BenPalmer

Quick follow up on this:

1. I appreciate everyone's comments and suggestions.  Your time is much appreciated. 
2. It appears that update 23.2.0.55 has fixed the thick wall connection issues.  I appreciate Chief Architect taking care of this.  While I wish it didn't take a year, multiple reports/requests to tech support and this thread, I am still grateful it appears to be resolved.

Thank you again!

Still no fix for this in the latest update.  That lack of Chief's support is extremely disappointing.  If I could give Chief's support a ranking, it would get 1 star.   I just looked at the 12 tickets I have done over the last 20+ years, and all but one item had an answer something like:  I'll pass that on, or sorry for your frustration, but we are unable to fix it, or here is a workaround you can try, that didn't help, etc.

Maybe I'm asking too much?  Not sure why I'm paying for SSA...sheesh....certainly no Assurance ... aka Priority Tech Support (maybe that just means speed and not service?)   

(ok, done venting - for now)

On 6/26/2021 at 6:44 AM, MoeGia said:

 

I had this happen in X13 too.  They were pony walls.  I sent it in and was told to switch to see the upper wall connections (they were narrower walls) to use the 'connect wall' tool successfully.  It was a plan brought forward.  The walls were all connected so....

Thanks for the report @MoeGia appreciate you submitting a plan so they are seeing the issue from more than just me. 

21 hours ago, Renerabbitt said:

Just had the same problem present itself in an X-13 plan. Had to pull the thick wall back and reconnect any time that the adjacent walls were modified in any way.

@Renerabbitt was the issue with walls that have the typical wall layers?  Or are they non-layer walls like I use in the examples?  Trying to narrow it down. 

@glennw thanks!   I hadn't tried the partition wall on the walls sticking through, I'll give that a go, appreciate you looking at it and giving your feedback.

On the shower walls, I forgot that was still in the file, I also discovered, similar to your suggestion, that this can be fixed by making the upper glass wall NOT a partition wall as well.

Thanks again for the tip.

Thanks for the feedback and suggestions.  I'll try creating new walls and report back.  They are very likely walls that have perpetuated over previous versions, so definitely worth trying that out.  Some of these issues don't happen right away.  They usually appear during the design process, seems to especially happen when cabinets start getting added to the plans, but can't recreate or verify that.

But again, this worked just fine all the way until mid-X12, and then after an update started messing up (I have given Chief the exact update that caused it).  So this is a Chief created issue for sure, but if I can find a solution, that would be great since Chief doesn't seem willing to fix this or help me with it. 

3 hours ago, robdyck said:

Are you Jimmy Ray, I mean GordonRay as well? I was obviously responding to a different user. For all we know, this user may have their walls setup differently than yours. The point was that if a plan is posted...not yours, but GordonRay's, then we could investigate a bit further. And the comment about layers was simply a reminder that using wall layers, if possible, may help solve the problem. I never suggested or intimated that you or anyone else was doing something incorrectly. So unless you are BenPalmer and GordonRay, then only you posted a plan which identified the problem. GordonRay did not.

My mistake Robert, I should have clarified that I chatted with Gordon Ray offline and he uses the exact same method, so the plan I posted represents their situation as well.  Hope that clarifies.   

Curious if you have any input or suggestion on the plan I posted for investigation? 

@robdyck Please see original post...a plan demonstrating the issue was posted.  Also, while I realize chief prefers layers, I've been doing it without layers since Chief 8...been working fine for over 20 years until an X12, mid-cycle update broke it. 

@solver really appreciate you taking the time to look at this....you perfectly demonstrate how much effort it takes to correct these problems.  I intentionally left the walls broken so everyone could see the issue.  I go and fix them exactly as you do, but throughout the design process they just break again.  Room definitions are lost, time is taken to fix over and over and plans sometimes go out with wrong definitions...unprofessional.  I need them to stay connected!

I actually sent this plan into chief over a year ago and they acknowledged the problem and tell me it is on there list to get it taken care of.  In hopes that X13 would be the fix, it wasn't.  I sent it in again and got the same answer.  On our list.

It's especially frustrating when it worked before, and has always worked since I've been using the software (Chief 8) and there update broke it and they won't fix it.  I've been a long time use of Chief, former beta tester and rarely use support, and this is a big reason why I don't.  No purpose in using support if they won't support us.  Doesn't seem like it would be hard to fix something they broke??

