HumbleChief

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Its the age old dilemma of a software company. 

- marketing wants new features to gain market share 

- power users just want them to fix what features they already have. 

- company has limited programmers and must decide which fire to throw them in.

 

...guess which way they go? - every year

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I think the above comment is spot on.   While some of the "features" may not seem like big deals, heck...program functionality is most important to guys using the software to work daily.

 

Even just the improvement in undo-redo, would be a BIG one for me.   While not looking "sexy" on paper, a revamp of internal program optimization would be well worth it even if there were no "flashy" new gizmos.   Think about the 1000's of pauses every day we wait on (even with very fast computers).   If they start optimizing what they already have, that sounds pretty good to me.

 

I agree on stairs....and am always hopeful.   Wish they could be edited like roof planes (to break them and move the treads in and out instead of trying to get the fussy winders to work with invisible walls and room dividers) 

 

I am hopeful...and fingers crossed.

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Part of the reason that Chief won't give a complete list of the new tools is that it is still in testing and Chief doesn't want to get everyone excited with a new tool that just (for lots of reasons)doesn't make it to the final release. I've seen it.

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All good points and I think a strategy of low expectations is the wisest for me personally. I think it's the folks that think that Chief should be a different type of program and do things in ways they never have, nor never intend to do in the future, that may be the most disappointed.

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27 minutes ago, VisualDandD said:

I think the above comment is spot on.   While some of the "features" may not seem like big deals, heck...program functionality is most important to guys using the software to work daily.

 

Even just the improvement in undo-redo, would be a BIG one for me.   While not looking "sexy" on paper, a revamp of internal program optimization would be well worth it even if there were no "flashy" new gizmos.   Think about the 1000's of pauses every day we wait on (even with very fast computers).   If they start optimizing what they already have, that sounds pretty good to me.

 

I agree on stairs....and am always hopeful.   Wish they could be edited like roof planes (to break them and move the treads in and out instead of trying to get the fussy winders to work with invisible walls and room dividers) 

 

I am hopeful...and fingers crossed.

I agree with the internal optimization upgrades. Those invisible improvements can be the biggest productivity boosters of all.

 

I use stairs differently than others as I don't have too many problems with them but any improvement in any portion of the program I am all for.

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15 hours ago, lbuttery said:

Been here over 10 years and have seen most every post and just haven't seen what you're talking about Lew

 

Larry:

 

seriously ???

 

I've been here since 2005

 

time and again :

"why is CA so closed mouth" 

"why won't CA give us some hints"

"does anybody know what's going to be in the next release"

"I don't want to renew my SSA then be blindsided"

"unless I don't know what's coming..."

 

etc etc etc

 

Lew

Yeah Lew I've seen those few posts but I am just not seeing the same cacophony of those posts worthy of stating "everyone complains" about such things. They just seem like valid, occasional, questions that are raised now and again. I expect we'll see the same thing when X9 is released but I'll reserve judgement for now, download it when it comes on line, and get back to work.

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There have been several comments about Stairs needing a complete redo.  IMO those statements are so vague that CA couldn't possibly know what you want.

 

It would be helpful if there was a list of specific things that aren't available or don't work as desired - along with exact descriptions of how they should work.  CA may have done some work on these things in X9 and maybe they didn't.  In my experience, specifics are much more likely to get results than vague comments.

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This issue(s) have been well documented. I send them to support, I have posted as nausium with examples of issues, yet....

 

Simple straight run staircase that needs for the rail to dead end into the wall. Using the "winder" method, and following the instructions/video from Chief.

stairs.png

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4 minutes ago, joey_martin said:

This issue(s) have been well documented. I send them to support, I have posted as nausium with examples of issues, yet....

 

Simple straight run staircase that needs for the rail to dead end into the wall. Using the "winder" method, and following the instructions/video from Chief.

stairs.png

Yep....my biggest gripe with stairs is where they have to go from inside to outside of a wall.


The winder tool is just WAY too finiky.  Sometimes it displays right in 2d and not 3d and at other times the other way around.   If you use "landings" to make the transition, they skirt board breaks and does not look right as does the handrail.   It is a major pain and getting stairs RIGHT can take way more time than worth.   I will often just draw 2d cad to show it if I can get away with it.

