defaults.  I need to put that in the suggestion box.

Thanks. I agree about the notching.

There's nothing in spec for the trusses I got quoted about notching, so i wouldn't do it and risk failing an inspection (even if structurally sound).

When I added the trusses there was an option to drop the end for lookouts and it put the lookouts in (I'm using HDPro10). Is that what you were referring to, or something else missing?

You can build an over-hanging rake without a dropped-top-chord end truss, but I would not go over 1 foot. A continuous subfascia and the sheathing will help support the barge rafter; use lookouts as well. I'm not necessarily recommending this approach, but it's done. I would also consider the pitch of the roof and the anticipated snow load in Chicago.

Thanks. I just got a quote from midwest manufacturing (Menards' supplier)

I looked up Chicago span tables and they had 4/12 listed. They have a load factor (which is 1.0 for under 30-degrees) for snow load. Having dinner with an architect friend on Thursday and will ask him what local snow load requirement is. Max ridge height I can have is 15' and wanted 10' ceiling. If I have to, I could drop to 9' walls and 5/12 pitch. I'm also waiting on quote on scissor trusses, which would give me the ceiling height I want in the middle (without needing 10' walls)

thanks again

Mark

Hi Guys

Was looking at stock trusses (24' 4/12 24" OC). My local Menards carries these, but the end truss is same height as common trusses. They don't seem to have a stock dropped gable end (I know I could get one custom made).

I was planning on at least a 1 foot overhang (maybe 2'). Is there a way to do this without notching the top chord (probably not a good idea ) or just nailing the fly rafter to the sheathing (i know some people do that, but I'm not sure it's a good idea).

Only way I can imagine doing it (with stock trusses) is reducing height of end wall to give me the clearance for the lookouts and then build it up where required

Any other suggestions

Regards

Mark

If you are on a tight budget look into O.V.E. framing. Optimum Value Engineering. It will save about 30% of the framing material budget. Also, with 9' plate you can get plywood in 4'x9' or 4'x10' sheets at a lumber yard.

Thanks for suggestions Alan

I priced out lumber for hand cut rafters and roof trusses. Trusses were 40% cheaper, so re-did plan (attached) with them.

Slab still looks like I'll need a monster truck to get in. 

Garage Slab and Trusses - pitch 4-12.plan

Thanks Mick

Priced it out with hand cut rafters and was about 40% more (in raw materials). Was thinking about going with 16" OC as I'll have a lot of wall storage and shelves.

Good idea on double studs at sheet joints

Thanks for tip

Was just pricing out trusses for 24'x24' at Menards. Came out:

2 x End truss @ $76.49

Double bottom plate on a block stem wall used to be a bug in the program, not sure if it still exists, but it can be fixed, I just forgot how. You may have to bring up a wall detail of each wall delete the bottom extra plate and use retain wall framing.

Thanks Perry

My two cents;

 

Double plate isn't necessary but a nice added feature if your going to drywall or you have to do blocking. If your budget is tight you can save 40 or 50 bucks by not putting it in. Also its a little more labor so I don't include the extra bottom plate unless the customer wants it. I work mostly for people with average to low incomes so I keep things tight as long as the quality doesn't drop two much.

Thanks Joey

More than happy to skip it and save on cash. But not sure how else to get siding 6" above grade (without a big gap :-))

Usually I would use a treated 2x6 on the concrete/block and then build a 2x4 wall on that. SO in effect I would

have a double bottom plate. Haven't done one in a long time.

Thanks Dennis!

Some weirdness going on in your plan , but the 2x6 double bottom plate is there as you spec'd it in the Foundation defaults (sill) instead of a 2x4 to go with the 2x4 walls.

 

I see a concrete footing and wall in perspective view , but display options says there is no Foundation to display and in framing overview it is totally gone , you can make the floor slab show by checking the Floor surfaces display layer................

                                                                                              ok found it , you have Walls>Foundation Turned off in the Display options (along with the floor surface for the 3D view)

 

your Foundation wall is only 4" wide , typically a 8" foundation wall is required, but I thought you said the Pour had to be Monolithic?  do they mean a monolithic Slab on Grade (raft foundation) which doesn't usually require a Curb or do they still want a Curb? on the Slab as well.

Thanks. Not sure how I ended up specing double bottom plate. I'll have to check with village once I close on property (few weeks). Village says following in it's requirements:

1. 5" concrete slab on 4" gravel/stone base
2. Monolithic pour with 10"x20" perimeter grade beam all four sides
3. Siding 6" above grade, brick to be 4" above grade.