Again, thanks for sharing the video so others can see it without needing to open the file.

about a year ago, with an X12 updates, thick wall connections (anything over 8" thick) became unstable...especially when 3 walls intersect.

I'm attaching an X12 plan that demonstrates several issues I'm having.  Curious if others see the same behavior.  notes within the plan describing the behaviors

I realize that layered walls will likely fix much of this but I do not like layered walls....they have a whole set of issues that I don't want to get into the pros and cons.  again, this worked fine before, but broke with an X12 update and is still broken in X13 beta.

Appreciate everyone's input.

wallConnectionProblems.plan

On 3/6/2021 at 6:48 AM, MarkMc said:

I ended up at AVBAdirect. I'd never heard of them but was checking all options around. They're worth a look.

I started with Desktop, Tower  Checked off a few filters, settled configuration, put in cart

Then talked with them, (Kyle) was  really helpful tweaking the configuration and checking availability of parts.The buying experience was excellent. I have no idea how support or any of the rest will be System delivers in a few weeks. (they do test em as they build em which is critical to me)

 

You can get higher level GPU and/or CPU for less than I spent; either from them or elsewhere (for comparison I configured an i9 , rtx 3080, liquid cooled, 32 GB, 1TB 970 plus, 1TB HDD- at $2400 & then an i7, 3060 for $1800). I looked at systems from $1800 to $4k, 5 custom builders and stock systems from 4 places.

I ended up with:  Define7 Compact, i7 10700k, EVGA 3070 XC3 ULTRA GAMING, MSI Meg Z490 Ace, Noctua 15, Grizzly Kryonaut, (4) Silent Wings 3, 32GB 3200 Corsair, 1TB 970 Plus M2, 1TB 860 Evo SSD, BeQuiet 11-850w Gold, $3k delivered. Won't really know how I did until beta

@MarkMc curious how your experience was with AVA and what kind of delay there was on some of the components.

While I haven't had it happen to me personally, one of my employees has it happen to him once or twice a week in X12...never had it before for anyone on any computer or software version prior to this happening with X12 (20 years+).  We have backups and can get it back pretty quick, but an annoyance for sure.  We haven't reported it because we can't reproduce it...we haven't been able to find an action that causes it...seems to be random...for us anyway.  We'll consider some of the tips listed above and see if that helps.

My wall connections have been horrible since the new update...especially when i have thicker walls (12" or larger) meeting thinner walls (4" or so).

Constantly disconnecting and messing room definitions and giving the unconnected wall error...driving me nuts.

Anyone else having this?  Might need to go back to the previous version..except the dimensions in blocks issue in that version. Ugh.

Thanks Steve, I'll take a look at that on my next import...probably have one later today.  I'll report back.  Appreciate the input.

1 hour ago, wjmdes said:

Fairly certain this problem is occurring when I import Layer and Default Sets from my new template into older drawings. It does not allow me to change the Default Set at all until I save, close and reopen.  Until then it just says Active Defaults

Bill, I can confirm that is when I get the same behavior:  when importing default sets.

7 hours ago, Dermot said:

Actually, I think we should reset the system layer names automatically when you open a legacy plan.  Expecting people to remember to do this just seems like extra work regardless of where the button is.  Maybe we would need a preference though?  There is always someone that doesn't like automatic behavior...

1 hour ago, Christina_Girerd said:

This also makes me wonder if there are any other things that are recommended to do when converting legacy plans?  If so, maybe those would also be listed in the "This is a legacy plan..." alert dbx upon opening?  Each with a yes/no option.  And if there are multiple things to deal with, an option at the bottom to "Remind Me Later"  or something to that effect and then somewhere in a menu or whatever logical place, an option to "Update Legacy Plan" with those items listed for when the user wants to deal with it.

I only reset layer names in legacy plans that had number prefixes, so if there is a way to automate that, great. Which, I guess, demonstrates the need for preferences.  If we go down the automated road (which would be great) I agree, might as well tackle the entire process which includes importing: default sets, default settings, wall definitions, saved views, delete unused layers by choice, not automatic, etc.

Yeah, I feel a little bit like Michael on this one.  It's a little bit annoying to adjust my work flow in the name of 'let's change it so people don't make mistakes and alleviate some support calls.'  While, I can and will adjust, and like/appreciate the reminder and suggestion for the hot key, it does take time to change my habits and search the new way (since it isn't mentioned anywhere besides the help file).