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2 minutes ago, joey_martin said:

This issue(s) have been well documented. I send them to support, I have posted as nausium with examples of issues, yet....

 

Simple straight run staircase that needs for the rail to dead end into the wall. Using the "winder" method, and following the instructions/video from Chief.

stairs.png

 

Joey's stair is such a mess,  I am not sure if I could recreate the mess he has.  But I bet I could come up with my own mess.  I agree with Joey,  stairs are not easy to work with.  However I will not abandon the program ....  if I did,  I would probably be jumping into another programs mess.

 

I wish CA would post pictures of all the different stair configurations they can build,  (without a huge workaround),  and then show us how they did it via a video.  

 

Here is a question......  how many CA vids have you seen that show how to build the many different stair configurations?  

 

Let me be specific,  see attached pic.......  95% of my stairs look like this.....  a handrail on a short framed pony wall........  I can do this..... but it ain't easy.  It  would be super if CA wold do a video on how THEY WOULD TO IT,  I have already done a video on how I do it  (not easy).  And here is the kicker.....  if CA can build it,  can they control the height of that pony wall above stair nosing easily?  When we build these things what must be kept in mind is can we control all parameters of the build.

 

 

423_2Axxys.jpg

 

 

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Here is a question....

Why can't we draw a straight set of stairs...

and then put breaks in each side of stairs and shape it with arcs and splines...  whilst the steps conform to the perimeter shape of stairs....

and why can't we define the minimum stair tread depth at a point a give distance from the edge  (for curved stairs..

and then select a line segment of the stairs and define the rail configuration,  whether it be open or whether it has a FRAMED PONY wall adjacent...

and then why can't we define what kind of rail is on top of that segment

and then why can't we define how many EQUIDISTANT stringers we have in that segment with the size of the stringers...

 

I have never been able to have FULL CONTROL OF FLARED STAIRS.....  I fake it....  this is stupid.....  everybody complains about it,  let's fix it...

 

Here is a challenge to  CA,  put on a workshop and be able prepared to show how you can build a set of stairs based on your client's(me) requirements.  We have to do this all of the time with our clients....

 

I understand CA is working hard trying to make the stair building process better,  however I think they may be taking the wrong approach because we are still complaining.  

 

Final note,  I do think it is a difficult task,  but I bet those guys at CA can figure it  out.

 

 

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I was wondering, is there a program out there that does stairs 'right'? I'm going to google a bit to see what I can find. Here's a couple of Archicad options. Looks flexible on the one hand but limited on the other. The ability to trim to walls seems like tool we could use in Chief.

 

And a bunch of Revit Videos

 

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=stairs+in+revit

 

 

 

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11 minutes ago, HumbleChief said:

I was wondering, is there a program out there that does stairs 'right'? I'm going to google a bit to see what I can find.

I don't know if you'll find a program that does stairs right, but I can guarantee you that you'll find the said program's user group complaining about how stairs work. 

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4 minutes ago, michaelgia said:

I don't know if you'll find a program that does stairs right, but I can guarantee you that you'll find the said program's user group complaining about how stairs work. 

Probably very true. I watched a couple of videos but none showed the problems that a user might run into as defined here on the forum re: Chief. Wasn't X8 the update that had the most stair changes just recently? Perhaps that was all the changes intended for a couple more releases?

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In the past CA have always released teasers to the best upgrades, I can't look at Facebook so still in the dark anyway.

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So far I'm not really impressed. I'm waiting for simple callout changes with arrows and a foot attached . If they can't do that simple thing . Then game over . Ssa will not be renewed. I'm not really concerned with any new bling . Things are speeding up in the industry again . CDs need to be produced faster. If I have to draw and fake my way around . Then I should just jump to a basic autocad type program. Being able to rearrange sheets from the video I saw on the sneak peak is pretty basic and should have been there all along. 

 

Just a six shooters thoughts.

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3 hours ago, dshall said:

 

Joey's stair is such a mess,  I am not sure if I could recreate the mess he has.  But I bet I could come up with my own mess.  I agree with Joey,  stairs are not easy to work with.  However I will not abandon the program ....  if I did,  I would probably be jumping into another programs mess.

