Sill Plate wont move for OSB


DeLayDesign
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Go to solution Solved by SNestor,

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This is what I need (which is how Chief's American Causal Template comes)

 

image.thumb.png.99b476a9c35ce6821f8dc88e1dab8473.png

 

image.thumb.png.9c6a969fbc85235476be5223bbbe3061.png

 

This is what I'm getting. (Notice the sill not moving over for the OSB.

image.thumb.png.ea27cde663e8f8660ddeb79aefe524b4.png

 

image.thumb.png.9515c3bdc6c3ae05d216e58298159fd6.png

I've checked both the American Casual Wall structure and my wall structure for my template and they are identical with the exception of thicknesses of products.

Any suggestions?

 

 

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Template Adjustments.plan



It isn't so much a plan as it is me trying to fix issues our Architecture department has been ignoring for along while.  We plan to move to X13 as a whole next week and I want to get the template fixed long before that.

 

I've attached the simple template file.  I appreciate your help.  These are legacy files brought up from X9.  I'm really hoping I don't have to rebuild all the wall types we've already established.

Template Adjustments.plan

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9 minutes ago, rgardner said:

Let me give this a shot:

 

 

image.thumb.png.864f90ebba13c477a67d6ce7cb61cc0d.png

 

Wall Type 1:

image.thumb.png.1ec8bc62df14c21d84bfc68fc6ed02f8.png

 

Wall Type 2:

image.thumb.png.27f49467071db92b6bab5687797ddfcf.png

 

Thanks @rgardnerbut unfortunately both walls types you show are not correct... for us anyway.

The new Architect want the plywood exterior face to line up with the exterior of the concrete, which I've been able to do... but if you look at my sill plate, it won't move over for the OSB. Chief's default wall type from another template seems to work fine, but for our custom template we've worked with for years it doesn't want to allow the OSB to sit on the concrete.

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I like my floorplan perimeter dimensions and the aligned foundation under, laid out in whole inches no fractions however possible.

 

The framing sub and foundation builder expect this, and rightly so.


Someone anal about detail might demand that sheathing face align to foundation, but the alignment gets blown by whatever cladding scheme is used.  And particularly so when rainscreening happens.

 

So why, exactly, is this done?

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1 hour ago, DeLayDesign said:

These are legacy files brought up from X9.  I'm really hoping I don't have to rebuild

 

You may not like to hear this but personally I have found some issues with using old Templates/plans in X13, (eg dimensioning) so have bitten the Bullet and am rebuilding both mine and my Clients Templates off the Chief x13 Residential Template supplied  (this is and has always been Chief's suggested course of action for each new version , there is a bit more info in the Migration Guide in your digital Locker).

 

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4 hours ago, scottharris said:

In the wall type, you have a -1/2” for the foundation offset.  If you change that to 0” the sheathing should build the way you want.  After making the change in the wall, rebuild your foundation.

found.jpg

True.  The offset matches the thickness of 1/2" OSB, which matches how Chief does it in their default templates.  

If I take the offset off, it will push the wall our the 1/2" not aligning the OSB with the footing below.

I think I may have to do as other have suggested and just rebuild everything :(

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5 hours ago, DeLayDesign said:

I think I may have to do as other have suggested and just rebuild everything :(

 

 the -7/16 in your OP works for me in a X13 OOB Template Plan , so I am not sure what is up with your current Template... test it for yourself perhaps....

 

image.thumb.png.0b108b808c0d3a7e6db83ed031209cab.png

 

 

 

*** I should of mentioned that like Ryan below that method works for me too...

 

 

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image.thumb.png.412cea8b820eb1de4168658a369ed112.png

 

9 hours ago, DeLayDesign said:

The new Architect want the plywood exterior face to line up with the exterior of the concrete, which I've been able to do... but if you look at my sill plate, it won't move over for the OSB. Chief's default wall type from another template seems to work fine, but for our custom template we've worked with for years it doesn't want to allow the OSB to sit on the concrete.

This is actually with my old template that is brought forth from x12.  Still refining my new x13 template.  It works just fine without offsetting foundation if you build the foundation to the exterior layer of the sheathing.

 

image.thumb.png.951983d08227a51047f8f57f8739e2fd.png

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17 hours ago, rgardner said:

image.thumb.png.412cea8b820eb1de4168658a369ed112.png

 

This is actually with my old template that is brought forth from x12.  Still refining my new x13 template.  It works just fine without offsetting foundation if you build the foundation to the exterior layer of the sheathing.

 

image.thumb.png.951983d08227a51047f8f57f8739e2fd.png

Strange.

It honestly won't work for me that way, which is why I ended up trying to negative offset like Chief has in their template file.  Below is what I get by changing it back so the foundation aligns with the osb with no negative offset.

(nothing changes)

image.thumb.png.5ecc4c588eabfebc8e900dcf19d5db0b.png
 

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13 minutes ago, DeLayDesign said:

Strange.

It honestly won't work for me that way, which is why I ended up trying to negative offset like Chief has in their template file.  Below is what I get by changing it back so the foundation aligns with the osb with no negative offset.