I also realize I am in the minority when it comes to the use of 'reset layer names'...most people probably don't even know what it is or what it's purpose is.  I use it quite a bit, so please don't ever eliminate this, like the removal of support for bringing forward legacy files without keeping X8 around 'forever' (i realize i will likely need to eventually go through and bring all legacy files forward...perhaps a batch conversion tool could be created?).  I also don't see that I would ever use the new 'delete unused layers' for the reasons mentioned.  However, I can see some use cases such as emailing plan files to some builders that would easily get confused with all the extra layers (this is rare, as I maybe send a Chief file once every few years...don't like to let that out of my office, so I dumb it down before I send it)

What would be helpful is some kind of list of changes to existing work flow ('power user changes'?) and how to quickly adjust to get working again with the least amount of down time.  Similar to Dermot's post on the paste in place change, that was super helpful.  This would sure save some time for those of us that are not beta testing and are doing a hard transition from X11 to X12.

While the new way is fine and acceptable, my frustration is where the button is placed 'spatially'.  I, like most of us, work on Chief, 8+ hours a day designing...lots, and lots of muscle memory on icon location...the new paste Hold is placed right where the 'point to point' used to be, and so when I need point to point, I inadvertently click the new paste hold position...and likewise for the reflect moving down another slot...while I'll adjust, it is a frustrating adjustment...would rather have it moved down after those items which I use way more then the paste hold.  I think this is a 'miss' on the design.   OR give us control over the customization of these sub icons.

This is more of an FYI to help anyone that brings old plans forward, to help save some frustration.

I bring forward lots of old plans...been using Chief Architect since 1999 and have a huge library of plans that I routinely bring forward and modify.  I have version 9.5x still on my computer and keep X8 for conversion of these old plans.  One really helpful tool is 'reset names' within the 'active layer display options' window.  In X12, that option is no longer in that window, which is sad...but, using the help file, realized it has been moved to the 'Default Sets' (formerly 'Annotation Sets'), under 'Layers' -> Define...  I don't understand why it got removed from the window and I miss the quick button that used to be there, and don't like the extra steps, but at least the option is still there. 

Hope that helps someone.  Or if someone has a better tip/way, I'm all ears.

Based on the lack of comments, I'm either in the minority or not many are using X12 yet...?.

As a follow up, I noticed in X11 and X12 LAYOUTS, the "Drawing Sheets..." is the default setting, which makes sense based on how printing is done in Layouts.  However, the change is in the plan file.  X12 change to 'drawing sheet', and X11 is set to 'current view' which I think should be the default for plan files vs layout files.  Curious how others feel about this or if it is even noticed.  I print easily 10+ pdf files per day for different customer drafts to review, so I come across this a lot.

Print Source in X12 now defaults to "Drawing Sheet:..." vs X11 that defaulted to "Current View".  Most of my printing uses "Current View" and now have to click to change that every time I print...pain in the arse.. (sending drafts to clients).  Is there a way to change it back, set defaults somewhere, or best of both worlds would be to have Chief remember the last use and that will set it to what most people use...assuming it was changed intentionally?

Thanks.

Great thread!  Appreciate everyone's input.

55 minutes ago, Chief_QA said:

The 21.3.1.1 update is now live.

Fantastic, you guys rock!  Great timing, needed to jump back on a project to get it done before the weekend.  Thanks!!

3 hours ago, Evolution said:

Got the notice yesterday when I opened X11 for the first time, but didn't not update until we hear that it has been fixed

Good call, i think the bug is bad enough that they should pull the update completely until it is fixed.

9 minutes ago, Evolution said:

Ben, the update is not automatic correct?  We should get a message telling us we aren't using the most up-to-date version of CA, and not just auto install correct? That's the way past updates have been issued.

To clarify, there is not an updated patch yet, I should have worded that as 'thanks for informing us that you are aware and working on it'.

When the update does come out, the fastest way to get it is to go to the help menu and follow the links and download and install (not automatically installed). The software will eventually notify us of an update, but it isn't always right away, so the help menu gets you there faster.

Hopefully they notify us on this thread when it is out so that we get an email notification of such and install it before we are notified.

Hope that helps.