 

I wish CA would post pictures of all the different stair configurations they can build,  (without a huge workaround),  and then show us how they did it via a video.  

 

Here is a question......  how many CA vids have you seen that show how to build the many different stair configurations?  

 

Let me be specific,  see attached pic.......  95% of my stairs look like this.....  a handrail on a short framed pony wall........  I can do this..... but it ain't easy.  It  would be super if CA wold do a video on how THEY WOULD TO IT,  I have already done a video on how I do it  (not easy).  And here is the kicker.....  if CA can build it,  can they control the height of that pony wall above stair nosing easily?  When we build these things what must be kept in mind is can we control all parameters of the build.

 

 

423_2Axxys.jpg

 

 

 

Every single track builder here uses these knee-wall stair cases, and some custom. I countless times posted suggestion to support knee-walls, and please don't tell me that the only way to make these in chief is to use ramps.   Also autocad callouts <HERE> is a must for any serious software. Including the DETAIL callouts. Same applicable gable pediments. One should be able to attach symbol under a gable without having to redraw it every single time using psolids. 

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15 minutes ago, dssharp said:

I'm waiting for simple callout changes with arrows and a foot attached .

I always wondered why that wasn't in the program from the very first version. Been suggested a lot but never reaches priority one. It's not a deal breaker for me and seems so easy to implement and makes the software look amateurish IMO. 

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2 hours ago, dssharp said:

Things are speeding up in the industry again .

 

I agree.

 

I'm on the Chief band-wagon for now, but I dont hold a lot of hope Chief is going to keep up with industry leaders.  If you really examine how fast everyone else is moving its not looking great for Chief which still has such an archaic feel to certain tools and VERY clumsy and cluttered IU.  Its driving be crazy to enter a Dbx for every modification.

 

Archicad, Revit, AllPlan, and Vectorworks seem to have 2-3x the feature upgrades year over year that Chief has and are much more impressive in scope.  Chief still has some residential specific tools that make it appealing for me, and am resolved to stick it out until X10.  I ended up getting 4 new licenses this year so am committed for the moment.

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Like every version so far, Chief will give us things we love, and things we are disappointed with, and they will be different for everybody. There probably will be a public beta before the final release for everyone who is on SSA (at least they've done that in the past), so you can all make up your own minds. I think you need to look at overall productivity, rather than whether they gave you the stair features or the callouts you really, really wanted, and see whether another program will be any faster for the type of work you do. Some things will always be more annoying in one program vs. another. ArchiCAD, for example, can do just about anything, but there are so many variables and parameters to adjust, that the added complexity may not be worth the benefits. You might spend an hour more in Chief for the stairs you want than you would have in ArchiCAD, but if you then are spending 3 hours twiddling with various other settings in ArchiCAD, are you really ahead? If you really need canted walls, though, you might not have many choices. 

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Yes, the video is a bit underwhelming, but I'm hoping there is more meat-on-the-bone for this x9 release that will see soon.

 

I agree with Joey on the stair tool, it is so close to being great.  

 

It is clear that lots of work has gone into the kitchen cabinet features, and these tools are already impressive for demos. HOWEVER, 90% of my clients go to a kitchen designer that uses 20/20 or some other dedicated program for their custom kitchen, and so of late I'm just drawing basic polylines for blocking out cabinets in plan and elevation. 

 

 

 

 

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This is why I now use Chiefarchitect...

 

I absolutely love stairs in Chief now. 

I like it! I like it! (a la Yosemite Sam)

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I still haven't seen anyone post a comprehensive list of what's wrong with Chief's Stairs.  I know that it's not perfect - I have my own list of things I want CA to do with it and I've made those requests to CA.  What everyone needs to do is make specific requests in the Suggestions Forum as well as sending those to suggestions@chiefarchitect.com

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56 minutes ago, michaelgia said:

This is why I now use Chiefarchitect...

I absolutely love stairs in Chief now. 

I like it! I like it! (a la Yosemite Sam)

Point well taken. I've watched a couple of those videos and the complexity is staggering. What I haven't seen is how hand rails and other variables are handled. I would imagine the flexibility is superb but the complexity as in all of ArchiCad would literally take me years to understand and to create a stair with handrails that behave the way I want them to could take all my free business time leaving no time for design or creating ConDocs.

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