(nothing changes)

image.thumb.png.5ecc4c588eabfebc8e900dcf19d5db0b.png
 

 

On 9/12/2021 at 10:45 AM, scottharris said:

After making the change in the wall, rebuild your foundation.

I have a hunch what Scott says here is possibly your problem???

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13 minutes ago, DeLayDesign said:

Strange.

It honestly won't work for me that way, which is why I ended up trying to negative offset like Chief has in their template file.  Below is what I get by changing it back so the foundation aligns with the osb with no negative offset.

(nothing changes)


 

 

Did you rebuild the foundation?

 

Here is a X13 test plan with the right side using the FDN to OSB layer and the Left Side using the  -7/16 method.

 

OSB Flush to FDN.plan

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Good catch Steve , I never noticed the Wall above was 2x4 as we have to use 2x6 locally.

 

I would call this a bug myself the mudsill should always be flush to the outside of the foundation wall, no matter it's width.

 

I can see now why Adam doesn't want to have to rebuild his Walls for a new Template ....that is a lot of walls......

but with the Changes to Framing in X13 they will need to be updated so the Main Layer is set as a Framing Layer,

as you showed.

 

M.

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3 minutes ago, Kbird1 said:

I would call this a bug myself the mudsill should always be flush to the outside of the foundation wall, no matter it's width.

M.

 

Yes...I agree, the plate should not center on the wall above...it should align with the edge of the foundation wall. Especially since you specify the size of the plate in the foundation wall specification dialogue. 

 

It should...but, it doesn't work that way and hasn't for as long as I've used the program.

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14 minutes ago, SNestor said:

 

Yes...I agree, the plate should not center on the wall above...it should align with the edge of the foundation wall. Especially since you specify the size of the plate in the foundation wall specification dialogue. 

 

It should...but, it doesn't work that way and hasn't for as long as I've used the program.

 

I believe you are right , and I think I used to just use a CAD Box over the Sheathing layer in C/S's back when we could have 2x4 ext. walls,

same as I extend the Auto-Detail box for the Siding down 1 1/2" as well since Chief can't do it auto.

 

image.thumb.png.0cf485f8b039854ac9be5a9fae388b8b.png

 

M.

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@Kbird1 - yes, modifying the auto detail fill works for sections…but if you size the foundation plate too large it could stick through the wall and depending on layer settings the plate might appear through the siding in an elevation or 3D view. 
 

A good practice is to define the foundation wall plate the size of the wall above so the 3D model builds correctly - and then make mods to any wall sections. 

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1 hour ago, SNestor said:

@DeLayDesign - See video for explanation of how to build your foundation to the OSB layer. The answer is related to the plate width defined in your foundation wall default.

 

Adam Delay - Building Foundation to OSB Layer - Watch Video

73de888ffd7244c2bd320345f7e1ee44-with-play.gif

Awesome.  Thank you for taking the time to do this!  It was very helpful.  I felt inclined to leave comments for you, but everything you said was spot on.

 

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41 minutes ago, SNestor said:

@Kbird1 - yes, modifying the auto detail fill works for sections…but if you size the foundation plate too large it could stick through the wall and depending on layer settings the plate might appear through the siding in an elevation or 3D view. 
 

A good practice is to define the foundation wall plate the size of the wall above so the 3D model builds correctly - and then make mods to any wall sections. 

 

I agree of course, and I guess do that without thinking, but I would just use a Cross Box in CS if I needed to show a wider sill plate since it is about the only time you will see a Sill Plate.

 

M.

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@Kbird1  @DeLayDesign

 

If you specify that the foundation builds to "fir framing"...basically the outer edge of the main layer of your exterior wall...then, you can change the size of the foundation plate up to the width of the foundation wall. 

 

For instance, you can specify a 2x8 foundation plate and use a 2x4 exterior wall...if you specify that the foundation builds to "fir framing". However, if you specify a 2x10 inch foundation plate...the 2x10 will center itself on the main layer of your exterior wall. The foundation plate works great as long as it's not wider than the foundation wall itself....and if you specify that the foundation builds to the "fir framing" layer of your exterior wall. 

 

Chief is crazy... 

2021-09-13_17-53-25.thumb.png.de5cdf19495192093a2922ca0d6783bc.png 2021-09-13_17-54-01.thumb.png.886e55a35abe42b541b67e5d84a477e6.png 

 

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4 hours ago, SNestor said:

@Kbird1  @DeLayDesign

 

If you specify that the foundation builds to "fir framing"...basically the outer edge of the main layer of your exterior wall...then, you can change the size of the foundation plate up to the width of the foundation wall. 

 

For instance, you can specify a 2x8 foundation plate and use a 2x4 exterior wall...if you specify that the foundation builds to "fir framing". However, if you specify a 2x10 inch foundation plate...the 2x10 will center itself on the main layer of your exterior wall. The foundation plate works great as long as it's not wider than the foundation wall itself....and if you specify that the foundation builds to the "fir framing" layer of your exterior wall. 

 

Chief is crazy... 

 

 

 

Good to know!  I'll have to give this a try.  I do notice the OSB isn't inline with the foundation though... I wonder if offsetting it the negative osb thickness if it'll push my sill plate over.  I'm thinking no, but maybe.

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