I was hoping to have the foundation wall to meet requirement no 3 above. If I don't/can't then I've either got to make the slab 4 1/2-inches above grade with a single bottom plate, or 3" above grade with a double bottom plate, or am I mis-interpreting something (highly probable)

played around with your plan in 10 and fixed things up ,I think? but you'll need to check the specs as I don't know your real heights etc

 

did you by chance place your garage doors and windows etc BEFORE you made it a Garage Room  and built the foundation ? in older versions it is always good to build the walls>roof>foundation and get all the structure right ,then start Detailing....windows/doors/stairs etc.

 

M.

 

Garage Doors and Windows_V10_Pro.plan

Thanks Mick

Yes I did do doors and windows first. Thanks for tip. Will take a look at plan you attached this eve.

Thanks again

Mark

if you change the Header Measurement on the Framing DBX for 2x12 to 95" both garage doors will get 2x12 , you can't simulate the 1/2"ply in between but you could make the Headers 1 3/4" each same as An LVL or Microlam Beam.

 

Haven't looked at the plan yet.

Thanks Mick. Will give the a try

You are WAY over your head structurally. (2x6 rafter for up to 24' span? I don't think so. Sizing the ridge board to be one size larger than the rafters doesn't work without intermediate supports, which you don't have.)

 

Collar ties are unnecessary if you have ceiling joists (nailed properly to rafters), and as Wendy says, don't do anything unless they are in the lower third of the rafter. If you are using them just to tie the rafters together to keep from separating at the ridge, then straps are easier. Consult a structural engineer, as Wendy suggests.

Thanks Richard

i have a buddy who's an architect (having dinner with him this week). He'll do all the calcs for me, but not drawing. Right now I'm just trying to visualize a design and then update the structural stuff based on his calcs. I'm also want to price out cost of raw materials if I buy them vs. buying one of the available kits from Menards/Lumber84, etc. 

Ultimately will need to decide whether to have plans professionally drawn (what would it cost?) or just buy some off the shelf plans if I can find something close to what I want.

Main thing I want that's out of the ordinary is 9ft walls (so I can handle an 8x4 sheetgoods and 8' 2x's easily). Village limits me to 15' ridge height. Based on this and my dodgy calculations, I came up with out 5" rise for each 12"

Thanks for the heads up. 

Regards

mark

RE: tieing the roof, semi-vaulting, etc:

 

Myth - you can tie if you are 1/3 from the top of the rafters.  So if your 10 ft ceiling on 8 ft walls works depends on your roof pitch.

Truth - to tie the roof you have to be 1/3 from the bottom of the rafters, or lower.  And, you are allowed less rafter length.  Crack the code book and look for the slope adjustment factor.  Or better yet, buy yourself about 2 hours of an engineer's time and make sure your spanky new garage doesn't sag on you! 

Thanks. Got a buddy who's an architect. He'll do the calc's for me (but not plans: doesn't do residential)

What kind of siding do you have?  If it's vinyl you may want to up the wall sheathing thickness.  It's a garage so you probably won't mind a few ripples if it's your own.

 

 Check your roof sheathing.  The stuff we use around here can't span 24"  with just 1/2".  We use 5/8" (or 19/32") with plywood clips. 

 

 You probably don't need flitch plates for your header if it's just an 8' span with 12' of tributary load unless you have a high snow load there or a floor above?

I was thinking of using called SmartPanel (they sell at Menards). Like harde board from what I can tell, but comes in 8x4 sheets. Uses some on an outdoor kitchen island once. Worked great

Thanks for tip on sheathing

I agree on the flitch plate, but village requires it. Seems way overkill.

OK.  I think I have the foundation and stem wall OK now. the garage is floating though and I'm not sure why. Images and project attached.

The framing vie also shows a double sill plate (or something like that)

Garage Doors and Windows.plan

Hi Guys

Using HDPro 10. Designing a garage. Village requires headers over doors to be double 2x12 with 1/2 flitch late. how can I build such a header? Can i build it so it's selectable in the header materials for auto framing?

Thanks'

Mark

Figured it out. Deleted framing and rebuilt and entered 24' OC and it worked

Hi Guys

Designing garage and need 24 OC studs Default was set to 16 OC. I've changed default and can't for the life of me get it to rebuild. 

In Build Framing Dialog I have everything checked (see attached)

What do I need to do to have it change to 24 OC

Thanks

Mark

Thanks Guys